A choice between yourself and God.

[F1fan]

Faith in God requires we glorify God which would make us belittle who and what we are to the degree we have failed our duty to God. Recognizing God means you see his favor overflowing and that any good you attained, you see it as a favor from him more then a praise belonging to you. While any evil you attain, you see it belong to you because you did despite his help and mercy and overflowing favor.

Fine, believe what you want.

The Atheist on the other hand, he tends to not want to be at fault for not seeing God.

OK, now that you are dragging atheists into your dogma, all bets are off.

This is false. Atheists don't think any Gods exist. There is literally no Gods to see. So your your claim here is absurd.

Consequently, it must be God's fault and not evil on part of the Atheist. More over God being all powerful should make the world according to the desires of the Atheist. If he has not, and will not, he is evil.

Nothing we observe about reality suggests any Gods exist, nor is there any effects that we can believe is caused by Gods.

If God exists, the Atheist tells himself, then heaven would be the destiny they will enter, no matter. This while people who have faith in God are ever afraid of hell and losing their faith in God from sins.

Atheists don't think this way, you are misrepresenting them. It's better to ask questions that misrepresent atheists.

Oddly no one ever ends up in hell, because the only people who believe in a heaven and hell thinks they are going to heaven.

In short, the Atheist has chosen to glorify themselves, while the believers seek God's forgiveness and belittle themselves in themselves and glorify God's Majesty and Glory in themselves.

This misrepresents atheists as well. You are trying to judge and define atheists from YOUR dogma. Atheists don't use your dogma, so it's irrelevant.

 

[F1fan]

Choosing oneself over God is in my opinion the essence of sin.

The dilemma is that the self is deciding a God exists. And for the self to have the power and authority to decide a god exists, and describe what the God is, is assuming a power that exceeds the God. What is it that ordinary believers mean when they refer to their God? It is a set of words that describes a concept. The self uses their own brain to conceive of their God, thus the life God has comes from the mortal itself. We never see Gods coming forth expressing authority, we only see the middlemen for God trying to persuade us they speak for the absent God.

To my mind the sin is a person not allowing themselves to be aware of how they adopt and create their god within their mind, and then act as if this God exists outside their imagination.

 

[Lain]

The dilemma is that the self is deciding a God exists.

I don't think this dilemma exists because that isn't how persons work, as St. John the Apostle masterfully puts it: "we love, because He first loved us."

 

[F1fan]

I don't think this dilemma exists because that isn't how persons work, as St. John the Apostle masterfully puts it: "we love, because He first loved us."

Observations and the psychology of belief suggests otherwise.

Trying to assess religion with religious assumptions is always going to self-verify itself. That's self-deception.

 

[Lain]

Observations and the psychology of belief suggests otherwise.

All the observations and psychology of belief I know suggest that what I said is true.

 

[idea]

The True God doesn't want to leave us to ourselves so for us not to make idols of what has little, no value or negative value. Instead if we recognize it, we will be free of need of all things and others and he suffices his worshipers.

As for what is the true God, it's the one you get to know through the means has has appointed, mainly his image, name, and holy spirit; the guide of our time.

It's the one you get to know through clear proofs.

And I don't pick on Atheists. I've criticized everyone who doesn't rely on God and his rope for guidance, and follow whims of people without proofs.

Believers follow whims of people...

 

[Nimos]

The Atheist on the other hand, he tends to not want to be at fault for not seeing God. Consequently, it must be God's fault and not evil on part of the Atheist. More over God being all powerful should make the world according to the desires of the Atheist. If he has not, and will not, he is evil.

Think you might have misunderstood or misrepresented the atheists position a bit.

- As an atheist we do not think we are at fault for not seeing God, because we see no convincing evidence to believe one exist in the first place. We may make an argument, based on the assumption that if God exist, that it is not our fault for the evidence not being better than we think they are.

- An atheist do not and will never blame or believe that God(s) is the reason for evil (If one believe that evil even exist), it would be like a Christian saying that Odin is the cause of evil.

Whenever an atheist make a statement that include God and him/them doing or are guilty of whatever, it is with the assumption for the sake of argument that such God does exist.

If God exists, the Atheist tells himself, then heaven would be the destiny they will enter, no matter. This while people who have faith in God are ever afraid of hell and losing their faith in God from sins.

Maybe those atheists that haven't read the bible, if that is the ones you are referring to. But this is not true in regards to the bible at least.

In short, the Atheist has chosen to glorify themselves, while the believers seek God's forgiveness and belittle themselves in themselves and glorify God's Majesty and Glory in themselves.

Atheist do not glorify themselves in regards to God, that would make little sense. Again especially if we are talking the bible, because we are going to burn, not a whole lot of glorification in that

 

[idea]

Faith in God requires we glorify God which would make us belittle who and what we are to the degree we have failed our duty to God. Recognizing God means you see his favor overflowing and that any good you attained, you see it as a favor from him more then a praise belonging to you. While any evil you attain, you see it belong to you because you did despite his help and mercy and overflowing favor.

The Atheist on the other hand, he tends to not want to be at fault for not seeing God. Consequently, it must be God's fault and not evil on part of the Atheist. More over God being all powerful should make the world according to the desires of the Atheist. If he has not, and will not, he is evil.

