A question for Baha’is and Jehovah Witnesses.

[an anarchist]

So I’m not well educated in Baha’ism or Jehovah Witness theology. I’m curious about a possible connection.
Baha’ism claims that it’s founder, Baha’u’llah, fulfilled the prophetic expectations of the Bible. He was the return of Christ. He designated his son as his successor, and his son went about and taught and devoloped Baha’ism. With his son’s teachings, the canon of Baha’i was considered completed and sealed. His son, Abdu’l-Baha, died in 1920.
The Jehovah Witnesses teach that Christ’s eternal kingdom began in 1914. Is it a stretch to draw a connection between these two ideologies? Baha’u’llah was the return of Christ, and the teachings of Baha’ism were completed and sealed, let’s assume, 1914, shortly before Abdu’l-Baha’s death. Can this eternal kingdom the Jehovah Witnesses teach of mean that we now have the complete teachings, as well as Baha’u’llah fulfilling the prophetic return of the Christ?

 

[Deeje]

So I’m not well educated in Baha’ism or Jehovah Witness theology. I’m curious about a possible connection.

There is no connection.....not even in the slightest.

Baha’ism claims that it’s founder, Baha’u’llah, fulfilled the prophetic expectations of the Bible. He was the return of Christ. He designated his son as his successor, and his son went about and taught and devoloped Baha’ism. With his son’s teachings, the canon of Baha’i was considered completed and sealed. His son, Abdu’l-Baha, died in 1920.

Baha'i is an offshoot of Islam, not Judaism, as is Christianity. To subscribe to Baha'i is to believe that Ishmael is the seed of Abraham. The scriptures clearly indicate that Isaac and Jacob are the ones through whom the covenant was made to bless all mankind by means of Abraham's seed. Salvation came through the Jews.
Baha'i's embrace the worship of false gods by accepting their prophets, as if God would communicate through prophets whose worship he would never condone.

The Jehovah Witnesses teach that Christ’s eternal kingdom began in 1914. Is it a stretch to draw a connection between these two ideologies?

Yes, a big stretch.....because Christ has not yet established his Kingdom on earth, which is very obvious considering the state of the world at present. The blessings have not been observed as Jesus said they would when the Kingdom was to "come". (Matthew 6:9-10) God's will would then "be done on earth as it is in heaven".

When Jesus established his Kingdom in the heavens in 1914, (seen in vision by Daniel hundreds of years in advance....Daniel 7:13-14) Jesus listed a series of world events that would identify the time period before the Kingdom was established on earth.

Recorded in Matthew 24, we see some questions asked by the apostles....he begins by telling his disciples that the Temple that they were viewing from the mountain, was going to be completely destroyed.....as the very seat of God's worship that must have been puzzling to them. Why would God allow his sacred Temple to be destroyed? Because the Jewish system with all its corrupt teachings and practices was about to come to an end. Not only was the Temple to be destroyed but the whole city would lie in ruins.

Continuing on....Matthew 24:3-6
"While he was sitting on the Mount of Olives, the disciples approached him privately, saying: “Tell us, when will these things be, and what will be the sign of your presence and of the conclusion of the system of things?”

4 In answer Jesus said to them: “Look out that nobody misleads you, 5 for many will come on the basis of my name, saying, ‘I am the Christ,’ and will mislead many. 6 You are going to hear of wars and reports of wars. See that you are not alarmed, for these things must take place, but the end is not yet."

So the warning that "many Christ's" would come and make claims, was not to be taken seriously. We are warned not to be misled. Jesus also spoke about his "presence" i.e. when he would return, but because it needed a "sign" for his disciples to recognize it, it was not going to be something visible. The events given would identify his return......but his "coming" as judge would come at "the end" when all the features of the "sign" were complete. (Matthew 24:3-14) Only then will there be a visible manifestation of his return.....but too late for those who did not exercise faith in his words and obey his commands.

The sign began with unprecedented warfare.....1914 saw the world First global war in the history of mankind.... and all that has followed has fulfilled his prophesy. "The end", we believe is very close now....and we have been preaching "the good news of the kingdom" throughout all this time as Jesus instructed. (Matthew 24:14; Matthew 28:19-20)

Baha’u’llah was the return of Christ, and the teachings of Baha’ism were completed and sealed, let’s assume, 1914, shortly before Abdu’l-Baha’s death. Can this eternal kingdom the Jehovah Witnesses teach of mean that we now have the complete teachings, as well as Baha’u’llah fulfilling the prophetic return of the Christ?

No, because we see that false "Christs" were to come making claims that were not true....but would "mislead many". Jesus told his disciples about the wars to come but that "the "end" was "not yet". So the fulfillment was in the future. Baha'i's believe that man-made efforts will bring about world peace, but the Bible says that it will never come about by human efforts.

