Are Religions really about God????

[arthra]

In my view "religion" comes about after "revelation"...

So if you look at the great religions most have an encounter with the Divine of one kind or another. By "Divine" I mean God... The process begins with an experience of revelation.. There's a point at which this starts. Buddha meditating under the Bo Tree... Moses by the Burning Bush... Christ being baptized by John received the Holy Spirit which is followed by a sojourne in the wilderness... Muhammad in the cave of Mount Hira has a visitation with Gabriel... and so on.

After the revelation a number of affects occur.. The response of people will vary.. Religious authorities will be suspicious and try to control and eliminate the new revelation. Usually there are a series of new laws or perspectives that flow from the revelation. The revelations are recorded or remembered over time and preserved over time.

Many of the new laws relate to social conditions and capacities of the country or area in which they are revealed.... Usually there are variations in the culture and language the new revelation is expressed in.

Over time you can see a progression from revelation to revelation and a tendency to recognize basic human ethics and a direction to alleviate suffering in context.

You can also see how various civilizations were influenced by religions... After Emperor Asoka became Buddhist there was an impact on India. Christianity had influence in Europe. Islam had influence on the development of civilization as well...and I believe this process is ongoing.

 

[Ingledsva]

...The religions stemming from ancient Babylon often teach an immortal soul, a death-proof soul....

So other then religious prejudice - the only thing that makes the Babylonian religion wrong is that they believe the soul to be immortal?

Most Christians believe the same thing. Most Christians believe the good souls will go to heaven forever, and the bad souls will be in hell forever.

*

 

[Ingledsva]

Ancient Israel was Never part of or in the slave-trade business.
There were No debtors prisons in ancient Israel
A person could pay off a debt by being a slave ( who was to be treated as hired help ) for only up to 7 years.- Leviticus 25:39-40
Also, didn't the Jubilee Year set slaves free ?_________ -Leviticus 25:13

Mostly incorrect. We have had several discussions on this topic.

The Hebrew could only keep other Hebrew as indentured servants.

Only Hebrew indentured servants were set free on Jubilee.

ALL Other people could be bought as slaves, raped, bred, and passed on to children as an inheritance, - forever.

They were in fact still in the slave trade in the years leading up to the Civil War.

Lev 25:45 Moreover of the children of the strangers that do sojourn among you, of them shall ye buy, and of their families that are with you, which they begat in your land: and they shall be your possession.

Lev 25:46 And you shall take them for inheritance to your sons after you, to hold for a possession; you may enslave them forever. But on your brothers, the sons of Israel, one over another, you shall not rule over him with severity.

*

 

[Bird123]

I cherry picked the item to answer....

Religion is about Man's relationship to God.....true
but it's suppose to bring out the spirit of Man

Perhaps religion does bring out who man really is after all. That is not necessarily a bad thing. Will not each and everyone's actions show the world and God what each needs to learn?

 

[Bird123]

In my view "religion" comes about after "revelation"...

So if you look at the great religions most have an encounter with the Divine of one kind or another. By "Divine" I mean God... The process begins with an experience of revelation.. There's a point at which this starts. Buddha meditating under the Bo Tree... Moses by the Burning Bush... Christ being baptized by John received the Holy Spirit which is followed by a sojourne in the wilderness... Muhammad in the cave of Mount Hira has a visitation with Gabriel... and so on.

After the revelation a number of affects occur.. The response of people will vary.. Religious authorities will be suspicious and try to control and eliminate the new revelation. Usually there are a series of new laws or perspectives that flow from the revelation. The revelations are recorded or remembered over time and preserved over time.

Many of the new laws relate to social conditions and capacities of the country or area in which they are revealed.... Usually there are variations in the culture and language the new revelation is expressed in.

Over time you can see a progression from revelation to revelation and a tendency to recognize basic human ethics and a direction to alleviate suffering in context.

You can also see how various civilizations were influenced by religions... After Emperor Asoka became Buddhist there was an impact on India. Christianity had influence in Europe. Islam had influence on the development of civilization as well...and I believe this process is ongoing.

