Alabama passes bill making some transgender healthcare a felony

[Guitar's Cry]

We are talking about minors.

Minors don't have full rights and that's just the way it is.

It's about preeventing child abuse and irresponsibility.

It's a good law.

I didn't see anything in the article specifying whether it took gaurdian permission into account.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

Well, I'm certainly not saying we don't know who we are by the time we're teens. Most of us do. I just think the minimum age for hormones and surgery should be 18. Permanently sterilizing kids looks bad, especially since they could end up regretting it. At least when you're an adult, if you don't like it, you were an adult making the decision.

People aren't finished developing at 18 yet either. But the body finishes before the brain, so, we have this nasty predicament that begins around the age of 10 or so and doesn't fully finish until the age of 25 or so if we are really to bring in any sort of adult/mentally better off sort of position.
At the bare minimum puberty blockers are needed and a must.

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

People aren't finished developing at 18 yet either. But the body finishes before the brain, so, we have this nasty predicament that begins around the age of 10 or so and doesn't fully finish until the age of 25 or so if we are really to bring in any sort of adult/mentally better off sort of position.
At the bare minimum puberty blockers are needed and a must.

I disagree that they're a must. None of these things are approved for how they're being used, whether blockers or hormones. It's off label use and there still aren't many long term studies on those things, even for adults. We don't know what the effects of not allowing a person to go through their natural puberty may be. This is experimental. It does cause issues with genital surgery later on, too, at least with trans women.

I just think 18 is an appropriate age because you're a legal adult and it's your responsibility.

 

[Regiomontanus]

It is. It's to prevent minors from being on puberty blockers, undergoing cross-sex hormone therapy and having sex change surgery. They've been doing this at increasingly younger ages; 12 is the youngest I've heard. I agree that minors shouldn't be allowed to make such irreversible medical decisions, especially when they cause permanent sterilization. 18 should be the minimum age. Adults should be allowed to do as they please with their body. Minors going on hormones and having sex change surgery was unheard of until about a decade ago, so this is totally unnecessary.

Yes, thank you.


God Bless

 

[ADigitalArtist]

Well, I'm certainly not saying we don't know who we are by the time we're teens. Most of us do. I just think the minimum age for hormones and surgery should be 18. Permanently sterilizing kids looks bad, especially since they could end up regretting it. At least when you're an adult, if you don't like it, you were an adult making the decision.

I had a breast reduction surgery as a minor. One I had both doctor and psychological evaluation before getting it done. I wasn't sterilized (well, not from that) but it did mean I'd never nurse, and would have some complications down the line, and some blather might call it mutilating a kid if they felt so dramatic.
But like with all healthcare, it's a help vs harm, and my doctors, my family and most importantly, I was willing to take the risk to remove the pain I was experiencing.

 

[Twilight Hue]

I didn't see anything in the article specifying whether it took gaurdian permission into account.

Even so it could still be prohibited by authorities.

 

[Twilight Hue]

You don't necessarily have to be an adult to make medical decisions about your body.
It's not a decision for your feelings. It's for a doctor and patient. Not you.

Like giving youth cigarettes and alcohol? You support that as well?

No some things are too invasive and permanent to leave it to a minor. That includes adult decisions made on minors.

18. Maybe 21. It's all good to proceed. It's not feelings. It's science.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

I disagree that they're a must. None of these things are approved for how they're being used, whether blockers or hormones. It's off label use and there still aren't many long term studies on those things, even for adults. We don't know what the effects of not allowing a person to go through their natural puberty may be. This is experimental. It does cause issues with genital surgery later on, too, at least with trans women.

I just think 18 is an appropriate age because you're a legal adult and it's your responsibility.

I still have concerns people will do this without medical supervision, which is high risk in itself.
If anything, it seems to he a harm reduction measurement for transitioning. And who's to say what life is like when arselings aren't constantly reminding us water is wet and treat us like an age-inappropriate threat who's out to molest women. Maybe life isn't so bad when we're constantly made out into some sort of boogeyman of ideological extremism and for more moments than we currently are allowed can forget we different and have other issues (like infertility).

 

[Guitar's Cry]

Even so it could still be prohibited by authorities.

Yes, but that means the bill isn't just getting between a minor and their doctor, it's getting between a minor, their doctor, and their legal guardians.

I am not convinced that this is just about "thinking of the children" and is more about being on-brand for conservative anti-LGBT legislation.

