A Centurion glorified God and called Jesus, ‘A Man’ yet Trinitarians believe Jesus is Almighty God

[Soapy]

The Centurion rightly gives God the glory and also states correctly that Jesus was a righteous man (Luke 23:47)

How is it that some people who say they are followers of Christ justify claiming Jesus was God almighty yet this same ‘god’ of theirs is shown to die in the manner in outlined the Old Testament reiterated later by angels:

• “The Son of Man must be delivered over to the hands of sinners, be crucified and on the third day be raised again.’ “ (Luke 24:7)

Some people say there were two people called ‘Jesus’. One was God, and the other was a man born of Mary. The one that died was the one born of Mary - the other ‘Jesus’ did not die.

Yet, others say both persons were the one Jesus. They say that Jesus was GOD and Jesus was man. But if Jesus is God, how did he die? And how was he committing his spirit TO GOD as he died… commuting his spirit TO HIMSELF?:

• “Jesus called out with a loud voice, “Father, into your hands I commit my spirit.” When he had said this, he breathed his last.” (John 23:46)

 

[Kenny]

The Centurion rightly gives God the glory and also states correctly that Jesus was a righteous man (Luke 23:47)

How is it that some people who say they are followers of Christ justify claiming Jesus was God almighty yet this same ‘god’ of theirs is shown to die in the manner in outlined the Old Testament reiterated later by angels:

• “The Son of Man must be delivered over to the hands of sinners, be crucified and on the third day be raised again.’ “ (Luke 24:7)

Some people say there were two people called ‘Jesus’. One was God, and the other was a man born of Mary. The one that died was the one born of Mary - the other ‘Jesus’ did not die.

Yet, others say both persons were the one Jesus. They say that Jesus was GOD and Jesus was man. But if Jesus is God, how did he die? And how was he committing his spirit TO GOD as he died… commuting his spirit TO HIMSELF?:

• “Jesus called out with a loud voice, “Father, into your hands I commit my spirit.” When he had said this, he breathed his last.” (John 23:46)

I'm not quite sure what you are saying here. A Centurion (who has no knowledge of Hebraic prophecies) recognizes that Jesus was righteous. I don't think that has anything to do with who Jesus was and his purpose for being on earth.

One could say that each person you mentioned simply saw a different aspect of the life and purpose of Jesus.

And are you saying that you understand everything about who God is and His capacity?

 

[Brian2]

The Centurion rightly gives God the glory and also states correctly that Jesus was a righteous man (Luke 23:47)

How is it that some people who say they are followers of Christ justify claiming Jesus was God almighty yet this same ‘god’ of theirs is shown to die in the manner in outlined the Old Testament reiterated later by angels:

• “The Son of Man must be delivered over to the hands of sinners, be crucified and on the third day be raised again.’ “ (Luke 24:7)

Some people say there were two people called ‘Jesus’. One was God, and the other was a man born of Mary. The one that died was the one born of Mary - the other ‘Jesus’ did not die.

Yet, others say both persons were the one Jesus. They say that Jesus was GOD and Jesus was man. But if Jesus is God, how did he die? And how was he committing his spirit TO GOD as he died… commuting his spirit TO HIMSELF?:

• “Jesus called out with a loud voice, “Father, into your hands I commit my spirit.” When he had said this, he breathed his last.” (John 23:46)

Jesus knew that if someone was to kill our body, our soul would not be killed but would still be alive. (Matt 10:28)

 

[Soapy]

I'm not quite sure what you are saying here. A Centurion (who has no knowledge of Hebraic prophecies) recognizes that Jesus was righteous. I don't think that has anything to do with who Jesus was and his purpose for being on earth.

One could say that each person you mentioned simply saw a different aspect of the life and purpose of Jesus.

And are you saying that you understand everything about who God is and His capacity?

I understand what the scriptures says.

It is stated that the Centurion praised God. What are we to say against that? That Centurion cannot be a Christian? I think there are verses that counted that argument!

But how are you not answering the question asked in the O.P. but only distracting away from it - are you afraid?

Leg me see the answers to the thread topic instead of casting aspersions!!

 

[Soapy]

Jesus knew that if someone was to kill our body, our soul would not be killed but would still be alive. (Matt 10:28)

Then why did he sweat blood the night before in foreseeing what was to happen to him?

And, in any case, the Soul is not ALIVE. It is DORMANT… Inactive, Latent.

The soul of Adam was not ALIVE before the spirit of him was put into his body:

• ‘And the man BECAME A LIVING SOUL’

‘Not living’ does not mean ‘Dead’.

