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  1. Oeste

    Jesus is not God

    Where does God say "Jesus Words Alone!"??? The voice from the cloud IS NOT JESUS TALKING! So, if its "Jesus Words Alone!" why on earth (or heaven) are you quoting anyone else? Your red letter argument immediately contradicts itself. Please show us where Jesus claims we are to listen to his...
  2. Oeste

    Jesus is not God

    Excellent @walt! As Christians we should accept what Jesus says. But rather than simply "proof-text", let's add one more verse with a question. Harmonization! This is even better!! God did not send but one prophet, He sent several, and we should not silence one prophet in favor of another...
  3. Oeste

    Jesus is not God

    Hi @Eli G: The Baha'is believe they are destined to unite the world under a single, one world religion (their own) through a blending of Christianity, Judaism, Islam and Buddhism. Their temples are generally nine-sided, surrounded by nine pathways because they consider the number 9 a symbol of...
  4. Oeste

    Jesus is not God

    It's hard to keep up with you @Trailblazer. Now Jesus is human again when before he was only part human. Of course he is. "In him dwelleth the fullness of the godhead bodily." (Col 2:9) Strawman. Mormons may believe this, but orthodox Christians do not. Jesus pre-existed as God prior to...
  5. Oeste

    Jesus is not God

    For the same reasons we defend "theocracy", "Christology", and "eschatology". The words are not there, but the concepts are. "Trinity" is an English word, and you will never find English words in our bible (unless it's been translated to English*). In fact, for the exact same reasons, you will...
  6. Oeste

    Jesus is not God

    I'm not seeing Jesus was "told" to do anything of the sort. Can you cite a verse? To the contrary, scripture tells us Jesus is simply doing what He, the Father, and the Spirit have agreed to do.
  7. Oeste

    Jesus is not God

    He is fully human. Why? Because he was borne by Mary He is fully God. Why? Because the Father begat him. So yes, Jesus is a man who has a both a human and Divine nature. He is fully God because "in the beginning" he already was. "In the beginning was the Word..." He is also Divine because...
  8. Oeste

    Jesus is not God

    Like @jimb, I'm not sure of your question. What do you mean by "Who is not any of a Trinity?" Again, I think your questions have been answered, but I haven't forgotten you have not answered mine. Do you believe Jesus had a dual nature or no? If not, then what happened to Michael the...
  9. Oeste

    Jesus is not God

    Of course he said that. As @cataway correctly pointed out: John 14:6 New International Version 6 Jesus answered, “I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me." It's a blanket statement. He didn't say "From this day forward, I am the truth...." Of...
  10. Oeste

    Jesus is not God

    You've already told us Jesus was only PART man. Trailblazer said: Jesus was PART God and PART man since he has a human nature and a divine nature. Anyone who is only PART man is simply NOT human, he is only PART human, and since Adam was FULLY human, a PART human cannot possibly be the 2nd...
  11. Oeste

    Jesus is not God

    Please just use Jesus words and explain: Jesus said to throw scripture under the bus? The apostles are not to be believed? No other words but the words of Jesus are inspired? I not seeing any consistency in your assertion @walt. You have one standard for the Trinity doctrine, and another for...
  12. Oeste

    Jesus is not God

    Agreed! You have a very confusing Jesus, @Trailblazer, and many of the terms you use to describe him appear at serious odds with each other. Of course no one is going to convince the other, but the forum allows us to discuss our perspectives. I think the discussion I had with you was...
  13. Oeste

    Jesus is not God

    Hello @walt, Exactly right @walt. Proof texting has been with us for ages. You're asking me to describe God, and you're right! It's much easier to describe the created gods of the pagans then it is to describe the Christian God. After all, we created the pagan gods and we should be able to...
  14. Oeste

    Jesus is not God

    ...continued Jesus preexisted his birth. He was always God in His preexistent state and so did not need to inherit anything. After all, He is the Son of God. After his birth and task as the Son of Man he asked the Father to restore the glory he once had before. Remember, this is not Jesus...
  15. Oeste

    Jesus is not God

    Hi Trailblazer!, It means he was both human and God. As the Son of Man he is fully human. As the Son of God, he is fully God. Where is this in scripture? Also, why would Jesus need to be "offspring" when he was already preexistent?? This statement contradicts your prior statement. You...
  16. Oeste

    Jesus is not God

    Not a problem, @walt. I learned long ago, from a rather prestigious Trinitarian theologian: “A text without a context is a pretext for a proof text.” Anyone can quote a Bible verse, out of context, and make a case for a particular view or doctrine. This is known as “proof texting”. He wasn't...
  17. Oeste

    Jesus is not God

    Hi Walt!, I respect your comments as well @walt. I like that you used the word "consistently" here which is why I bolded it. I think this is an important element to look for in any bible teaching. Jesus is God in the flesh. We can see flesh. Our ability to see God in the flesh makes God...
  18. Oeste

    Jesus is not God

    What do you mean by "....real answer to my question"?? I answered your prior questions and now you present me with a brand new question as if you asked it of me previously. This is the first time you asked me "What do we do with Jesus' God?" If you like, I can repost your questions and my...
  19. Oeste

    Jesus is not God

    Yes, which makes Jesus God. When a dog begets, he begets nothing more or less than a dog. When a man begets, he begets nothing more or less than a man. When God begets, he begets nothing more or less than God. Why? Because the begotten are no more or less in nature than their begetter...
  20. Oeste

    Jesus is not God

    Hi @Trailblazer, I have one more response but then I really, really need to go: If Jesus were simply the only begotten Son of the divine, I would agree with you, but he is the only begotten Son of God, which makes him God. The same rational that makes Son of Man, man, when logically and...
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