Ásatrú for beginners.

[Straw Dog]

But I have no intention of passing on that concept of "ancestral enemy" to my children. If I have any say in the matter, it dies with me. Let warts-and-all Rome remain admirable, and let no animosity exist between me, my family, and modern Italians for the sins of people who have been dead for 2000 years.

Yes, why hold grudges? I may not be a Christian, but I still understand forgiveness and letting go of the past.

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

I don't care that Heimdall is described as "whitest of the Gods". Idris Elba was absolutely PERFECT as the guardian of Asgard's gates. :yes:

Yeah, he's awesome. I love him.

I do wonder how literally that line is meant to be interpreted. It's very strange.

 

[Riverwolf]

I see. So 'race' makes even less sense in this context then. I can understand wanting to have an ethnic identity, but it's probably safer to assume that it's operating on a cultural rather than genetic level.

It should be cultural, anyway. In terms of genetics, the "blood" from pre-Christian Northern Europeans is so thin today that it basically doesn't matter. When I say I'm mostly Anglo-Irish, that itself means a LOT. Ireland is itself a melting pot of people from all over Europe, and having English descent means having Welsh, Scottish, Pictish, Anglo-Saxon(thus German and Danish), Norman, Norwegian, and Roman ancestry. To say nothing of whatever else may have popped into my "blood" over the centuries.

And just that's on my mother's side.

Which "Tribe" then, should I identify with? Well, certainly none of the ancient ones.

 

[Riverwolf]

Yeah, he's awesome. I love him.

I do wonder how literally that line is meant to be interpreted. It's very strange.

Who knows? It definitely wouldn't have had the same connotation that we use today.

Besides, that movie got everyone wrong. Thor's supposed to be a redhead, not blond, Sif is NOT a warrior-Goddess and actually IS blond (that being her primary identifying feature, in fact), Odin didn't lose his eye in battle and in lore is nowhere near that... understanding, and Frigga... actually, Frigga was perfect in every way. LOL

Oh, and Loki is ODIN'S blood-brother, not Thor's! :angel2: And I don't care 'cause those movies are awesome. And an absolutely terrible place to learn our Lore. LOL

 

[Straw Dog]

It should be cultural, anyway. In terms of genetics, the "blood" from pre-Christian Northern Europeans is so thin today that it basically doesn't matter. When I say I'm mostly Anglo-Irish, that itself means a LOT. Ireland is itself a melting pot of people from all over Europe, and having English descent means having Welsh, Scottish, Pictish, Anglo-Saxon(thus German and Danish), Norman, Norwegian, and Roman ancestry. To say nothing of whatever else may have popped into my "blood" over the centuries.

And just that's on my mother's side.

Which "Tribe" then, should I identify with? Well, certainly none of the ancient ones.

Yeah, it doesn't really make sense. It is just a cultural affinity. I'm also attracted to the ancient Chinese and I'm not Asian.

 

[Jainarayan]

Even from those who didn't mean to.

Once we start identifying with our "Tribe" in that regard, it becomes much, much easier to demonize an ancestral enemy. I saw that in myself, normally pluralist and somewhat universalist, when I started practicing Asatru and studying the history of pre-Christian Europe. I started demonizing all of Rome.

I caught this quickly, however, so I could limit my "ancestral enemy" just to Caesar, his militant descendents, and their Legions, instead of all Rome in general. Even then, I still have respect for them.

But I have no intention of passing on that concept of "ancestral enemy" to my children. If I have any say in the matter, it dies with me. Let warts-and-all Rome remain admirable, and let no animosity exist between me, my family, and modern Italians for the sins of people who have been dead for 2000 years.

Excellent points. My parents, being American-born children of Italian and Sicilian immigrants, attended the Italians-and-Irish-hate-each-other school of thought. I grew up with that but distanced myself from that long ago. I have no idea, nor do I care why the Italians and Irish disliked each other. My brother and s-i-l almost didn't get married (>50 years ago, of course) because both sets of parents were dead set against an Italian boy marrying an Irish girl. Huh?

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

Who knows? It definitely wouldn't have had the same connotation that we use today.

Besides, that movie got everyone wrong. Thor's supposed to be a redhead, not blond, Sif is NOT a warrior-Goddess and actually IS blond (that being her primary identifying feature, in fact), Odin didn't lose his eye in battle and in lore is nowhere near that... understanding, and Frigga... actually, Frigga was perfect in every way. LOL

Oh, and Loki is ODIN'S blood-brother, not Thor's! :angel2: And I don't care 'cause those movies are awesome. And an absolutely terrible place to learn our Lore. LOL

Lol. Yes, the movies are fun and all, but horrible when it comes to Lore. But it's Hollywood and comic books so you can't expect much out of it.