‘Dormant’ is neither living nor dead!

‘Latent’ means ‘Existing but concealed or hidden, not revealed, not currently accessible for use.

‘Dead’ in the body is a human term since we have no access to a dormant spirit of a passed one. It is Jesus who has the power GRANTED TO HIM BY GOD to resurrect a dormant Soul:

• “For as the Father has life in himself, so he has granted the Son also to have life in himself.” (John 5:26)
• “After Jesus said this, he looked toward heaven and prayed: “Father, the hour has come. Glorify your Son, that your Son may glorify you. For you granted him authority over all people that he might give eternal life to all those you have given him.“ (John 17:1-2)

It seems the Twisted And Terrible Trinitarian Trait To You (TATTTTY) is manifested so strongly in you that you will do anything to try to uphold it. It is clear that what you are saying is not harmonious with true scriptures.

 

[Kenny]

I understand what the scriptures says.

It is stated that the Centurion praised God. What are we to say against that? That Centurion cannot be a Christian? I think there are verses that counted that argument!

Not really. There were no "Christians" until the resurrection.

 

[Soapy]

Not really. There were no "Christians" until the resurrection.

Ah didums, KenS. You know what I’m saying and did you to make such a pointless point shows you do not really have anything to say.

‘Christian’ means ‘Follower of Christ’. If a person became a follower of Christ before Jesus’ resurrection then how does that claim against them being a ‘Follower of Christ’ before the resurrection.

Yes, the NAME (title) came after … but how many people say ‘Jesus Christ was born on Christmas Day’ when:

1. The child was named AFTER he was born
2. He BECAME Christ after being baptised with God’s Holy Spirit
3. There was no ‘Christmas Day’ when the child was born

Ha! Caught in your own trap, eh KenS?

 

[Kenny]

Ah didums, KenS. You know what I’m saying and did you to make such a pointless point shows you do not really have anything to say.

‘Christian’ means ‘Follower of Christ’. If a person became a follower of Christ before Jesus’ resurrection then how does that claim against them being a ‘Follower of Christ’ before the resurrection.

Yes, the NAME (title) came after … but how many people say ‘Jesus Christ was born on Christmas Day’ when:

1. The child was named AFTER he was born
2. He BECAME Christ after being baptised with God’s Holy Spirit
3. There was no ‘Christmas Day’ when the child was born

Ha! Caught in your own trap, eh KenS?

I'm not sure you are making any sense here.

You said that the Centurion was a Christian. The word "Christian" didn't come into being until years later.

All the Centurion did was acknowledge that Jesus was righteous.

So... exactly what is your point? (other than rehashing the Godhead again)

 

[Brian2]

Then why did he sweat blood the night before in foreseeing what was to happen to him?

Because He was a man who did not want to be tortured to death if it was possible to avoid it.

And, in any case, the Soul is not ALIVE. It is DORMANT… Inactive, Latent.

The soul of Adam was not ALIVE before the spirit of him was put into his body:

• ‘And the man BECAME A LIVING SOUL’

‘Not living’ does not mean ‘Dead’.

‘Dormant’ is neither living nor dead!

‘Latent’ means ‘Existing but concealed or hidden, not revealed, not currently accessible for use.

‘Dead’ in the body is a human term since we have no access to a dormant spirit of a passed one. It is Jesus who has the power GRANTED TO HIM BY GOD to resurrect a dormant Soul:

• “For as the Father has life in himself, so he has granted the Son also to have life in himself.” (John 5:26)
• “After Jesus said this, he looked toward heaven and prayed: “Father, the hour has come. Glorify your Son, that your Son may glorify you. For you granted him authority over all people that he might give eternal life to all those you have given him.“ (John 17:1-2)

It seems the Twisted And Terrible Trinitarian Trait To You (TATTTTY) is manifested so strongly in you that you will do anything to try to uphold it. It is clear that what you are saying is not harmonious with true scriptures.

The breathe of life that God breathed into Adam was a life force, a spirit that made the body alive and was the life of the body that experienced the world through the body. The combination of spirit and body became the living soul. The soul is the totality of the man. When our body dies the spirit leaves the body and is then the totality of the man, the soul, and is more than just a life force but carries the essence of the man in it.
When the body dies the soul does not die. Dormant, asleep, whatever way you want to put it, the soul is not killed at the death of the body and that implies that the soul is alive after the death of the body and was alive when the body was alive of course. It is just the body that dies unless God wants to destroy, kill, both body and soul in Gehenna.
Matt 10:28 Do not be afraid of those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul. Instead, fear the One who can destroy both soul and body in Gehenna.