If God exists, the Atheist tells himself, then heaven would be the destiny they will enter, no matter. This while people who have faith in God are ever afraid of hell and losing their faith in God from sins.

In short, the Atheist has chosen to glorify themselves, while the believers seek God's forgiveness and belittle themselves in themselves and glorify God's Majesty and Glory in themselves.

Faith in humanism requires we love and care for other humans. Love of other humans not love of imagined God made in our image.... Appreciation of natural laws requires we spend a few nights gazing at the stars. Honesty requires changing beliefs with new information. Being responsible means being self reliant.

In short, believers glorify themselves while imagining others go to hell...

humanists care for others,

believers care for imagined gods they create in their own image.

 

[F1fan]

I don't think this dilemma exists because that isn't how persons work, as St. John the Apostle masterfully puts it: "we love, because He first loved us."

That only works by assuming a God exists. That isn't very certain, is it? It's a guess.

 

[F1fan]

All the observations and psychology of belief I know suggest that what I said is true.

You must be confessing that you know very little.

 

[Lain]

That only works by assuming a God exists. That isn't very certain, is it?

I think it's quite certain, in fact that quote is a whole argument for it in itself.

 

[Lain]

You must be confessing that you know very little.

I have no problem confessing that I know very little, it is indeed true and I reach the borders of my knowledge and expand them daily.

 

[rational experiences]

Faith in God requires we glorify God which would make us belittle who and what we are to the degree we have failed our duty to God. Recognizing God means you see his favor overflowing and that any good you attained, you see it as a favor from him more then a praise belonging to you. While any evil you attain, you see it belong to you because you did despite his help and mercy and overflowing favor.

The Atheist on the other hand, he tends to not want to be at fault for not seeing God. Consequently, it must be God's fault and not evil on part of the Atheist. More over God being all powerful should make the world according to the desires of the Atheist. If he has not, and will not, he is evil.

If God exists, the Atheist tells himself, then heaven would be the destiny they will enter, no matter. This while people who have faith in God are ever afraid of hell and losing their faith in God from sins.

In short, the Atheist has chosen to glorify themselves, while the believers seek God's forgiveness and belittle themselves in themselves and glorify God's Majesty and Glory in themselves.

We came from an eternal being as did the form of gods in its space womb. Creation.

Our teaching God is one form only.

Being the state of holiness created creation.

As the concept is one form two forms back to one form.

Change.

Hence as change is why creation exists we are innocent if it.

Hence we don't need to belittle.

We are in the be term little.

Being.

To just be the teaching.

Egotism is. Claim I know everything. How did you a human know God?

Pretty basic self conscious ...self advice. Self is conscious.

Eternal first.
Change into two forms as first but second term separation and burning.

Third term one term cooling holding new form.

No man as a human knew.

So the atheist says. In the beginning I began.

What is the question?

Energy God.

So we state energy is the same forms today as it was in the beginning.

No man is God.

The teaching human spirituality natural consciousness versus man of science egotism.

As man said as the new form creator a human owning dominion I now create. By human sex only.

His idea human creator misconstrued entirely.

Proof very few documents quantified a woman by man of science creator theist who he said was his life's equal as an equal in life by laws.

His laws first week laws in science thesis. Not human laws. As family did not versus family.

Criminal law introduced because of science laws actually that perverted human behaviour into unequal bias.

 

[Clara Tea]

Faith in God requires we glorify God which would make us belittle who and what we are to the degree we have failed our duty to God. Recognizing God means you see his favor overflowing and that any good you attained, you see it as a favor from him more then a praise belonging to you. While any evil you attain, you see it belong to you because you did despite his help and mercy and overflowing favor.

The Atheist on the other hand, he tends to not want to be at fault for not seeing God. Consequently, it must be God's fault and not evil on part of the Atheist. More over God being all powerful should make the world according to the desires of the Atheist. If he has not, and will not, he is evil.

If God exists, the Atheist tells himself, then heaven would be the destiny they will enter, no matter. This while people who have faith in God are ever afraid of hell and losing their faith in God from sins.

In short, the Atheist has chosen to glorify themselves, while the believers seek God's forgiveness and belittle themselves in themselves and glorify God's Majesty and Glory in themselves.

God doesn't answer prayers if cancer victims, in agony, pray.

Atheists, you claim, wish to not want to be at fault for not seeing God. It seems to me, if God doesn't exist, they are not at fault for not seeing Him. In other words, atheists are not trying to shed blame, they merely don't think that they should be blamed for a God that doesn't intervene in human affairs, is invisible, and is unproven (and presumably unable to be proven).

You make it seems as though theists are right and atheists are wrong (and trying to shed blame for being wrong).

You wrote that atheists believe that "it must be God's fault and not evil on the part of the atheist." Aren't you forgetting that atheists don't believe in God, and therefore are not trying to dump "their" guilt on God?

In your zeal to poke fun at atheists you seem to think that atheists believe in God (or perhaps secretly believe in God).

I don't think that atheists are trying to glorify themselves if your entire premise (a premise of atheists blaming God) is wrong.