Yes, the Evolution of Religion continues. It does seem like there is a long way to go.

 

[URAVIP2ME]

and they should be able to....so to speak...
God created Man as a reflection....so to speak

As a reflection of 'God's image ' in that God's main attributes of Love, justice, mercy and wisdom can be reflected in us although in varying degrees.

 

[URAVIP2ME]

So other then religious prejudice - the only thing that makes the Babylonian religion wrong is that they believe the soul to be immortal?
Most Christians believe the same thing. Most Christians believe the good souls will go to heaven forever, and the bad souls will be in hell forever.
*

Yes, the teachings of Christendom's clergy class often teach good souls to heaven, and bad souls to a forever hell.
Sinning Adam became a ' bad soul ' but Adam simply ' returned ' to the dust of the ground according to Genesis 3:19
A person can Not ' return ' to a place he never was before.
Adam became a ' living soul ' or person according to Genesis 2:7. Adam did Not possess a soul, nor come to have a soul, rather Adam was a soul, a living soul or person.
So, Adam went from non-life, to life, and returned back to non-life. No post-mortem penalty for father Adam.

If biblical hell was a forever place then No one could ever get out of the Bible's hell.
Doesn't biblical hell come to a final end according to Revelation 20:13-14 ?_______
After everyone is ' delivered up ' (KJV ) out of the Bible's hell, then emptied-out hell is cast vacant into a symbolic ' second death ' for vacated hell.
So, biblical hell is Not a forever place. Even 'enemy death ' is Not forever because enemy death comes to a final end according to 1 Corinthians 15:26
Can anyone righteous go to hell ? _______
The day Jesus died Jesus went to hell according to Acts of the Apostles 2:27; Psalms 16:10
Jesus taught sleep in death - John 11:14
Jesus was well educated in the old Hebrew Scriptures which also teach sleep in death:
Such as: Psalms 6:5; Psalms 13:3; Psalms 115:17; Psalms 146:4; Daniel 12:2; Daniel 12:13; Ecclesiastes 9:5
So, the Bible's hell is simply mankind's temporary stone-cold grave for the unconscious dead.
Some are called resurrected to heaven to govern with Christ over Earth - Revelation 20:6; Revelation 2:10; Revelation 5:9-10
The majority of mankind will have a happy-and-healthy physical resurrection during Christ's millennium-long day of governing over Earth.
That is when mankind on Earth will see the return of the Genesis ' tree of life ' on Earth for the healing of Earth's nations - Revelation 22:2; Isaiah 33:24
Those ' good souls ' (people) will have the same original opportunity offered to Adam before his downfall to live forever on Earth. - Matthew 5:5; Proverbs 2:21-22
So, what the Bible really teaches is: Heaven for some, and most to end up living forever on a beautiful paradisical Earth.

 

[Ingledsva]

Yes, the teachings of Christendom's clergy class often teach good souls to heaven, and bad souls to a forever hell.
Sinning Adam became a ' bad soul ' but Adam simply ' returned ' to the dust of the ground according to Genesis 3:19
A person can Not ' return ' to a place he never was before.
Adam became a ' living soul ' or person according to Genesis 2:7. Adam did Not possess a soul, nor come to have a soul, rather Adam was a soul, a living soul or person.
So, Adam went from non-life, to life, and returned back to non-life. No post-mortem penalty for father Adam.