Baha'i's are not Christians.
Christianity has nothing in common with Baha'i, Islam or Judaism...(even though Jesus was Jewish) but more surprisingly, Christianity has little in common with Christendom either....another religious system that corrupted itself and drew away from the true God by adopting ideas from false worship.

The Jewish system ended, (Matthew 23:37-39) and the Christian era began after Christ's death, and the outpouring of holy spirit at Pentecost, anointing Christ's disciples for their future role in his Kingdom. But true to Jesus' warning, "weeds" were going to sprout, planted by the devil, and these would contaminate the field in which Jesus had planted the "wheat". False or counterfeit Christianity would dominate the world until Christ's return. His true disciples however would be called out of Christendom in advance of that, cleansing themselves of the false doctrines that had crept in over many centuries, separated out, and waiting for his instructions. (Daniel 12:4, 9-10) We now await the outbreak of the greatest tribulation the world has ever seen, as the final act before the destruction of satan's entire system of things. (Matthew 24:21; 1 John 5:19)

 

[an anarchist]

There is no connection.....not even in the slightest.


Baha'i is an offshoot of Islam, not Judaism, as is Christianity. To subscribe to Baha'i is to believe that Ishmael is the seed of Abraham. The scriptures clearly indicate that Isaac and Jacob are the ones through whom the covenant was made to bless all mankind by means of Abraham's seed. Salvation came through the Jews.
Baha'i's embrace the worship of false gods by accepting their prophets, as if God would communicate through prophets whose worship he would never condone.


Yes, a big stretch.....because Christ has not yet established his Kingdom on earth, which is very obvious considering the state of the world at present. The blessings have not been observed as Jesus said they would when the Kingdom was to "come". (Matthew 6:9-10) God's will would then "be done on earth as it is in heaven".

When Jesus established his Kingdom in the heavens in 1914, (seen in vision by Daniel hundreds of years in advance....Daniel 7:13-14) Jesus listed a series of world events that would identify the time period before the Kingdom was established on earth.

Recorded in Matthew 24, we see some questions asked by the apostles....he begins by telling his disciples that the Temple that they were viewing from the mountain, was going to be completely destroyed.....as the very seat of God's worship that must have been puzzling to them. Why would God allow his sacred Temple to be destroyed? Because the Jewish system with all its corrupt teachings and practices was about to come to an end. Not only was the Temple to be destroyed but the whole city would lie in ruins.

Continuing on....Matthew 24:3-6
"While he was sitting on the Mount of Olives, the disciples approached him privately, saying: “Tell us, when will these things be, and what will be the sign of your presence and of the conclusion of the system of things?”

4 In answer Jesus said to them: “Look out that nobody misleads you, 5 for many will come on the basis of my name, saying, ‘I am the Christ,’ and will mislead many. 6 You are going to hear of wars and reports of wars. See that you are not alarmed, for these things must take place, but the end is not yet."

So the warning that "many Christ's" would come and make claims, was not to be taken seriously. We are warned not to be misled. Jesus also spoke about his "presence" i.e. when he would return, but because it needed a "sign" for his disciples to recognize it, it was not going to be something visible. The events given would identify his return......but his "coming" as judge would come at "the end" when all the features of the "sign" were complete. (Matthew 24:3-14) Only then will there be a visible manifestation of his return.....but too late for those who did not exercise faith in his words and obey his commands.

The sign began with unprecedented warfare.....1914 saw the world First global war in the history of mankind.... and all that has followed has fulfilled his prophesy. "The end", we believe is very close now....and we have been preaching "the good news of the kingdom" throughout all this time as Jesus instructed. (Matthew 24:14; Matthew 28:19-20)


No, because we see that false "Christs" were to come making claims that were not true....but would "mislead many". Jesus told his disciples about the wars to come but that "the "end" was "not yet". So the fulfillment was in the future. Baha'i's believe that man-made efforts will bring about world peace, but the Bible says that it will never come about by human efforts.

Baha'i's are not Christians.
Christianity has nothing in common with Baha'i, Islam or Judaism...(even though Jesus was Jewish) but more surprisingly, Christianity has little in common with Christendom either....another religious system that corrupted itself and drew away from the true God by adopting ideas from false worship.

The Jewish system ended, (Matthew 23:37-39) and the Christian era began after Christ's death, and the outpouring of holy spirit at Pentecost, anointing Christ's disciples for their future role in his Kingdom. But true to Jesus' warning, "weeds" were going to sprout, planted by the devil, and these would contaminate the field in which Jesus had planted the "wheat". False or counterfeit Christianity would dominate the world until Christ's return. His true disciples however would be called out of Christendom in advance of that, cleansing themselves of the false doctrines that had crept in over many centuries, separated out, and waiting for his instructions. (Daniel 12:4, 9-10) We now await the outbreak of the greatest tribulation the world has ever seen, as the final act before the destruction of satan's entire system of things. (Matthew 24:21; 1 John 5:19)

So in Matthew 24 it talks about the desolation of Jerusalem being a sign of the end times. I’ve wondered if the Palestine/Israeli conflict and the humanitarian crisis happening in the Gaza region could be this desolation. Like, a nation-state, which calls itself Israel and waves the flag of the Star of David, I would argue is desolating the land with atrocities of war.
Is the current crisis going on over there the abomination of desolation?

