Are Religions and Gods manmade?

[Saint Frankenstein]

Others know Man is the work of evolution. You can't call a scientific fact a belief.

You can accept evolution and still believe that the Gods created humanity. There's plenty of theistic evolutionists.

 

[Trailblazer]

How would you determine a messenger of God if the evidence was such that you cannot even demonstrate it to someone else?

The context of what I said is that people have to prove it to themselves, because otherwise it would not be their own belief, it would be something I convinced them was true.

Baha'u'llah wrote that we are all responsible for our own faith and He concluded by saying:
“For the faith of no man can be conditioned by any one except himself.” Gleanings, p. 143

So, even if I could convince people it was true, it would not be to their advantage.

The idea that a universal God would give messages to a person instead of giving everyone the knowledge internally or at least poofing a holy book into reality, maybe something that could not be duplicated by earthly means and would last forever?

If you really think about the logistics of that, you would realize how it could never work with humans in the real world. I have discussed this at length with many atheists and explained why it could never work.

Especially considering EVERY religion has a few prophets who get the secret God messages and tell every one else in the community. But we know that the majority of the thousands of other religions actually had people just making stuff up or basing it on other religions with slight changes.

If everyone realized that all revelations from God are time/date stamped, each one suited to the times in which they were revealed, the acrimony between religions would vanish, but since everyone insists in clinging to their own religion, the problems persist.

So we know it's a terrible way to pass on information. But no matter, God seems to think this is fine.
Regardless of all the BS channelers we have even right now. Bashar, Abraham Hicks and so on...

So prophets say things that wouldn't be a far stretch to imagine a smart person coming up with on their own. Yet still some people will consider this one to actually be the real one?

It is not so much about what they SAY, it is about what they DO. There are many false prophets, no wonder than why Jesus warned us to look out for them and not believe them. Jesus explained how to differentiate a true prophet from a false prophet, and that is where our powers of discernment enter in.

Matthew 7:15-20 Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves. Ye shall know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles? Even so every good tree bringeth forth good fruit; but a corrupt tree bringeth forth evil fruit. A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither can a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit. Every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire. Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them.

Fruits: the pleasant or successful result of work or actions: FRUIT | meaning in the Cambridge English Dictionary

 

[Trailblazer]

So, as long as their is a human claiming some god "revealed" things to him / her, you'll just believe it?

Sounds like extremely poor criteria. Great way to fall victim to con-man though.

I did not say that. I said:
The criteria I use is that any religion that was revealed by God through a Messenger is a real religion.

Of course I would not believe anyone who claimed to hear from God... I'd have to be an idiot to do so!

One has to distinguish between the true Messengers and the false ones and there is a way to do that.

 

[Trailblazer]

Proving your one is false isn't our job. It's your job.

Come up with any evidence your one is for real and we can all consider it.

Baha'u'llah is not false so I could never prove Him false...

I have posted what I consider the evidence many times so I see no reason to do it again..

 

[Trailblazer]

So show us what you read and see that convinces you.

I've read a lot.

 

[Trailblazer]

Which part? There were two parts to my post, 3,000 years or Man learning it's all fake.

Both parts I see as a good thing.

 

[Trailblazer]

What is it that makes you convinced your guy is communicating with god?

All the evidence I have posted on this forum so many times.

 

[Trailblazer]

So nothing concrete persuaded you. All you've done is present a word salad to justify your belief.

I said: I did not throw darts. I investigated Baha'u'llah and determined for myself that He was a Messenger of God and then I believed that He was one. That is concrete.

 

[Hockeycowboy]

All religions are religions created by men/women. None are created by a god

Yes. 99.999%.

 

[PAUL MARKHAM]

You can accept evolution and still believe that the Gods created humanity. There's plenty of theistic evolutionists.

Evolution is a fact so accepting it is only common sense. God is a belief acceptance is down to the individual.

People who accept evolution have to disbelieve all the creation stories religion dreamed up.

Now can we move onto other bible stories that are myths?

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

Evolution is a fact so accepting it is only common sense. God is a belief acceptance is down to the individual.

People who accept evolution have to disbelieve all the creation stories religion dreamed up.

Now can we move onto other bible stories that are myths?

Myths aren't supposed to be taken literally. They're symbolic.

I wasn't talking about the Bible in the first place. Go talk to someone else if that's what you want as I don't follow an Abrahamic religion.