 

[Twilight Hue]

Yes, but that means the bill isn't just getting between a minor and their doctor, it's getting between a minor, their doctor, and their legal guardians.

I am not convinced that this is just about "thinking of the children" and is more about veing on-brand for conservative anti-LGBT legislation.

It's not a ban. I figure just put on a skirt or some pants for awhile until adulthood. See how it pans out first.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

Like giving youth cigarettes and alcohol? You support that as well?

Tobacco, that's absolutely ridiculous as it's highly addictive to everyone, especially deadly when commercial brands are smoked, and probably shouldn't be used by anyone other than those who medically benefit from it (that is more specifically the nicotine). So, in that case, I'd probably rather a teen with mild ADHD use a small amount of nicotine rather than methamphetamine or thisamine and thatamine this is prescribed for ADHD.
Alcohol, I do think we could lower the age limit like it is in other countries. But I also strongly believe we need a social push to encourage responsible alcohol consumption and discouraging the acceptance of casual alcohol abuse and consuming to the point of over dose.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

It's not a ban. I figure just put on a skirt or some pants for awhile until adulthood. See how it pans out first.

They get to watch their body irreversibly change all because some arseling they never met decided to make that decision for them.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

No some things are too invasive and permanent to leave it to a minor. That includes adult decisions made on minors.

Have you even taken any child psychology or lifespan development classes?

 

[fantome profane]

No its a decision for adults, not minors. Period.

Absolutely, that is not even the question.

It should be up to the parents in consultation with medical experts familiar with the situation.

It should not be up to politicians trying to get votes from bigots.

And make no mistake, that is exactly that bills like this are for, getting the bigot vote.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

I am not convinced that this is just about "thinking of the children" and is more about being on-brand for conservative anti-LGBT legislation.

That's all it is. The state has no place making medical decisions for people and their providers. They screamed about during the ACA debates, but they just kicked open a shut door, invaded a private session, and told doctors what they will and won't do and patients what treatment they will and won't receive. That also is in line with that "authoritarian" thing they are scared about. But they showed they are perfectly comfortable with removing freedoms and making decisions in places that are unethical and immoral for them to do so.

 

[F1fan]

I think its to assure that the decision is made with an adult mind to ensure its the right choice.

Minors do have that reputation of making poor choices for themselves while still young.

I think its to ensure its that of an adult person that makes that decision for themselves with a fully developed mind.

That would be my guess.

But a 10 year prison sentence?

 

[We Never Know]

No its a decision for adults, not minors. Period.

We should let minors decide whether they want to smoke or drink too. After all they know what they want and whats best for their body.

 

[F1fan]

That's all it is. The state has no place making medical decisions for people and their providers. They screamed about during the ACA debates, but they just kicked open a shut door, invaded a private session, and told doctors what they will and won't do and patients what treatment they will and won't receive. That also is in line with that "authoritarian" thing they are scared about. But they showed they are perfectly comfortable with removing freedoms and making decisions in places that are unethical and immoral for them to do so.

You illustrate the Jeckl and Hyde nature of the GOP today. They make horrible and intrusive laws while pretending they are doing it as a moral crusade. There's little moral about any of what they do these days. They want control over marginalized groups and women. States that allow abortion services are predicting a huge healthcare crisis with an influx of women seeking abortion service if Roe v Wade is overturned. There is a bit of panic setting in because no one is really prepared for the consequences of the SC decision. The existing laws on prohibiting abortion in many states will be valid immediately. A side effect of these prohibitions will be an expectation of women who attempt abortions on their own or with the help of another, and these women ending up in a medical emergency.

 

[Twilight Hue]

I'm under the impression it's abuse to not reaffirm someone's expressed gender identity.

Yes I agree, but when one is too young to make that life changing decision, it might be disastrous for that person to not be allowed make such a decision for him or herself with a fully mature mind.


It's just for that duration until declared an adult.

 

[Heyo]

Yes I agree, but when one is too young to make that life changing decision, it might be disastrous for that person to not be allowed make such a decision for him or herself with a fully mature mind.


It's just for that duration until declared an adult.

It's not. This is just a law to "own the libs".
If it were just for postponing the decision until 18, they wouldn't have included puberty blockers. Puberty blockers are for postponing the decision until 18.
Banning them is letting time make the decision for them.