 

[Deeje]

So in Matthew 24 it talks about the desolation of Jerusalem being a sign of the end times. I’ve wondered if the Palestine/Israeli conflict and the humanitarian crisis happening in the Gaza region could be this desolation. Like, a nation-state, which calls itself Israel and waves the flag of the Star of David, I would argue is desolating the land with atrocities of war.
Is the current crisis going on over there the abomination of desolation?

The prophesy that Jesus gave regarding the destruction of Jerusalem and its Temple was two fold, pertaining to both the end of the Jewish system, and the end of the present world order when he was to return as judge of all mankind. Don't look at fleshly Israel to figure in any of Jesus' prophesies because his declaration in Matthew 23:37-39 was a complete abandonment of them as God's people.

"Jerusalem, Jerusalem, the killer of the prophets and stoner of those sent to her—how often I wanted to gather your children together the way a hen gathers her chicks under her wings! But you did not want it. 38 Look! Your house is abandoned to you. 39 For I say to you, you will by no means see me from now until you say, ‘Blessed is the one who comes in Jehovah’s name!’”

In the last 2,000 years have the Jews blessed the one who came in the father's name?

Matthew 21:42-45...
"Jesus said to them: “Did you never read in the Scriptures, ‘The stone that the builders rejected, this has become the chief cornerstone. This has come from Jehovah, and it is marvelous in our eyes’? 43 This is why I say to you, the Kingdom of God will be taken from you and be given to a nation producing its fruits. 44 Also, the person falling on this stone will be shattered. As for anyone on whom it falls, it will crush him.”

45 When the chief priests and the Pharisees heard his illustrations, they knew that he was speaking about them."

The reason why the Temple has never been rebuilt is because the Jews lost their place. Without a Temple there is nowhere to offer their sacrifices to God for atonement of their sins, which under the Law they are still obligated to offer.....what does that tell you? Even in the wilderness they had the Tabernacle in order to offer their sacrifices to God. Their sins are not forgiven without those sacrifices.....so why has God never commanded that the temple be rebuilt? Without God's forgiveness, we are doomed. Accepting Christ's sacrifice was the only way to be saved and they refused...what can we say? The door is still open, but not for much longer I think.

The new nation to whom the Kingdom was now promised were the disciples of Jesus Christ, both Jewish and Gentile. Paul called them "the Israel of God". (Galatians 6:16) This is 'spiritual' Israel.

 

[Trailblazer]

There is no connection.....not even in the slightest.

You can say that again.

Baha’ism claims that it’s founder, Baha’u’llah, fulfilled the prophetic expectations of the Bible. He was the return of Christ.

We not only claim that, we can prove that, since Baha’u’llah fulfilled all the prophecies for the return of Christ.

He designated his son as his successor, and his son went about and taught and devoloped Baha’ism. With his son’s teachings, the canon of Baha’i was considered completed and sealed. His son, Abdu’l-Baha, died in 1920.

There is no Baha’i canon. After Abdu’l-Baha died, His grandson Shoghi Effendi was appointed as his successor, and whatever he wrote is considered part of the “authoritative” Writings of the Baha’i Faith.

Baha'i is an offshoot of Islam, not Judaism, as is Christianity. To subscribe to Baha'i is to believe that Ishmael is the seed of Abraham. The scriptures clearly indicate that Isaac and Jacob are the ones through whom the covenant was made to bless all mankind by means of Abraham's seed. Salvation came through the Jews.

Baha’i is no more an offshoot if Islam than Christianity is an offshoot of Judaism. The Baha'i Faith grew out of Islam just as Christianity grew out of Judaism. The Baha’i Faith is an independent world religion, based upon the Revelation if Baha'u'llah, just as Christianity is an independent religion based upon the Revelation of Jesus Christ. Jews do not accept Jesus as their Messiah for a good reason; He wasn’t and never will be because He did not fulfill the Messianic prophecies, and Jesus not coming back to fulfill those prophecies because the work of Jesus was finished when He died in the cross. (John 14:19, John 17:11, John 17:4, John 19:30)

The Old Testament prophesied the coming of Jesus but the Old Testament is not about Jesus; it is about Moses. The prophets of the Old Testament prophesied the coming of a Messiah who would come in the messianic age and during that age the messianic prophecies will be fulfilled. These prophecies have absolutely nothing to do with Jesus because the work of Jesus ended when he died on the cross and ascended to heaven at which time Jesus' mission in earth ended and there would be no further involvement in this world. That Bible proves that backwards and forewords, but Christians just cannot face that reality.