If biblical hell was a forever place then No one could ever get out of the Bible's hell.
Doesn't biblical hell come to a final end according to Revelation 20:13-14 ?_______
After everyone is ' delivered up ' (KJV ) out of the Bible's hell, then emptied-out hell is cast vacant into a symbolic ' second death ' for vacated hell.
So, biblical hell is Not a forever place. Even 'enemy death ' is Not forever because enemy death comes to a final end according to 1 Corinthians 15:26
Can anyone righteous go to hell ? _______
The day Jesus died Jesus went to hell according to Acts of the Apostles 2:27; Psalms 16:10
Jesus taught sleep in death - John 11:14
Jesus was well educated in the old Hebrew Scriptures which also teach sleep in death:
Such as: Psalms 6:5; Psalms 13:3; Psalms 115:17; Psalms 146:4; Daniel 12:2; Daniel 12:13; Ecclesiastes 9:5
So, the Bible's hell is simply mankind's temporary stone-cold grave for the unconscious dead.
Some are called resurrected to heaven to govern with Christ over Earth - Revelation 20:6; Revelation 2:10; Revelation 5:9-10
The majority of mankind will have a happy-and-healthy physical resurrection during Christ's millennium-long day of governing over Earth.
That is when mankind on Earth will see the return of the Genesis ' tree of life ' on Earth for the healing of Earth's nations - Revelation 22:2; Isaiah 33:24
Those ' good souls ' (people) will have the same original opportunity offered to Adam before his downfall to live forever on Earth. - Matthew 5:5; Proverbs 2:21-22
So, what the Bible really teaches is: Heaven for some, and most to end up living forever on a beautiful paradisical Earth.

You don't seem to understand what people are saying to you. You just keep quoting your scripture. You have no proof those scriptures are from God, or if there even is a God.

*

 

[Guy Threepwood]

Perhaps, if one considers that religion is mankind's attempt to understand God.

Let's consider some real issues. Religions have holy books that they say come from God, inspired by God or from a messenger of God. Further, could anyone count how many people are claiming to speak for God, or telling you what God wants or telling you what choices you should make?

OK, let's look at the Real world where God's actions can be seen and can not be altered by mankind. Did God give you a message telling you how to live? No. Now, if God can give messages to these religious people, can't God send those messages to everyone? Next, did God give everyone His holy book? I didn't get my copy. Besides, God is so smart, wouldn't He just implant that holy book in our minds at birth? After all, why would God want printers, paper, and books that people could alter?

Perhaps, God has no rules at all. God doesn't want to intimidate or influence our free choices. Don't the consequences teach us whether our choices are good or not? Isn't mankind the only one attempting to rule?

Does it seem that God never does anything? Are people blind to God's action in favor of what they want to see? Let me give you a couple of God's actions so you can see just how God operates. First, since this is a physical world, God needs bodies to place souls into. For automation purposes, God leaves that up to mankind to do. Does God make a bunch of commandments and rules? No. God makes sex so good, everybody is doing it. It will never matter if religions or societies label sex as bad. The kids will keep coming. Second, since this world is a multilevel classroom. interaction is a key part of the learning process. Does God make a bunch or rules or commandments? No. If one avoids interaction, one grows lonely. Try staying away from everyone and not interact. I don't know anyone who can. Think about this. Isn't this High intelligence at work??

Clearly, God does not act like religions are teaching. Since religions are the creation of mankind, they are a reflection of mankind. Mankind is capable of Love and Kindness. That is reflected in religions. Mankind is capable of being greedy, judgmental, condemning, hating, controlling, ruling,intimidating and coercing. That is reflected in religions.

God must be above all those negative petty things because you see no action of them from Him.

This leads me to the question. If one is truly on the path to be like God, can one really follow religions? And religion seems to be the single greatest source people depend on to discover God. At some point, won't a person have to rise above the condemning, judging, controlling. hating, and such in order to rise to a High Level? Perhaps one can keep the Love and Kindness part and move on.

In conclusion, I don't see Religion is about God. I see Religion is about mankind. In the end, I see Religion is no more nor no less than a catalyst which brings out so many problems of mankind to the surface so they have to be dealt with. After all, when one thinks they have God's backing, they won't hold anything back. Look around, Isn't it all coming out?

I think a lot of that is answered by free will.

If you could plant a chip in somebody's head, that forced them to love you, made them incapable of any wrongdoing, would you do it? Tempting, but you would soon realize that you have destroyed any real chance of true love or goodness in that person, right?

Those things cannot be mandated, there has to be a choice to do otherwise or they are meaningless.

So of course evil exists in religious cultures, as evil exists in humanity and we are all sinners, But before Christianity,before organized religions, many things were simply not even recognized, far less recorded, combated as evil at all. Religion, the Bible, spread a message that altered the culture of the majority of modern civilization/ humanity so fundamentally that we take it for granted now. It's hard for most of us to imagine when 'doing unto others as you would have them do unto you' was a genuinely novel concept.

