Abrahamic Religions and God's Will

[Fool]

so there are something like 40,000 denominations of christianity.


do you suppose that if there is this thing that abrahamic believers called god, that it has 40,000+ different wills? and that isn't even counting judaism and islam in addition

 

[Infidelique]

With such a high number of differing denominations, each employing their very subjective interpretations, I think it is more probable that none of them are accurate in what they are attempting to portray as far as "truth" is concerned.

 

[PoetPhilosopher]

With such a high number of differing denominations, each employing their very subjective interpretations, I think it is more probable that none of them are accurate in what they are attempting to portray as far as "truth" is concerned.

We might agree there.

I'd say that "the Protestant "body" lacks inspiration when it comes to church government."

 

[Sedim Haba]

so there are something like 40,000 denominations of christianity.


do you suppose that if there is this thing that abrahamic believers called god, that it has 40,000+ different wills? and that isn't even counting judaism and islam in addition

40k+ failures, it's a wonder they still keep trying? Don't they get the hint?

 

[Fool]

40k+ failures, it's a wonder they still keep trying? Don't they get the hint?

I think so many "believe" in what they are doing that they don't recognize the same in 39,999 others.

if there is only one god, then there is only one will.

so what is it? god's will?

 

[Brian2]

With such a high number of differing denominations, each employing their very subjective interpretations, I think it is more probable that none of them are accurate in what they are attempting to portray as far as "truth" is concerned.

The 40K is really a BS number when it comes to the different beliefs that exist on various topics in the Christian Church.
In the gospels Jesus said that He is "the way, the truth and the life." It is Jesus that we need and slight variations in beliefs do not count for much.

 

[Fool]

The 40K is really a BS number when it comes to the different beliefs that exist on various topics in the Christian Church.
In the gospels Jesus said that He is "the way, the truth and the life." It is Jesus that we need and slight variations in beliefs do not count for much.

there is only one god, per the monotheist, with one will. that will isn't jesus. jesus even said as much

luke 22:42


if i'm doing what is God's will then I AM the WAY, the Truth, and the Light.


otherwise i'm doing my own, or someone else's will

 

[Brian2]

there is only one god, per the monotheist, with one will. that will isn't jesus. jesus even said as much

luke 22:42

Why don't you want to see that in Luke 22:42 Jesus is a man about to be tortured to death and so does not want that BUT because His Father wants it, Jesus conforms His will and actions to those of His God and Father?
So the will of God is the same as that of His Father.

if i'm doing what is God's will then I AM the WAY, the Truth, and the Light.


otherwise i'm doing my own, or someone else's will

How does doing what is God's will make you into the Way, the Truth and the Light?

 

[It Aint Necessarily So]

do you suppose that if there is this thing that abrahamic believers called god, that it has 40,000+ different wills?

I returned to humanism several decades ago, and all of these religious enigmas resolved themselves. Why are there so many denominations? The believer has to dismiss these away as irrelevant, but the skeptic has an easy answer. Why do the biblical and scientific accounts vary so much? The apologist has his work cut out for him, but the humanist has an easy answer. Why are there apparent contradictions in the scripture? The believer needs his up-is-really-down toolbox, but the unbeliever has an easy answer. Why is there suffering that a good god capable of preventing has allowed to occur. The apologist has to go to work again with his verbal and moral gymnastics, but the atheist has an easy answer.

Are you familiar with Ptolemy's geocentric universe, which had the sun and planets orbiting the earth. There was a problem, though, called retrograde motion, or where a planet appears to stop in its orbit, reverse direction, then stop again and return to the original direction. Ptolemy worked out an elaborate system of epicycles to account for this motion. But the problem disappeared when Copernicus put the sun in the center. With earth and mars both orbiting the sun, but at different rates, Earth periodically lapped Mars creating the same illusion we see in a car passing another car, which now appears to be going backward on the road.

I like this comment:

• "When the philosopher's argument becomes tedious, complicated, and opaque, it is usually a sign that he is attempting to prove as true to the intellect what is plainly false to common sense" - Edward Abbey

The 40K is really a BS number when it comes to the different beliefs that exist on various topics in the Christian Church. In the gospels Jesus said that He is "the way, the truth and the life." It is Jesus that we need and slight variations in beliefs do not count for much.

So you separate out all of the theists who call themselves Christian from people with other beliefs, but stop there segregating them there so that you can present Christianity as a monolith. It's not. You can keep dividing over and over just as you divided one group of Abrahamic monotheists from the others. Those differences are often dramatic, such as whether to have a pope and worship saints or not, and they do matter to the critical thinker. Religion evolves like two other natural enterprises - biological evolution and the evolution of languages. Like religion, we get these trees of nesting hierarchies:

These all have the same form because they all grew naturalistically and in small increments from a last common ancestor.

Anyway, I have an old Emo Philips joke that seems apropos about these little changes and how they lead to these nested hierarchies. Notice that what you are doing is stopping at "Are you Christian" and arbitrarily dismissing the subsequent subdivisions as irrelevant:

I was walking across a bridge one day, and I saw a man standing on the edge, about to jump off. So I ran over and said, "Stop! don't do it!"

"Why shouldn't I?" he said.

I said, "Well, there's so much to live for!"

He said, "Like what?"

