Are human beings the most miserable animals?

[Spiderman]

How many other animals besides humans intentionally kill themselves. I was reading that suicides kill more Americans than motor vehicle accidents.

I knew a good looking girl who constantly cut herself and was covered in scar tissue from torso, limbs, to toe. what is it that motivates humans to hurt and disfigure themselves and not other animals?

 

[Nous]

How many other animals besides humans intentionally kill themselves. I was reading that suicides kill more Americans than motor vehicle accidents.

I knew a good looking girl who constantly cut herself and was covered in scar tissue from torso, limbs, to toe. what is it that motivates humans to hurt and disfigure themselves and not other animals?

I have heard reports by people claiming that dogs committed suicide. I don't know. I don't express an opinion on that.

It is apparently true that with our greater capacity for (or of) consciousness compared to other animals, we also have greater capacity to suffer. But perhaps we also have greater capacity to know and appreciate beauty and love. It certainly seems that we have greater capacity to do math and think logically, to understand or at least have a coherent and logical idea of stuff that happened 4 million years ago, before any of us existed.

Anyway, PopeADope, you might need to be banned from RF because your questions are often too difficult or too troubling--at least for me.

 

[Quintessence]

Other animals do engage in self-mutilation - this has been witnessed and known for decades. A decent popular article on the topic: Self-Harm in Animals: What We Can Learn From It

 

[ADigitalArtist]

Off topic but it's good to see you Pope. I hope things have improved in your situation since we saw you last.

 

[Nous]

Other animals do engage in self-mutilation - this has been witnessed and known for decades. A decent popular article on the topic: Self-Harm in Animals: What We Can Learn From It

And I've known some birds in captivity to pull their feathers out.

The article doesn't say whether this self-mutilating behavior is ever seen in the wild. I don't recall Jane Goodall ever mentioning it.

 

[Quintessence]

As for suicide in non-human animals, that's a more complicated question due to historical academic biases as well as the difficulty of communicating well enough with said animals to assess their internal states. Put another way, assessing intent in non-human animals is a challenge. In some respects, intent is besides the point - we often don't know if a human intended to kill itself either after the fact. I'd have to dig around in the literature a bit more, but from what I'm finding thus far, it's a poorly-researched area of non-human animal behavior.

 

[Quintessence]

And I've known some birds in captivity to pull their feathers out.

The article doesn't say whether this self-mutilating behavior is ever seen in the wild. I don't recall Jane Goodall ever mentioning it.

I don't know if this has been studied much, really. I've certainly seen critters with missing patches of fur and lost feathers, but without watching them constantly, can't say if it was in a spat with some other critter or self-caused. It'd be a challenging thing to track outside of captive environments.

On the whole, though, it is far more likely that the behavior has parallels in non-human animals than not. Humans are animals, and very little of what we have is original (if any of it).

 

[lewisnotmiller]

How many other animals besides humans intentionally kill themselves. I was reading that suicides kill more Americans than motor vehicle accidents.

I knew a good looking girl who constantly cut herself and was covered in scar tissue from torso, limbs, to toe. what is it that motivates humans to hurt and disfigure themselves and not other animals?

I suspect (counter intuitively) it takes a fair bit of intelligence to reach a level of introspection where suicide is even considered.

I've seen animals stop caring for themselves on the death of another, or take extreme protective behaviour (eg. Bees attacking to protect hive) but even though this could result in death, I would not categorize it as suicidal.

 

[sun rise]

I have heard reports by people claiming that dogs committed suicide. I don't know. I don't express an opinion on that.

It is apparently true that with our greater capacity for (or of) consciousness compared to other animals, we also have greater capacity to suffer. But perhaps we also have greater capacity to know and appreciate beauty and love. It certainly seems that we have greater capacity to do math and think logically, to understand or at least have a coherent and logical idea of stuff that happened 4 million years ago, before any of us existed.

Anyway, PopeADope, you might need to be banned from RF because your questions are often too difficult or too troubling--at least for me.

Humans have all possibilities inside them from best to worst as you outlined. There are, for example, sometimes animals will commit suicide Animal suicide - Wikipedia

(and nice to see you here, @PopeADope )

 

[1robin]

How many other animals besides humans intentionally kill themselves. I was reading that suicides kill more Americans than motor vehicle accidents.

I knew a good looking girl who constantly cut herself and was covered in scar tissue from torso, limbs, to toe. what is it that motivates humans to hurt and disfigure themselves and not other animals?

How do you quantify miserableness? How does a person gain access to how miserable any other being is?