Baha'i's embrace the worship of false gods by accepting their prophets, as if God would communicate through prophets whose worship he would never condone.

No, we do not worship any false gods, we worship the one true God of the Bible and all the revealed religions. Christians do not own the religion of God, they just believe that do.
You know what God would condone? When did God communicate to you and tell you?

Yes, a big stretch.....because Christ has not yet established his Kingdom on earth, which is very obvious considering the state of the world at present. The blessings have not been observed as Jesus said they would when the Kingdom was to "come". (Matthew 6:9-10) God's will would then "be done on earth as it is in heaven".

Jesus Christ is not going to establish anything on earth; He said His work was finished here. (John 14:19, John 17:11, John 17:4, John 19:30) Jesus never said that He was going to rule the earth from heaven.

When Jesus established his Kingdom in the heavens in 1914, (seen in vision by Daniel hundreds of years in advance....Daniel 7:13-14) Jesus listed a series of world events that would identify the time period before the Kingdom was established on earth.

Do you have any evidence that proves that Jesus established his Kingdom in the heavens in 1914 or is it just a belief?

Daniel 7:13-14 I saw in the night visions, and, behold, one like the Son of man came with the clouds of heaven, and came to the Ancient of days, and they brought him near before him. And there was given him dominion, and glory, and a kingdom, that all people, nations, and languages, should serve him: his dominion is an everlasting dominion, which shall not pass away, and his kingdom that which shall not be destroyed.

My belief is as follows: When Jesus who was the Son of man died on the cross, the soul of Jesus ascended into heaven. Baha’u’llah, one like the son of man, descended from the heaven of the Will of God, and came to the Ancient of days, and they brought him near before him. And there was given him dominion, and glory, and a kingdom, that all people, nations, and languages, should serve him: his dominion is an everlasting dominion, which shall not pass away, and his kingdom that which shall not be destroyed. These verses are about an earthly Kingdom, not a heavenly Kingdom. Jesus’ Kingdom is in heaven, Baha’u’llah’s Kingdom will be on earth, after it is built by humans.

John 18:36 Jesus answered, My kingdom is not of this world: if my kingdom were of this world, then would my servants fight, that I should not be delivered to the Jews: but now is my kingdom not from hence.

"While he was sitting on the Mount of Olives, the disciples approached him privately, saying: “Tell us, when will these things be, and what will be the sign of your presence and of the conclusion of the system of things?”

4 In answer Jesus said to them: “Look out that nobody misleads you, 5 for many will come on the basis of my name, saying, ‘I am the Christ,’ and will mislead many. 6 You are going to hear of wars and reports of wars. See that you are not alarmed, for these things must take place, but the end is not yet."

So the warning that "many Christ's" would come and make claims, was not to be taken seriously. We are warned not to be misled.

No, because we see that false "Christs" were to come making claims that were not true....but would "mislead many". Jesus told his disciples about the wars to come but that "the "end" was "not yet". So the fulfillment was in the future. Baha'i's believe that man-made efforts will bring about world peace, but the Bible says that it will never come about by human efforts.

Baha’u’llah never claimed to be Christ, so He was not what Jesus warned about. The Bible says Christ would return with a new name, another way we know it would not be Jesus.

Isaiah 62:2 And the Gentiles shall see thy righteousness, and all kings thy glory: and thou shalt be called by a new name, which the mouth of the Lord shall name.

Revelation 2:17 He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches; To him that overcometh will I give to eat of the hidden manna, and will give him a white stone, and in the stone a new name written, which no man knoweth saving he that receiveth it.

Revelation 3:12-13 Him that overcometh will I make a pillar in the temple of my God, and he shall go no more out: and I will write upon him the name of my God, and the name of the city of my God, which is new Jerusalem, which cometh down out of heaven from my God: and I will write upon him my new name. He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches.

Please show me where the Bible says that it will never come about by human efforts. Please show me any verses that say that Jesus is going to orchestrate all of what you believe from heaven. And while you are at it please explain what other Christians have a completely different beliefs about what will happen at the “time of the end” yet they are reading the same Bible. Why are JWs right and all the other Christians wrong?

Christianity has nothing in common with Baha'i, Islam or Judaism...(even though Jesus was Jewish) but more surprisingly, Christianity has little in common with Christendom either....another religious system that corrupted itself and drew away from the true God by adopting ideas from false worship.

JWs created their own version of Christianity by interpreting the Bible to suit their fancy; that is what really happened. Any objective observer could see that is what happened.

 

[Trailblazer]

So in Matthew 24 it talks about the desolation of Jerusalem being a sign of the end times. I’ve wondered if the Palestine/Israeli conflict and the humanitarian crisis happening in the Gaza region could be this desolation. Like, a nation-state, which calls itself Israel and waves the flag of the Star of David, I would argue is desolating the land with atrocities of war.
Is the current crisis going on over there the abomination of desolation?