But, if you put down atheists, do you somehow glorify yourself?

 

[Clara Tea]

I have no problem confessing that I know very little, it is indeed true and I reach the borders of my knowledge and expand them daily.

There is a thin line separating genius from insanity. That's why I learn as little as possible.

 

[Lain]

There is a thin line separating genius from insanity. That's why I learn as little as possible.

I guess I'm still living out the propaganda I learned as a kid: "learning is fun!" It still feels fun.

 

[Spirit of Light]

Faith in God requires we glorify God which would make us belittle who and what we are to the degree we have failed our duty to God. Recognizing God means you see his favor overflowing and that any good you attained, you see it as a favor from him more then a praise belonging to you. While any evil you attain, you see it belong to you because you did despite his help and mercy and overflowing favor.

The Atheist on the other hand, he tends to not want to be at fault for not seeing God. Consequently, it must be God's fault and not evil on part of the Atheist. More over God being all powerful should make the world according to the desires of the Atheist. If he has not, and will not, he is evil.

If God exists, the Atheist tells himself, then heaven would be the destiny they will enter, no matter. This while people who have faith in God are ever afraid of hell and losing their faith in God from sins.

In short, the Atheist has chosen to glorify themselves, while the believers seek God's forgiveness and belittle themselves in themselves and glorify God's Majesty and Glory in themselves.

At a personal level of worshiping God, I agree with much of what you say, but in the same breath as you glorify God you condemning other human beings and put your self above them....only prophets are seen as "more clean" than other humans, due to their mission of spreading Gods message directly.
Cleaning our own being first, than if even possible guiding others when they ask for help.

Personally I know I am equal to anyone else due to my lack of wisdom within the teaching, an my lack in ability to be a good person.

 

[Clara Tea]

Fine, believe what you want.


OK, now that you are dragging atheists into your dogma, all bets are off.

This is false. Atheists don't think any Gods exist. There is literally no Gods to see. So your your claim here is absurd.


Nothing we observe about reality suggests any Gods exist, nor is there any effects that we can believe is caused by Gods.


Atheists don't think this way, you are misrepresenting them. It's better to ask questions that misrepresent atheists.

Oddly no one ever ends up in hell, because the only people who believe in a heaven and hell thinks they are going to heaven.


This misrepresents atheists as well. You are trying to judge and define atheists from YOUR dogma. Atheists don't use your dogma, so it's irrelevant.

I know very bad people who believe that they will definitely go to hell, and they do believe in God, the devil, heaven and hell. So, they have given up and believe that they cannot be saved, so they might as well be as evil as they want.

There are still others who believe that they can be as evil as they want during their lifetime, as long as they can atone at the end of their lives, so they can get into heaven.

Thus, it seems that the theists are prone to be more evil than atheists. Atheists derive their moral code from their upbringing, and don't use fear of God to guide their actions.

 

[firedragon]

By the way how many Gods did you try out before settling on your current one?

Such a cliche type apologetic that your piers have used and you copy as if this is a great argument. Why cant you be a bit more sophisticated? Try to get good arguments of the theists and attack them rather than make the same old statement repeatedly.

 

[Clara Tea]

At a personal level of worshiping God, I agree with much of what you say, but in the same breath as you glorify God you condemning other human beings and put your self above them....only prophets are seen as "more clean" than other humans, due to their mission of spreading Gods message directly.
Cleaning our own being first, than if even possible guiding others when they ask for help.

Personally I know I am equal to anyone else due to my lack of wisdom within the teaching, an my lack in ability to be a good person.

Prophets of God are required to be humble and not brag that they receive the word of God. God doesn't permit humans to gain fame or notoriety from working with Him. That would merely share divine adoration that should be reserved for God (not shared with humans).

Therefore, prophets of God must not be seen as "more clean." They must be humble, as the dust. They must keep their council, as all wise humans should.

It is this aversion of the limelight that makes it so difficult for true prophets of God to share their messages with the world.

Also, when prophets of God tell the world of their divine visions, they are considered nuts. At this point, God might also allow his prophets to predict other things (for example, a prophet of God was given the information, ahead of time, that the space shuttle would lose heat tiles and crash over Texas). This would force others to believe in predictions of the future, but it goes against the requirement of being humble. Thus, it is a difficult decision how to proceed.

Noah (of the flood) was a prophet of God, and typical of prophets, people thought that he was nuts. This is because he spent many years building a huge boat in the middle of a desert with a wild story of a flood. All prophets of God also have to endure that same humiliation. With the honor of serving God comes the humiliation from fellow humans.

Fortunately, many prophets of God got together on the internet and played with each other with their psychic powers (sometimes visiting each other's homes psychically). By doing so, they felt a lot more sane, because they realized that there were other psychics of God who were going through the same things that they were, and they could test their God-given powers of ESP (etc.) with each other, in order to assure themselves that they were not crazy.

Many people (like Joan of Arc) felt a bit nuts as they served God. It is good that they have a support group helping them.

By the way, these modern-day psychics of God were trying desperately, in vain, to warn not to attack Iraq or face God's wrath (just as revelation predicted in the bible).