 

[paarsurrey]

The Centurion rightly gives God the glory and also states correctly that Jesus was a righteous man (Luke 23:47)

How is it that some people who say they are followers of Christ justify claiming Jesus was God almighty yet this same ‘god’ of theirs is shown to die in the manner in outlined the Old Testament reiterated later by angels:

• “The Son of Man must be delivered over to the hands of sinners, be crucified and on the third day be raised again.’ “ (Luke 24:7)

Some people say there were two people called ‘Jesus’. One was God, and the other was a man born of Mary. The one that died was the one born of Mary - the other ‘Jesus’ did not die.

Yet, others say both persons were the one Jesus. They say that Jesus was GOD and Jesus was man. But if Jesus is God, how did he die? And how was he committing his spirit TO GOD as he died… commuting his spirit TO HIMSELF?:

• “Jesus called out with a loud voice, “Father, into your hands I commit my spirit.” When he had said this, he breathed his last.” (John 23:46)

" Luke 23:47, Luke 24:7, Matt 27:54 ( referenced in post #12 ), "

Just to inform the participants in this thread that none of the verses " Luke 23:47, Luke 24:7 , Matt 27:54 ( referenced in post #12, "* is from (Jesus) Yeshua- the Israelite Messiah, so kindly don't judge Yeshua because of these verses, please. Right?
First the followers of Yeshua must quote , for a meaningful discussion/debate verse/verses from Yeshua, and then the discussion debate be within the purview of such verses, not the vice a versa, please, right?

Regards
_______________
*Holy Bible King James Version (Red Letter Edition)
The Roman Catholic Holy Bible with the words of Jesus in red.
World Messianic Bible

 

[Soapy]

Because He was a man who did not want to be tortured to death if it was possible to avoid it.



The breathe of life that God breathed into Adam was a life force, a spirit that made the body alive and was the life of the body that experienced the world through the body. The combination of spirit and body became the living soul. The soul is the totality of the man. When our body dies the spirit leaves the body and is then the totality of the man, the soul, and is more than just a life force but carries the essence of the man in it.
When the body dies the soul does not die. Dormant, asleep, whatever way you want to put it, the soul is not killed at the death of the body and that implies that the soul is alive after the death of the body and was alive when the body was alive of course. It is just the body that dies unless God wants to destroy, kill, both body and soul in Gehenna.
Matt 10:28 Do not be afraid of those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul. Instead, fear the One who can destroy both soul and body in Gehenna.

Wow, Brian2, are you trying to teach me about the truth or just acknowledging that you finally learnt it…. Or… were you expecting me to say that you are wrong…? WRONG……..!

Everything you just said about Body, Spirit, and Soul is correct. All, that is, except the little sneaky part about ‘Being Killed’…. Naughty man, you are!!

There is not really a proper sense of what ‘Killed’ means to most human Being as opposed to ‘Died’ And it makes no sense to God. We use ‘Killed’ as a means of saying that trauma of some sort has been inflicted on a person, a Soul, such that the spirit is made to leave the body as the body is no longer functional in respect of the spirit that controls it. I know you will quibble but no one says (except in flippancy) that a computer is ‘Killed’ if it is hit with a hammer and it’s hardware no longer functions correctly, do they?

So, NO… The scriptures says the soul can be DESTROYED. Destroyed is different to being killed, and dying. Destroyed means the total destruction of both body and SPIRIT… the Spirit is DESTROYED thereby leaving NOTHING OF REMEMBRANCE OF THE INDIVIDUAL.

At death of a person, yes, they are NOT DESTROYED because their Spirit is only RESTING WITH GOD WHO GAVE IT - God, the Father of Spirits.

I think you know what you are writing and purposely decided to test me …. That’s fine - I like being rested but there are limits to tolerance of it!

 

[Soapy]

I'm not sure you are making any sense here.

You said that the Centurion was a Christian. The word "Christian" didn't come into being until years later.

All the Centurion did was acknowledge that Jesus was righteous.

So... exactly what is your point? (other than rehashing the Godhead again)

I’m not sure what you are about either. Acknowledging Jesus as a righteous man IS A RIGHTEOUS DEED:

• “When the centurion and those with him who were guarding Jesus saw the earthquake and all that had happened, they were terrified, and exclaimed, “Surely he was the Son of God!”(Matt 27:54)
• “Whoever acknowledges me before others, I will also acknowledge before my Father in heaven.” (Matt 10:32)

You are just trying to get out of being caught out… doesn’t work! You are just embarrassed - do you think I don’t know this type of distraction posting?