I do not believe the current crisis going on over there is what Jesus was referring to as the abomination of desolation.

Three specific promises were made by Jesus to His disciples. Jesus said that when these three things came to pass, He would return to earth.

The first promise: His Gospel would be preached everywhere on earth.

The second promise: The “times of the Gentiles” would be fulfilled, and the Jews would return to Israel (Palestine).

The third promise: All mankind would see “the abomination of desolation” foretold by Daniel the Prophet.

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The third promise: All mankind would see “the abomination of desolation” foretold by Daniel the Prophet.

I found the third promise of Christ to be the most interesting of all. It was given in the twenty-fourth chapter of Matthew.

The third promise was again given in direct answer to the questions of His disciples:

“And as he sat upon the mount of Olives, the disciples came unto him privately, saying, Tell us, when shall these things be? And what shall be the sign of thy coming?” (Matthew 24:3)

Christ foretold that ‘iniquity would abound’ in that day, and that the ‘love of many shall wax cold’; then He makes His third promise in these words:

“When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth let him understand.)” (Matthew 24:15.)

The chapters of Daniel which deal with this subject are those from eight to twelve inclusive. These chapters (according to millennial scholars, as well as my own research) foretell not only the second coming of Christ, but to my keen interest, His first appearance as well.

It was this link between the first and the second coming of Christ which give to these chapters of Daniel such great importance in the study of the subject, and indeed this third promise was considered to be the most important of the three.

In these chapters, Daniel prophesies that from the issuing of the decree to rebuild Jerusalem, until the time when the Messiah shall be cut off (crucified) there are appointed 70 weeks. Daniel gives this prophecy in two different ways:

1. As 70 weeks.

2. As 7 weeks, 62 weeks, and one week; during which the Messiah confirms the covenant.

However, both ways total up to 70 weeks or to 490 days. This becomes 490 years in prophecy with a day for a year.

In His first coming, it is prophesied that from the issuing of the decree to His cutting off, or crucifixion, 490 years will pass. The important thing then was for me to discover at what time the decree had been issued.

I found that there were four decrees to rebuild Jerusalem. They were as follows:

1. Issued by Cyrus in the year 536 BC. This decree is recorded in the first chapter of Ezra. It went unfulfilled.

2. Issued by Darius in the year 519 BC. This decree is recorded in the sixth chapter of Ezra. It also went unfulfilled. Only the Temple was rebuilt.

3. Issued by Artaxerxes in the seventh year of his reign in the year 457 BC. This is recorded in the seventh chapter of Ezra. It was fulfilled by the fourth decree.

4. Issued by the same Artaxerxes in the year 444 BC. This is recorded in the second chapter of Nehemiah. This decree fulfilled the third.

Most of the students of Scripture accepted the third decree of Artaxerxes as the one referred to by Daniel. They reasoned that since the fourth decree was merely an extension of the third, and was issued by the same king it was in reality the same decree. Therefore, they favoured the decree issued in 457 BC.

With this knowledge, it was now possible to state the prophecy of Daniel as follows: From the issuing of the decree of Artaxerxes in the year 457 BC until the time of the crucifixion of Jesus the Christ, there would be appointed (or pass) 70 weeks, 490 days—or in prophecy, 490 years.

Many Bible scholars merely subtracted the 457 from the 490. This gave them 33 years. The Messiah (Christ) in His first coming would therefore be 33 years of age when He was cut off or slain.

I found that authorities differed widely as to the date of the birth of Christ, as well as to the date of His death. According to the Gospels, His birth took place before the death of Herod. Many historians calculated the death of Herod to have taken place in the month of April in the year 4 BC. Some said it was the year 5, some 6, some as early as the year 8 BC. Therefore, some of these scholars maintained that Christ was only 28 or less at the time of His death.

Others give a different year and a different day. However, they all centre around the period foretold by Daniel. Thus with amazing accuracy, Daniel had given the time for the first coming of Christ. No wonder Jesus Himself was so emphatic about Daniel’s prophecy concerning His second coming or return. He told His disciples to ‘stand in the holy place’ when Daniel’s prophecy about the ‘abomination of desolation’ was fulfilled. In that day He promised:

“… they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven …” (Matthew 24:30)

I followed the pattern of the millennial scholars of the 1840s and carefully examined Daniel’s prophecy concerning the ‘abomination of desolation’. His exact words were:

“How long shall be the vision concerning the daily sacrifice, and the abomination of desolation, to give the sanctuary and the host to be trodden under foot? And he said unto me, Unto two thousand and three hundred days; then shall the sanctuary be cleansed.” (Daniel 8:13–14)

Thus, Daniel prophesied that two thousand three hundred days (2,300) would pass before the sanctuary would be cleansed. Following this time, all things would be made pure again. Before this time, the people would have fallen into a state of ‘abomination’ without love for God or man; then the Messiah would appear and restore their Faith and the purity of their belief. This was the general conclusion.