 

[Jainarayan]

I don't care that Heimdall is described as "whitest of the Gods". Idris Elba was absolutely PERFECT as the guardian of Asgard's gates. :yes:

They should hose him down, because he's hot as Muspelheim! I get the vapours. :faint: He comes in a close second to Chris Hunksworth, I mean Hemsworth.

 

[Riverwolf]

Excellent points. My parents, being American-born children of Italian and Sicilian immigrants, attended the Italians-and-Irish-hate-each-other school of thought. I grew up with that but distanced myself from that long ago. I have no idea, nor do I care why the Italians and Irish disliked each other. My brother and s-i-l almost didn't get married (>50 years ago, of course) because both sets of parents were dead set against an Italian boy marrying an Irish girl. Huh?

Huh. I had no idea that such thinking even existed.

At least the Irish-hate-the-English thing actually makes sense from a historical perspective.

Lol. Yes, the movies are fun and all, but horrible when it comes to Lore. But it's Hollywood and comic books so you can't expect much out of it.

Yeah, neither have historically been terribly great at accurately depicting Lore.

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

They should hose him down, because he's hot as Muspelheim! I get the vapours. :faint: He comes in a close second to Chris Hunksworth, I mean Hemsworth.

Idris is a sexy man, yes.

 

[Jainarayan]

Who knows? It definitely wouldn't have had the same connotation that we use today.

Besides, that movie got everyone wrong. Thor's supposed to be a redhead, not blond, Sif is NOT a warrior-Goddess and actually IS blond (that being her primary identifying feature, in fact), Odin didn't lose his eye in battle and in lore is nowhere near that... understanding, and Frigga... actually, Frigga was perfect in every way. LOL

Oh, and Loki is ODIN'S blood-brother, not Thor's! :angel2: And I don't care 'cause those movies are awesome. And an absolutely terrible place to learn our Lore. LOL

The pronunciation of names was off too, but meh, it was lots of eye candy.

I want to see the third Thor movie pair up Thor and Hercules. In the comics they got off to a really bad start but became fast friends. If they cast Kellan Lutz as Herc... ye gods! I could die a happy man (that sort of pairing makes me glad to be gay :biglaugh. Chris is 6'3", Kellan is 6'1"... I can live with that.

 

[Jainarayan]

Huh. I had no idea that such thinking even existed.

Disgusting, isn't it? And my s-i-l's father was a well educated treasury agent. We are from Newark NJ where it was a really prevalent attitude.

 

[beenherebeforeagain]

Disgusting, isn't it? And my s-i-l's father was a well educated treasury agent. We are from Newark NJ where it was a really prevalent attitude.

I'm not sure, but it may have had something to do with Catholicism (as it seems like Catholics of any nationality in Europe don't get along well with Catholics from any other randomly selected nationality...at least it seemed that way where I grew up.)

It may also have something to do with who came immigrating into whose neighborhoods, and whose gangs tried to move in on the territory of the others'. But I am basing that only on a few statements by friends growing up, etc., and a very vague understanding of the history of organized crime in the US. So I might be wrong.

 

[Jainarayan]

Well, those are certainly plausible explanations.

 

[Sees]

I pretty much do good beer, mead, or other alcohol for Gods, ancestors, land spirits, house spirits, etc. and also cookies and milk. A small shrine/home for house spirit/s and cookies (or other treats) and milk as offerings is very traditional for continental flavors of Ásatrú/Heathenry. I give parts of fruits and veggies regularly when using them in recipes by simply tossing them in a part of the yard and saying a small, heartfelt prayer thanking/asking/offering friendship and any blessings for family and friends (which I consider "good" spirits of any rank or persuasion also as)

I think the primary thing for beginning Ásatrúar is to really get your mind around the concepts of plurality/multiplicity and connection, connectedness, wholeness, holistic-ness - then approach lore and practices with this mind. Think it, do it, breath it, live it. It doesn't have to be perfect or just right, slow transformation and evolution. Mama Nature, the Gods, ancestors, and so on, are beating in your heart and pumping through the veins - they will guide. Personal inspiration/UPG can be amazingly, bafflingly similar because this is real and it does take place.

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

I pretty much do good beer, mead, or other alcohol for Gods, ancestors, land spirits, house spirits, etc. and also cookies and milk. A small shrine/home for house spirit/s and cookies (or other treats) and milk as offerings is very traditional for continental flavors of Ásatrú/Heathenry. I give parts of fruits and veggies regularly when using them in recipes by simply tossing them in a part of the yard and saying a small, heartfelt prayer thanking/asking/offering friendship and any blessings for family and friends (which I consider "good" spirits of any rank or persuasion also as)

I think the primary thing for beginning Ásatrúar is to really get your mind around the concepts of plurality/multiplicity and connection, connectedness, wholeness, holistic-ness - then approach lore and practices with this mind. Think it, do it, breath it, live it. It doesn't have to be perfect or just right, slow transformation and evolution. Mama Nature, the Gods, ancestors, and so on, are beating in your heart and pumping through the veins - they will guide. Personal inspiration/UPG can be amazingly, bafflingly similar because this is real and it does take place.