 

[Muffled]

I believe the centurion was judging by appearances.

 

[Muffled]

Not really. There were no "Christians" until the resurrection.

I believe if one just focuses on a belief in Jesus a Messiah instead of what is essentially a Christian then the woman at the well in Samaria was the first Christian.

 

[Muffled]

" Luke 23:47, Luke 24:7, Matt 27:54 ( referenced in post #12 ), "

Just to inform the participants in this thread that none of the verses " Luke 23:47, Luke 24:7 , Matt 27:54 ( referenced in post #12, "* is from (Jesus) Yeshua- the Israelite Messiah, so kindly don't judge Yeshua because of these verses, please. Right?
First the followers of Yeshua must quote , for a meaningful discussion/debate verse/verses from Yeshua, and then the discussion debate be within the purview of such verses, not the vice a versa, please, right?

Regards
_______________
*Holy Bible King James Version (Red Letter Edition)
The Roman Catholic Holy Bible with the words of Jesus in red.
World Messianic Bible

I believe I do not accept your criteria for eliminating scripture. I would think on that basis one would have to eliminate half the Qu'ran because the angel wasn't quoted and Mohammed never said that the rest was from God.

 

[Kenny]

I believe if one just focuses on a belief in Jesus a Messiah instead of what is essentially a Christian then the woman at the well in Samaria was the first Christian.

Yes... if we were to focus on that. I guess I was speaking technically. I also suppose that even before the woman at the well, even the disciples would qualify.
John 1:45
Philip findeth Nathanael, and saith unto him, We have found him, of whom Moses in the law, and the prophets, did write, Jesus of Nazareth, the son of Joseph.

 

[metis]

Yes... if we were to focus on that. I guess I was speaking technically. I also suppose that even before the woman at the well, even the disciples would qualify.
John 1:45
Philip findeth Nathanael, and saith unto him, We have found him, of whom Moses in the law, and the prophets, did write, Jesus of Nazareth, the son of Joseph.

I believe that Jesus was a Jew who preached reform and probably planned on remaining in his reformed Judaism. However, he attracted only limited support amongst Jews, and most of the converts were largely Gentiles in the latter half of the 1st century.

IMO, that's likely why there is no specific label mentioned in the early Church until later.

BTW, please be careful later this week as the storm closes in. After all, who would I pick on without you here???

 

[Soapy]

Yes... if we were to focus on that. I guess I was speaking technically. I also suppose that even before the woman at the well, even the disciples would qualify.
John 1:45
Philip findeth Nathanael, and saith unto him, We have found him, of whom Moses in the law, and the prophets, did write, Jesus of Nazareth, the son of Joseph.

Interesting… Nathaniel didn’t say that ‘We have found God’… in fa t no one ever said of Jesus that they had found or seen God! Yet we are to believe that of all the many people who believe on the man, Jesus Christ, ‘He whom Moses and the prophets spoke of’, Thomas is the only person ever who ‘Saw HIS GOD’!?

 

[paarsurrey]

" Luke 23:47, Luke 24:7, Matt 27:54 ( referenced in post #12 ), "

Just to inform the participants in this thread that none of the verses " Luke 23:47, Luke 24:7 , Matt 27:54 ( referenced in post #12, "* is from (Jesus) Yeshua- the Israelite Messiah, so kindly don't judge Yeshua because of these verses, please. Right?
First the followers of Yeshua must quote , for a meaningful discussion/debate verse/verses from Yeshua, and then the discussion debate be within the purview of such verses, not the vice a versa, please, right?
_______________
*Holy Bible King James Version (Red Letter Edition)
The Roman Catholic Holy Bible with the words of Jesus in red.
World Messianic Bible

"First the followers of Yeshua must quote , for a meaningful discussion/debate verse/verses from Yeshua "
Else, it would mean that one is not following Yeshua- the Israelite Messiah but if following one's own whims, please, right?

Regards

 

[Kenny]

I believe that Jesus was a Jew who preached reform and probably planned on remaining in his reformed Judaism. However, he attracted only limited support amongst Jews, and most of the converts were largely Gentiles in the latter half of the 1st century.

IMO, that's likely why there is no specific label mentioned in the early Church until later.

BTW, please be careful later this week as the storm closes in. After all, who would I pick on without you here???

Thanks for your prayers... praying for those in west Florida (Have family in the Tampa area)

it is true... the label came later.