Again???

[Faithofchristian]

But it would be so much simpler and logical to spell it out. I mean God created us so he knows there are very stupid people out there.

Evidently not everyone is stupid.

 

[Curious George]

I'm with Thomas Jefferson who I quoted earlier...

While I really appreciate the two parts that you quoted (especially because they have a versatility that lends them to other situations). The cherry topping was that last line from your earlier quote:

I do not consider them as revelations of the Supreme Being, whom I would not so far blaspheme as to impute to Him a pretension of revelation, couched at the same time in terms which, He would know, were never tobe understood by those whom they were addressed.​

I never before took the time to appreciate the irony of calling something which no one can correctly interpret a revelation.

Perhaps this joke has been used frequently, but I had not heard it.

Thank you.

 

[David T]

Wise he was, for sure. TJ is one of my top 5 favorite Founders, the others being Paine, Madison, Adams, and Franklin.

Not sure I understand what you're curious about... Do you think I'm projecting? If so, explain.

No you aren't projecting. normal people project onto the text, and then project that onto nature. It's, weird to me now that I know that but such is life in normal world . We do it not just in religion as well. It's all very odd to me but I hike a lot more than most.

 

[Faithofchristian]

I have a story about a young man who wandered into.church because he was at a party sharing a.joint and they said to him go to church if you want.to start a business. Well this was a weird church a Quaker church. An hour of silence each week. He got to know them and thought they were decent.folk quakers mind you. No bible reading with them really. So one Sunday thus young dude decided hey I.might try this thing.for a month or so. Suddenly out of no where he was hit in.the head with what felt like a lighting bolt. After service he staggered.outside and the landscape.was.light up like a super saturated van gogh painting. That concept, idea, abstract became an experience. Well he thought what the hell he recognized it was neurology he wasn't completely stupid, but that begged the question what is the causality. So he decided hey this place must know what's going on with this experience. So he pivoted at the threshold that day, and turned his back on.the landscape went inside sat down and began.to try understand. Well he found the text hard part confusing and explanations confusing. He doubled down And went to college and got a degree in theology. But he was even.more confused than when he started..
That confusion was something he tried to to fix but it grew worse over time. Well it almost killed him. He had made a huge mistake and that was listening to others talk about something they don't understand. The confusion WAS his in listening to.then. eventually he got it right but boy it was a long journey for one second and one inch.

Years and years later he found himself on a mountain and there it happened. It took him many many years to understand what he needed to understand..as he began to shift out into the landscape his perspective he had the worst experience imaginable for him. The landscape itself revealed the new testament as true. Not as church understands it. He felt absolutely screwed because he realized his biggest hurdle was the faith. But that's how it goes you see. I

It says don't interpret it.

There's is no interpret to it, not when you let God do the interpretation of the book of Revelation. And you just the things together.
All it takes is common sense to know how Locust operate and Scorpions operate.

 

[Drizzt Do'Urden]

...The landscape itself revealed the new testament as true. ... he realized his biggest hurdle was the faith...

Well, that sounds poetic and all, but I'm just not buying it...

“It is a contradiction in terms and ideas, to call anything a revelation that comes to us at second-hand, either verbally or in writing. Revelation is necessarily limited to the first communication; after this, it is only an account of something which that person says was a revelation made to him; and though he may find himself obliged to believe it, it cannot be incumbent upon me to believe it in the same manner; for it was not a revelation made to me, and I have only his word for it that it was made to him.”
Thomas Paine, The Age of Reason

 

[TheBannerofHomuraAkemi]

Evidently not everyone is stupid.

But screw everyone else who can't understand it? Because surely that's what God wants. God only wants smart people to go to heaven.

 

[David T]

Well, that sounds poetic and all, but I'm just not buying it...

“It is a contradiction in terms and ideas, to call anything a revelation that comes to us at second-hand, either verbally or in writing. Revelation is necessarily limited to the first communication; after this, it is only an account of something which that person says was a revelation made to him; and though he may find himself obliged to believe it, it cannot be incumbent upon me to believe it in the same manner; for it was not a revelation made to me, and I have only his word for it that it was made to him.”
Thomas Paine, The Age of Reason

Funny I basically said, exactly what Paine said so....I would say while Paine may be limiting his, statement to religion I might say it's a good mentally healthy practice extended to more than the bible. And it's actually a very good approach in science as well. Although rarely practiced by most.

 

[Drizzt Do'Urden]

That all figures coming from a person who will criticze what they don't understand.

I don't think you get it... I understand that there isn't anything to understand in the "book", it's the ravings of a maniac. Cerinthus, the writer of Revelation, was flat nuts.

 

[David T]

There's is no interpret to it, not when you let God do the interpretation of the book of Revelation. And you just the things together.
All it takes is common sense to know how Locust operate and Scorpions operate.

That's a dangerous double speak that drives other people crazy. But hey atheists do it as well!!! Normal.

 

[Drizzt Do'Urden]

Funny I basically said, exactly what Paine said so....I would say while Paine may be limiting his, statement to religion I might say it's a good mentally healthy practice extended to more than the bible. And it's actually a very good approach in science as well. Although rarely practiced by most.