When would this take place? Daniel said it would come to pass in 2,300 days. In prophecy, this becomes 2,300 years.

Using the same frame of reference for the second coming, as was used for the first coming (the decree of Artaxerxes), the Bible scholars made the following calculations:

1. The decree was issued in 457. They subtracted 457 from 2,300 and arrived at 1,843. Thus the year 1843, they said, would mark the beginning of the end of the ‘abomination of desolation’

2. Some scholars pointed out that from the issuing of the decree in 457 until the birth of Christ there were 456 years, not 457; therefore, it was necessary to subtract 456 from 2,300. This left the year 1844.

Although many disputes arose as to the exact month, day, and hour, there was a basic agreement among nearly all that Christ’s return must take place between the years 1843 and 1845, with the year 1844 as the central point of reference.

One group of Christian scholars worked out Daniel’s prophecy in the greatest detail. They even built a special chart to show that Christ would return in the middle of the year 1844. (Bible Reading, Ed. Review and Herald Pub. Co. (Battle Creek, Michigan), p. 94.)

E. P. Cachemaille, sometime scholar of Cambridge University, in a new edition of H. G. Guinness’s book Light for the Last Days, maintains that this book had been recognized for over thirty years as a standard work of chronological prophecy. He quotes Guinness as saying the following about Daniel’s prophecy: “The decree (Edict of Toleration) was published in the 1260th year of the (Muslim) calendar. It is dated 21 March 1844. This date is the first of Nisan in the Jewish year, and is exactly twenty three centuries (2,300 years) from the first of Nisan, 457 BC, the day on which Ezra states that he left Babylon in compliance with the decree given in the seventh year of the reign of Artaxerxes.”

Thus the year 1844 was firmly established in their minds as the year for the fulfilment of the third promise of Christ concerning Daniel’s prophecy.

From: http://bahai-library.com/pdf/s/sears_thief_night.pdf

 

[Truthseeker]

To subscribe to Baha'i is to believe that Ishmael is the seed of Abraham. The scriptures clearly indicate that Isaac and Jacob are the ones through whom the covenant was made to bless all mankind by means of Abraham's seed.

They are all Abraham's seed. Mankind is blessed by both the descendants of Isaac and Ishmael.

In answer Jesus said to them: “Look out that nobody misleads you, 5 for many will come on the basis of my name, saying, ‘I am the Christ,’ and will mislead many. So the warning that "many Christ's" would come and make claims, was not to be taken seriously.

There have been many, no doubt, who are false Christs.

The sign began with unprecedented warfare.....1914 saw the world First global war in the history of mankind

There were many wars before that.

Baha'i's believe that man-made efforts will bring about world peace, but the Bible says that it will never come about by human efforts.

Why do you think so? Besides, Baha'u'llah set in motion the plan for world peace, and the spiritual impetus that will make this happen.

Christianity has nothing in common with Baha'i, Islam or Judaism...(even though Jesus was Jewish) but more surprisingly, Christianity has little in common with Christendom either....another religious system that corrupted itself and drew away from the true God by adopting ideas from false worship.

They have the same spiritual principles. You are part of Christendom.

But true to Jesus' warning, "weeds" were going to sprout, planted by the devil, and these would contaminate the field in which Jesus had planted the "wheat". False or counterfeit Christianity would dominate the world until Christ's return.His true disciples however would be called out of Christendom in advance of that, cleansing themselves of the false doctrines that had crept in over many centuries, separated out, and waiting for his instructions. (Daniel 12:4, 9-10) We now await the outbreak of the greatest tribulation the world has ever seen, as the final act before the destruction of satan's entire system of things. (Matthew 24:21; 1 John 5:19)

Those weeds were taken out by the Qur'an. Then the weeds of Islam were taken out by the Bab's Writings. The weeds of the Bayan were taken out by Baha'u'llah's Writings. Why do you think that fallible human agency can take out those weeds?

 

[Deeje]

They are all Abraham's seed. Mankind is blessed by both the descendants of Isaac and Ishmael.

Jesus clearly identified "the Jews" as those through whom salvation (in the form of the Messiah) would come.
John 4:21-24...
"Jesus said to her [the Samaritan woman] : “Believe me, woman, the hour is coming when neither on this mountain nor in Jerusalem will you worship the Father. 22 You worship what you do not know; we worship what we know, because salvation begins with the Jews. 23 Nevertheless, the hour is coming, and it is now, when the true worshippers will worship the Father with spirit and truth, for indeed, the Father is looking for ones like these to worship him. 24 God is a Spirit, and those worshipping him must worship with spirit and truth.”