Great advice! One question, though. What do you do with offerings like milk and cookies? I mean, you can't just throw them outside or leave them lying about.

That's where I get so confused. Lol.

 

[Sees]

Great advice! One question, though. What do you do with offerings like milk and cookies? I mean, you can't just throw them outside or leave them lying about.

That's where I get so confused. Lol.

I leave them for a night, or a day and two nights, then leave/pour at the base of a tree.

Don't eat/drink them like we do on Christmas Eve

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

I leave them for a night, or a day and two nights, then leave/pour at the base of a tree.

Don't eat/drink them like we do on Christmas Eve

Oh. Well, that's simple. I'm pretty OCD about those sorts of things. I put a lot of pressure on myself.

 

[Sees]

Oh. Well, that's simple. I'm pretty OCD about those sorts of things. I put a lot of pressure on myself.

Just depends on what you have going on and stuff. They know we get busy and we know they are busy You may get a feeling...one hour, one night, two, etc. Some people say their house spirit just wants a clean house so they complete things a bit quicker. lol

With any type of offering or ritual practice you have to feel it out or do things you feel best/comfortable. Some like to sit or stand in silence for a while after an offering by a tree, a lake, in the garden, and some just go on to the next part of the day. Stuff like this, to my mind, has to be subjective. It's a right for you thing. There is always a uniqueness and individuality, family traditions, tribe/clan traditions, kindred, you know. Unique relationships and paths for us all even though we all fall under the umbrella of Ásatrú/Heathenry or even greater family of Euro traditions or Paganism as a whole.

I think using more specific structure or guidelines from others can be a good starting point for sure. It may fit so well or perfectly to become your very own in every sense.

 

[amorphous_constellation]

Yes, we're the ones adopting that view. "Generic white guy" is a bad joke anyway. American style hyper-individualism has left many of us feeling isolated and disconnected from our cultural heritage. Re-discovering and celebrating it may help us to heal our fragmented identities.

See, I think that's part of the problem - thinking that European heritage is "generic" and "nothing special". I think that's sad, and a I'm brown guy. I think everyone's heritage is wonderful and should be explored and celebrated. The peoples of the North are amazing and strong people. European descended people need to discover the beauty of their ancestry, imo.

And this is where the trail kind of leads off into places most people are probably afraid to discuss because they think it will devolve into some kind of racist territory or something. In actuality, if you are a good operator I'd argue that this is asinine and the opposite is actually true, if treated correctly perhaps it can lead us to a positive space of identity, explanation, and some kind of discovery of cultural foundations.

The primary problem is that for the Northern Europeans, out of everyone in the entire world, and I guess it is really their own fault, the slate was wiped the cleanest in terms of all cultural identity with the coming of Christianity, the great chalkboard eraser. I am not saying be angry, it is everyone's responsibility now to simply get over it. We don't have the benefits of the Greeks and Romans for example in knowing a fair deal about our past. There is nothing you can do about it at this point except reinvent a good deal of it, unless you can travel back in time to see what was really going on.

So now, we just have these brief shards of information describing who we were. Like or not it is pretty fragmented but hints at something extensive and grandiose, and indicates values diametrically opposed to much of the culture that would be unpacked from the Christianity boot disk. Such a pity I feel that gigabytes worth or cultural information that had been there such a long time had been erased... But anyway, I'm not writing this to whine. Actually I'd argue now that this is great opportunity to positively reinvent and rebuild this stuff. How good does a religion and culture that values nature and positive heritage sound in these modern times of consumerism and materialism, imperialism and convert or burn homogenization we live in! It sounds pretty good.

What has happened. We have been led on crusades, colonized the lands of others, lost all of our own native wisdom centuries in the making, and decided to worship death. How to do we return to this mystic way we had with constant mention of 'nature', of course sanitizing it from the human sacrifice or perennial war, and simple values and ways and wisdom lost. Nature was our guide and what we were meant to tend - our church and our home, we had no need for grandly designed buildings rising a thousand feet. Our culture was connected to our land, Guth forsake us if we would take it from anyone else and convert them! We do not build smokestacks to smother our divine sky nor pollute the holy nourishing sea with waste, nor the land with stinking trash. How wrong we were, everyday now in modern times we watch the World Tree weep as it is burned.