I said, "Well...are you religious or atheist?"

He said, "Religious."

I said, "Me too! Are you Christian or Buddhist?"

He said, "Christian."

I said, "Me too! Are you Catholic or Protestant?"

He said, "Protestant."

I said, "Me too! Are you Episcopalian or Baptist?"

He said, "Baptist!"

I said, "Wow! Me too! Are you Baptist Church of God or Baptist Church of the Lord?"

He said, "Baptist church of God!"

I said, "Me too! Are you original Baptist Church of God, or are you reformed Baptist Church of God?"

He said, "Reformed Baptist church of God!"

I said, "Me too! Are you Reformed Baptist Church of God, reformation of 1879, or Reformed Baptist Church of God, reformation of 1915?"

He said, "Reformed Baptist Church of God, reformation of 1915!"

I said, "Die, heretic scum", and pushed him off.​

 

[Fool]

Why don't you want to see that in Luke 22:42 Jesus is a man about to be tortured to death and so does not want that BUT because His Father wants it, Jesus conforms His will and actions to those of His God and Father?
So the will of God is the same as that of His Father.



How does doing what is God's will make you into the Way, the Truth and the Light?

the WAY, the TRUTH, and the Light are through LOVE. God is love. That is the will of god.


hosea 6:6

matthew 9:13


what you do unto the least of these, you have done unto me. I AM that i am

 

[syo]

so there are something like 40,000 denominations of christianity.


do you suppose that if there is this thing that abrahamic believers called god, that it has 40,000+ different wills?

Yes.

 

[Aštra’el]

What I believe… is that they are all tapping into the same force, Above and Within themselves. That there are many interpretations- through many individual and cultural lenses- is to be expected.

 

[Fool]

Yes.

god is a singular that you believe has a plural will?

 

[syo]

god is a singular that you believe has a plural will?

Yes.

 

[Sedim Haba]

...

so what is it? god's will?

Really his will? Genesis 6:6-7

And it repented the LORD that He had made man on the earth, and it grieved Him at His heart.
And the LORD said: 'I will blot out man whom I have created from the face of the earth; both man,
and beast, and creeping thing, and fowl of the air; for it repenteth Me that I have made them.'

Should never have given Noah the boat idea. Problem fixed.

 

[1213]

....
do you suppose that if there is this thing that abrahamic believers called god, that it has 40,000+ different wills?...

I believe God could allow people to have different practices and opinions, but they should not be in contradiction with the Bible. So, this depends on what are those alleged 40000 wills.

 

[Brian2]

the WAY, the TRUTH, and the Light are through LOVE. God is love. That is the will of god.


hosea 6:6

matthew 9:13


what you do unto the least of these, you have done unto me. I AM that i am

You have not answered my question.
"How does doing what is God's will make you into the Way, the Truth and the Light?"
John 14: 6 Jesus answered, “I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through Me.
Are you saying that we can come to the Father through you also?
Are you saying that you are Jesus?
Are you saying that you only Love and have no sin?
What are you saying?

 

[Brian2]

I returned to humanism several decades ago, and all of these religious enigmas resolved themselves. Why are there so many denominations? The believer has to dismiss these away as irrelevant, but the skeptic has an easy answer. Why do the biblical and scientific accounts vary so much? The apologist has his work cut out for him, but the humanist has an easy answer. Why are there apparent contradictions in the scripture? The believer needs his up-is-really-down toolbox, but the unbeliever has an easy answer. Why is there suffering that a good god capable of preventing has allowed to occur. The apologist has to go to work again with his verbal and moral gymnastics, but the atheist has an easy answer.

Are you familiar with Ptolemy's geocentric universe, which had the sun and planets orbiting the earth. There was a problem, though, called retrograde motion, or where a planet appears to stop in its orbit, reverse direction, then stop again and return to the original direction. Ptolemy worked out an elaborate system of epicycles to account for this motion. But the problem disappeared when Copernicus put the sun in the center. With earth and mars both orbiting the sun, but at different rates, Earth periodically lapped Mars creating the same illusion we see in a car passing another car, which now appears to be going backward on the road.

I like this comment:

• "When the philosopher's argument becomes tedious, complicated, and opaque, it is usually a sign that he is attempting to prove as true to the intellect what is plainly false to common sense" - Edward Abbey

For every answer humanism helps you avoid, it has other unanswered questions of it's own which you have no problem with.

So you separate out all of the theists who call themselves Christian from people with other beliefs, but stop there segregating them there so that you can present Christianity as a monolith. It's not. You can keep dividing over and over just as you divided one group of Abrahamic monotheists from the others. Those differences are often dramatic, such as whether to have a pope and worship saints or not, and they do matter to the critical thinker. Religion evolves like two other natural enterprises - biological evolution and the evolution of languages. Like religion, we get these trees of nesting hierarchies:

Christianity is divided, there is no denying that, but we all have the truth, Jesus. Smallish differences in beliefs do not mean that Jesus departs us even if it means that we are too proud stupid to recognise each other as parts of the one body of Christ.

 

[Fool]

Yes.

so you believe god has multiple spirits?

 

[Fool]

I believe God could allow people to have different practices and opinions, but they should not be in contradiction with the Bible. So, this depends on what are those alleged 40000 wills.

so you believe god has multiple spirits?