Again, there are many who 'worship what they do not know', believing, but never really knowing God or his Christ as they are identified in the scriptures.....the Bible alone is God's word...it contains "spirit and truth"....and there cannot be more than one truth.
John 14:6...
"Jesus said. . . . .“I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me."
No one comes to the Father except through Christ....and no one can come to Christ without an invitation from the Father. (John 6:65)

But just because salvation originated with the Jews, doesn't mean that it ended with them.....now it doesn't matter what nationality you are....but it still matters what religion you are, and what god you serve.. (Acts 10:34-35)

Matthew 7:21-23...
"Not everyone saying to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter into the Kingdom of the heavens, but only the one doing the will of my Father who is in the heavens will. 22 Many will say to me in that day: ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and expel demons in your name, and perform many powerful works in your name?’ 23 And then I will declare to them: ‘I never knew you! Get away from me, you workers of lawlessness!’"

From the scriptures, if you are a believer in false prophets and false religion, then you will not be found "doing the will of the Father".

Claiming Jesus as your "Lord" will account for nothing unless your worship is acceptable to God. (Matthew 7:21-23) How many religions did God accept in the days of ancient Israel? How many prophets did he send to those who were not his people?To how many others did he give his Law?

There have been many, no doubt, who are false Christs.

Of which your prophet claims to be one....with nothing but his word for who he claimed to be.
In what way was he even remotely like Jesus Christ?

There were many wars before that.

Jesus already stated that there would be "wars and reports of wars" but then he went on to describe the war that engulfed the world in 1914....originally called "The Great War" because of its global scope, but later called "The First World War" because "The Second World War" could not be prevented by the League of Nations, which was set up to tackle the problem, and try to bring about world peace.....it was a toothless tiger....a complete failure. Mankind has never been able to bring peace to the world, because of who is ruling it...(1 John 5:19)

The war was to be followed by food shortages and pestilences, great earthquakes and a decline in natural human affection....leading to a loveless world.

Why do you think so? Besides, Baha'u'llah set in motion the plan for world peace, and the spiritual impetus that will make this happen.

Really?.....that is not what Jesus taught.....He is the King of God's Kingdom and when he shows himself for the second time, it will be as judge and executioner of God's enemies, with the power of his angelic forces.....ready or not. (Matthew 25:31-33)
Baha'u'llah is your prophet, but he is not recognized by anyone but Baha'i's. He is not and never was the returned Christ to anyone but you.....because he fulfilled no scripture and he performed no miracles and introduced no Kingdom blessings to the world. You can believe in him if you wish......I'll pass.

They have the same spiritual principles. You are part of Christendom.

We abandoned Christendom over a hundred years ago.....we got rid of all of their introduced doctrines so we have no beliefs in common with them. We know the God we worship.....and it is not Jesus.

Those weeds were taken out by the Qur'an. Then the weeds of Islam were taken out by the Bab's Writings. The weeds of the Bayan were taken out by Baha'u'llah's Writings. Why do you think that fallible human agency can take out those weeds?

Why? Because as the Bible predicts, people will be looking to a man-made agency to solve the world's problems. The toothless tiger is about to be given 'dentures' that will make it the hub of hope for world peace and it will even claim to have achieved it....(1 Thessalonians 5:3-4)....but suddenly and without warning the Christ will come and put the world to right, eliminating all the "weeds" and the "goats" from existence.

What does Armageddon mean to Baha'i's?

 

[Truthseeker]

“Believe me, woman, the hour is coming when neither on this mountain nor in Jerusalem will you worship the Father. 22 You worship what you do not know; we worship what we know, because salvation begins with the Jews. 23 Nevertheless, the hour is coming, and it is now, when the true worshippers will worship the Father with spirit and truth, for indeed, the Father is looking for ones like these to worship him. 24 God is a Spirit, and those worshipping him must worship with spirit and truth.”

What about the previous two verses:

The woman saith unto him, Sir, I perceive that thou art a prophet. Our fathers worshipped in this mountain; and ye say, that in Jerusalem is the place where men ought to worship.
John, "The Gospel of John - ευαγγέλιο του ιωάννη", 4:19

In context, Samaritans and Jews didn't consider Samaritans Jews. It's also interesting that this woman said "I perceive that thou art a prophet" and Jesus said nothing to contradict that. Samaritans pooh-poohed worshipping in Jerusalem in general. The temple in Jerusalem was central to the Jewish worship.

Nevertheless, the hour is coming, and it is now, when the true worshippers will worship the Father with spirit and truth, for indeed, the Father is looking for ones like these to worship him. 24 God is a Spirit, and those worshipping him must worship with spirit and truth.”

Now Jesus is moving beyond worshipping the temple at Jerusalem and says "true worshippers will worship the Father with spirit and truth". Is that really confined to Jews? It "begins with the Jews" and is moving past that.

the Bible alone is God's word...it contains "spirit and truth"....and there cannot be more than one truth.

No there can't, but that doesn't mean that truth stops with the Bible.

"Jesus said. . . . .“I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me."

What about the word "I"? Baha'is believe that all Prophets are one. No one can come to the Father except through Them, and they all represent the same God. They are all exponents of God.