Some things that might explain the specific dichotomies you posted are:

1. Human being have a brain which is the most complex arrangement of matter in the known universe. That being true I would expect that same brain to develop very complex problems.
2. God's favored race is humanity, Jesus didn't die to save dolphins or giraffes. So I would imagine that human beings are Satan's primary target heaping upon us every vile affliction his rebellious mind can contemplate.

 

[Revoltingest]

Humans tend to have unrealistic expectations.
Other critters live more for the moment.

 

[Geoff-Allen]

Here's a Walt Whitman poem ...

I Think I Could Turn And Live With Animals... By Walt Whitman: An Animal Rights Poem from All-Creatures.org

Nice to see you back!

Hope you're feeling better!

 

[David1967]

Hey pope! Great to have you back! Hope things are going well for you. As far as misery goes, I try my best to be a less miserable individual and hopefully not contribute to anyone else's misery.

 

[Dawnofhope]

How many other animals besides humans intentionally kill themselves. I was reading that suicides kill more Americans than motor vehicle accidents.

I knew a good looking girl who constantly cut herself and was covered in scar tissue from torso, limbs, to toe. what is it that motivates humans to hurt and disfigure themselves and not other animals?

Welcome back

 

[Deeje]

@PopeADope when you understand that we have no 'program' for the life we currently endure, it makes more sense that we cannot cope with what it throws at us on a regular basis....there's serious physical and mental illnesses and the suffering that goes with it....the death of loved ones, causing us to grieve deeply sometimes for years....poverty and all that goes with that.....natural disasters and the loss of property and precious possessions that are often irreplaceable...family breakdown and all that goes with that.....drug abuse...crime and violence.....terrorism.....and the list goes on......this is not the life God planned for us at the beginning.

Animals are not aware of what causes their problems...they just live in the moment and deal with a present danger. We are aware and it eats away at us when we see so much injustice and cruelty. Only humans can plan to kill maliciously. Only humans can be cruel for the sake of enjoying the suffering of their victim.


When humans stepped out from under the Creator's protection by their disobedience, they brought suffering, pain and death on the whole human race....we are not just the victims, but rather the hostages when the devil virtually 'kidnapped' us from God by offering the equivalent of candy to a child.

A ransom was demanded and it was unselfishly paid.....we are now waiting for our release so we can go home to our Father.

We are designed to live a wonderful life in paradise conditions with no sickness, old age or death to spoil our enjoyment of life. No wonder this life is so hard to endure. But there is hope....

Psalm 37:8-11.....

"Let go of anger and abandon rage;
Do not become upset and turn to doing evil.
9 For evil men will be done away with,
But those hoping in Jehovah will possess the earth.

10 Just a little while longer, and the wicked will be no more;
You will look at where they were,
And they will not be there.

11 But the meek will possess the earth,
And they will find exquisite delight in the abundance of peace."

Jesus said that "the meek shall inherit the earth"...we can be among them if we keep humble before God and obey him in all things.
Our obedience is all he has ever asked of us.

 

[Nous]

Humans have all possibilities inside them from best to worst as you outlined. There are, for example, sometimes animals will commit suicide Animal suicide - Wikipedia

That article is informative. I think I was referring to the dog who seemed hell-bent on drowning himself.

Non-human animals committing suicide puts the lie to that often heard claim that humans are the only animals conscious of our own mortality. I was always skeptical of that claim anyway--especially given the way elephants make such a to-do over the skeletons of elephants. And Jane Goodall tells of the behavior of chimpanzees who are grieving--especially mothers over babies that have died, and individuals that have lost their best friend. They're noticeably depressed and lethargic; sometimes they act out in unusual temperamental ways. It seems obvious that some animals grieve over the death of human companions. There are all kinds of stories of dogs following the funeral procession of his/her dead owner, and/or lying on the owner's grave for days or weeks or longer.

 

[Stevicus]

How many other animals besides humans intentionally kill themselves. I was reading that suicides kill more Americans than motor vehicle accidents.

I knew a good looking girl who constantly cut herself and was covered in scar tissue from torso, limbs, to toe. what is it that motivates humans to hurt and disfigure themselves and not other animals?

I'm not sure how it is with animals or how they perceive death. Of course, with some animals who are hurt or suffering, humans might take pity on them and "put them out of their misery." They might shoot an old farm horse or take an old dog to the vet to be "put to sleep." We don't do that with humans (although there have been a number of proponents for doctor-assisted suicide).

As to why humans do it, I suppose the reasons can vary depending on the individual. Perhaps the one common thread to it is that there's a human belief that death will somehow end whatever suffering they feel. I don't know if animals are able to formulate such a belief. I think animals might instinctively fear death and might still see it as worse than whatever suffering they might be going through. Humans seem to be more complicated in that regard.