The statement wasn't against religion per se, I think it was more about the philosophical distinction between deism and theism. Theists believe god reveals himself via prophets who give other men these revelations, deists don't.

 

[Drizzt Do'Urden]

While I really appreciate the two parts that you quoted (especially because they have a versatility that lends them to other situations). The cherry topping was that last line from your earlier quote:

I do not consider them as revelations of the Supreme Being, whom I would not so far blaspheme as to impute to Him a pretension of revelation, couched at the same time in terms which, He would know, were never tobe understood by those whom they were addressed.​

I never before took the time to appreciate the irony of calling something which no one can correctly interpret a revelation.

Perhaps this joke has been used frequently, but I had not heard it.

Thank you.

You're welcome.

Another favorite of mine:

"The whole history of these books [the Gospels] is so defective and doubtful that it seems vain to attempt minute inquiry into it: and such tricks have been played with their text, and with the texts of other books relating to them, that we have a right, from that cause, to entertain much doubt what parts of them are genuine. In the New Testament there is internal evidence that parts of it have proceeded from an extraordinary man; and that other parts are of the fabric of very inferior minds. It is as easy to separate those parts, as to pick out diamonds from dunghills."

-Thomas Jefferson, letter to John Adams, January 24, 1814

 

[David T]

The statement wasn't against religion per se, I think it was more about the philosophical distinction between deism and theism. Theists believe god reveals himself via prophets who give other men these revelations, deists don't.

He is very right though. Go read the New " I challenge". Post. It's a "smart" guy a bit confused about what math is. It's a projection of topology mathematics onto nature. That has great value in lots of things like 3D which I am very fluent in, but I don't model up a female and then go " you are so hot will you marry me baby''''

 

[Drizzt Do'Urden]

He is very right though. Go read the New " I challenge". Post. It's a "smart" guy a bit confused about what math is. It's a projection of topology mathematics onto nature. That has great value in lots of things like 3D which I am very fluent in, but I don't model up a female and then go " you are so hot will you marry me baby''''

No doubt he's right... Have you read much of his works? Read the Age of Reason? They're all pretty quick reads, and he makes many good points in the telling of it.

Thomas Paine's The Age of Reason (<~~~~~clickable)

When Theodore Roosevelt termed Tom Paine a 'dirty little atheist' he surely spoke from lack of understanding. It was a stricture, an inaccurate charge of the sort that has dimmed the greatness of this eminent American. But the true measure of his stature will yet be appreciated. The torch which he handed on will not be extinguished. If Paine had ceased his writings with 'The Rights of Man' he would have been hailed today as one of the two or three outstanding figures of the Revolution. But 'The Age of Reason' cost him glory at the hands of his countrymen - a greater loss to THEM than to Tom Paine.

Thomas A. Edison, The Philosophy of Paine, June 7, 1925 - Diary and Sundry Observations of Thomas Alva Edison

 

[Sunstone]

Whenever someone says the world will end on a particular date, I believe them. Every time. And each time, I buy a six pack of cold beer, sit on my patio, and wait for the world to end. I'm never truly disappointed, so long as the beer lasts.

 

[Sunstone]

I suspect very few people who live passionately, who have fulfilling lives, are inclined to be suckered in by these "prophets" of doom. My guess is that the folks most vulnerable to them are the folks who feel discontent with their lives, who feel their lives are nothing special or worse than nothing special. Predictions of the world's end would seem to be most attractive to those of us looking for a way out of our mundane, routine lives.

 

[Jedster]

But they are consistent. ..they're always wrong.

.........phew, I am glad you said that, I have an important appointment on the 23rd.

 

[Faithofchristian]

But screw everyone else who can't understand it? Because surely that's what God wants. God only wants smart people to go to heaven.

Nope on the contrary God wants people who will listen to him and of course use their brain and common sense.
And that is not so quick to criticize and curse what they don't understand.

 

[Faithofchristian]

I don't think you get it... I understand that there isn't anything to understand in the "book", it's the ravings of a maniac. Cerinthus, the writer of Revelation, was flat nuts.

No I think you don't get it, that's why people like yourself, all you do is criticze what you don't understand.
Maybe instead criticzing, had you given it any thought that maybe it's not for you to understand.

 

[dfnj]

You're welcome.

Another favorite of mine:

"The whole history of these books [the Gospels] is so defective and doubtful that it seems vain to attempt minute inquiry into it: and such tricks have been played with their text, and with the texts of other books relating to them, that we have a right, from that cause, to entertain much doubt what parts of them are genuine. In the New Testament there is internal evidence that parts of it have proceeded from an extraordinary man; and that other parts are of the fabric of very inferior minds. It is as easy to separate those parts, as to pick out diamonds from dunghills."

-Thomas Jefferson, letter to John Adams, January 24, 1814

I always found this theory to be fascinating:

It's just crazy how the Gospel timeline matches Roman military victories!

 

[dfnj]

Ok, So someone is predicting the end again (well sort of). Anyway ,this fellow is once again setting a date for the Rapture, April 23. We should really talk about this on April 24. What do these people not get about Jesus saying no one knows the time ,only God knows. (paraphrased of course).

World to end on April 23 according to numerologist

The problem with numerology is it is a lot like nephelococcygia.