But just because salvation originated with the Jews, doesn't mean that it ended with them.....now it doesn't matter what nationality you are....but it still matters what religion you are, and what god you serve.. (Acts 10:34-35)

Sorry, I didn't look ahead concerning the Jews. There is only one God.

Then Peter opened his mouth, and said, Of a truth I perceive that God is no respecter of persons: But in every nation he that feareth him, and worketh righteousness, is accepted with him.
Luke, "The Acts of the Apostles - πράξεις των αποστόλων", 10:34

I don't see anything there that indicates that other religions worship other gods. What that says to me is that all people of all nations which include other religions that fears the same God and works righteousness is accepted of Him.

"Not everyone saying to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter into the Kingdom of the heavens, but only the one doing the will of my Father who is in the heavens will. 22 Many will say to me in that day: ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and expel demons in your name, and perform many powerful works in your name?’ 23 And then I will declare to them: ‘I never knew you! Get away from me, you workers of lawlessness!’"
From the scriptures, if you are a believer in false prophets and false religion, then you will not be found "doing the will of the Father".

Claiming Jesus as your "Lord" will account for nothing unless your worship is acceptable to God. (Matthew 7:21-23) How many religions did God accept in the days of ancient Israel? How many prophets did he send to those who were not his people? To how many others did he give his Law?

What is the will of the Father? It is acting according to spiritual principles revealed by all Prophets. There are also social laws revealed in every age which should be followed. Here He is talking about Christians who don't act according the will of God, but give emphasis instead to prophesizing and expelling demons and such.

Of which your prophet claims to be one....with nothing but his word for who he claimed to be.
In what way was he even remotely like Jesus Christ?

He is Baha'u'llah, not Christ. Also return of Christ denotes return of His Spirit, not His body. There is plenty besides His word. Have you studied His Writings or examined His life?

Jesus already stated that there would be "wars and reports of wars" but then he went on to describe the war that engulfed the world in 1914....originally called "The Great War" because of its global scope, but later called "The First World War" because "The Second World War" could not be prevented by the League of Nations, which was set up to tackle the problem, and try to bring about world peace.....it was a toothless tiger....a complete failure. Mankind has never been able to bring peace to the world, because of who is ruling it...(1 John 5:19)

The war was to be followed by food shortages and pestilences, great earthquakes and a decline in natural human affection....leading to a loveless world.

And we know that we are of God, and the whole world lieth in wickedness.
John, "The First Epistle of John - πρώτα επιστολή στο Ιωάννη", 5:19

What does this have to do with who is ruling it? It has always been so.

When did Jesus describe the Great War? I must have missed it.

Really?.....that is not what Jesus taught.....He is the King of God's Kingdom and when he shows himself for the second time, it will be as judge and executioner of God's enemies, with the power of his angelic forces.....ready or not. (Matthew 25:31-33)
Baha'u'llah is your prophet, but he is not recognized by anyone but Baha'i's. He is not and never was the returned Christ to anyone but you.....because he fulfilled no scripture and he performed no miracles and introduced no Kingdom blessings to the world. You can believe in him if you wish......I'll pass.

When the Son of man shall come in his glory, and all the holy angels with him, then shall he sit upon the throne of his glory: And before him shall be gathered all nations: and he shall separate them one from another, as a shepherd divideth his sheep from the goats: And he shall set the sheep on his right hand, but the goats on the left.
Matthew, "The Gospel of Matthew - ευαγγέλιο του Ματθαίου", 25:31

He has separated the sheep from the goats, but you don't know it. His holy angels are saintly souls. He did come in His glory - as the Glory of God. His Writings were glorious, His life was glorious. I don't think you really know what glory is. It is not some miracles or display in the skies. How does that profit anyone?

We abandoned Christendom over a hundred years ago.....we got rid of all of their introduced doctrines so we have no beliefs in common with them. We know the God we worship.....and it is not Jesus.

No? I am aware that don't believe that Jesus is God. Neither do we. How did you decide on your doctrines? Do you believe that God somehow told all of you how to interpret scripture? How important is doctrines and dogma, anyway? Also, why not interpret scriptures for yourself than letting some man-made authority do it for you?

Why? Because as the Bible predicts, people will be looking to a man-made agency to solve the world's problems. The toothless tiger is about to be given 'dentures' that will make it the hub of hope for world peace and it will even claim to have achieved it....(1 Thessalonians 5:3-4)....but suddenly and without warning the Christ will come and put the world to right, eliminating all the "weeds" and the "goats" from existence.

What does Armageddon mean to Baha'i's?

For when they shall say, Peace and safety; then sudden destruction cometh upon them, as travail upon a woman with child; and they shall not escape. But ye, brethren, are not in darkness, that that day should overtake you as a thief.
Paul, "The First Epistle of Paul the Apostle to the Thessalonians - πρώτα επιστολή προς τους θεσσαλονίκους", 5:3
What does all this have to do with my question?