 

[PAUL MARKHAM]

Baha'u'llah is not false so I could never prove Him false...

I have posted what I consider the evidence many times so I see no reason to do it again..

You posted one encounter that could be a dream.

Then from that one encounter, Bahaullah took it upon himself to churn out 1,400 tablets!!! That's the part I really doubt. Many of his writings are flowery gobblygook, political predictions with little foresight and plain wrong. He thinks the bible is the word of god and isn't the word of god, he predicts the rise and fall of empires which has been going on for Millenium, life on all planets, etc.

 

[PAUL MARKHAM]

I said: I did not throw darts. I investigated Baha'u'llah and determined for myself that He was a Messenger of God and then I believed that He was one. That is concrete.

Concreate for you but not for billions of others.

 

[PAUL MARKHAM]

Myths aren't supposed to be taken literally. They're symbolic.

I wasn't talking about the Bible in the first place. Go talk to someone else if that's what you want as I don't follow an Abrahamic religion.

I agree with you about myths shouldn't be taken as fact. Deciding what's a myth and a fact is a problem for some. I'm an atheist.

 

[Trailblazer]

You posted one encounter that could be a dream.

Then from that one encounter, Bahaullah took it upon himself to churn out 1,400 tablets!!! That's the part I really doubt. Many of his writings are flowery gobblygook, political predictions with little foresight and plain wrong. He thinks the bible is the word of god and isn't the word of god, he predicts the rise and fall of empires which has been going on for Millenium, life on all planets, etc.

No, I am not referring to what I have posted to you since you came to RF, because I do not consider that to be evidence for Baha'u'llah...

And as I keep telling you, it is 15,000 Tablets, not 1,400.

 

[Trailblazer]

Concrete for you but not for billions of others.

That's too bad, but....

Matthew 7:13-14 Enter through the narrow gate. For wide is the gate and broad is the road that leads to destruction, and many enter through it. But small is the gate and narrow the road that leads to life, and only a few find it.

And there are many reasons why only a few find the small gate and the narrow road if you want to hear them.

 

[PAUL MARKHAM]

No, I am not referring to what I have posted to you since you came to RF, because I do not consider that to be evidence for Baha'u'llah...

And as I keep telling you, it is 15,000 Tablets, not 1,400.

Sorry typo I meant to write 14,000. Thank you for helping me out.

So did he write 15,000 tablets based on one visit/encounter/message?

This goes for all the messengers not just Bahaullah.

 

[PAUL MARKHAM]

That's too bad, but....

Matthew 7:13-14 Enter through the narrow gate. For wide is the gate and broad is the road that leads to destruction, and many enter through it. But small is the gate and narrow the road that leads to life, and only a few find it.

And there are many reasons why only a few find the small gate and the narrow road if you want to hear them.

I'm not a believer in gate/heaven/hell gate superstition. I'm not going to worry about it, if I'm worthy or gloat that others aren't and I am. I believe when I die, that's it the lights get turned off. I'm 70, cancer survivor, lost both kidneys, had 2 heart attacks, very frail and lucky to see out every year.

 

[Trailblazer]

I'm not a believer in gate/heaven/hell gate superstition. I'm not going to worry about it, if I'm worthy or gloat that others aren't and I am. I believe when I die, that's it the lights get turned off. I'm 70, cancer survivor, lost both kidneys, had 2 heart attacks, very frail and lucky to see out every year.

I was not suggesting that you worry about the afterlife.... It will be what it will be and none of us really knows what it will be. The point of my post was that only a few recognize the Baha'i Faith, and there are reasons for that.

 

[Bird123]

I do not believe we can ever know or understand God's actions so I do not believe that is the way we can know God.

Nevertheless that is what you believe and you have a right to your beliefs.
What you have is a belief for the simple reason that it can never be proven.
What I have is also a belief, a religious belief, and that is why I never present it as a fact.

But you are in luck, because I have no time to discuss this, nor do I want to cover terrain that has already been covered, nor do I want beliefs to drive a wedge in between us.

What a person Believes is often what a person becomes. Since you believe you can never know God, you would not even try.

What I have is a Fact. Since you do not have the evidence, it can only be a belief or non-belief up until you Discover the Truth for yourself. I merely point the way since I do not want you to value beliefs. It all rests in your hands.

Why do you deem me lucky that you do not want to discuss things? Realize I am Unconditional. There is nothing you could do that would place any wedge between us.