 

[Bird123]

I think a lot of that is answered by free will.

If you could plant a chip in somebody's head, that forced them to love you, made them incapable of any wrongdoing, would you do it? Tempting, but you would soon realize that you have destroyed any real chance of true love or goodness in that person, right?

Those things cannot be mandated, there has to be a choice to do otherwise or they are meaningless.

So of course evil exists in religious cultures, as evil exists in humanity and we are all sinners, But before Christianity,before organized religions, many things were simply not even recognized, far less recorded, combated as evil at all. Religion, the Bible, spread a message that altered the culture of the majority of modern civilization/ humanity so fundamentally that we take it for granted now. It's hard for most of us to imagine when 'doing unto others as you would have them do unto you' was a genuinely novel concept.

Yes, free will is a must. Yes, with free choice, there comes bad choices. That is part of the learning process. You might be right that religion is also a part of the civilization process. The joining together, the keeping records, the sharing of knowledge, all are part of the progress of mankind forward.

Mankind does bring who they are to the table in religion as well as to the world. Perhaps the things that bother me are: 1. They claim to know it all and refuse to acknowledge or to correct the errors. 2 They use the petty things mankind values such as hate, greed, intimidation, coercion, ruling, and controlling, all in an attempt to gain followers toward beliefs and not toward facts. What makes it worse, they do it in God's name.

On the other hand, all is not lost. Religion has also generated Love, Goodness, and Helpfulness. In the end, it is all part of the learning process. I guess it will always be hard to watch others learn the lessons one has already completed. The only thing to do is point them in the right direction.

 

[URAVIP2ME]

You don't seem to understand what people are saying to you. You just keep quoting your scripture. You have no proof those scriptures are from God, or if there even is a God.
*

Aren't people saying what clergy teach is Scripture ?________
Especially when the Jews began mixing with the Greeks they adopted their philosophies and theories and started to teach that as Scripture.
So, often what the clergy teach is Not what the Bible really teaches.
In other words, what the clergy often teach is Not Scripture, but rather church traditions or church customs outside of Scripture but just being taught as if found in Scripture.
Also, since it can Not be proven there is No God, then believing there is No God is the exercise of 'faith' in the non-existence of God.

 

[Sonofason]

Perhaps, if one considers that religion is mankind's attempt to understand God.

Let's consider some real issues. Religions have holy books that they say come from God, inspired by God or from a messenger of God. Further, could anyone count how many people are claiming to speak for God, or telling you what God wants or telling you what choices you should make?

OK, let's look at the Real world where God's actions can be seen and can not be altered by mankind. Did God give you a message telling you how to live? No. Now, if God can give messages to these religious people, can't God send those messages to everyone? Next, did God give everyone His holy book? I didn't get my copy. Besides, God is so smart, wouldn't He just implant that holy book in our minds at birth? After all, why would God want printers, paper, and books that people could alter?

Perhaps, God has no rules at all. God doesn't want to intimidate or influence our free choices. Don't the consequences teach us whether our choices are good or not? Isn't mankind the only one attempting to rule?

Does it seem that God never does anything? Are people blind to God's action in favor of what they want to see? Let me give you a couple of God's actions so you can see just how God operates. First, since this is a physical world, God needs bodies to place souls into. For automation purposes, God leaves that up to mankind to do. Does God make a bunch of commandments and rules? No. God makes sex so good, everybody is doing it. It will never matter if religions or societies label sex as bad. The kids will keep coming. Second, since this world is a multilevel classroom. interaction is a key part of the learning process. Does God make a bunch or rules or commandments? No. If one avoids interaction, one grows lonely. Try staying away from everyone and not interact. I don't know anyone who can. Think about this. Isn't this High intelligence at work??

Clearly, God does not act like religions are teaching. Since religions are the creation of mankind, they are a reflection of mankind. Mankind is capable of Love and Kindness. That is reflected in religions. Mankind is capable of being greedy, judgmental, condemning, hating, controlling, ruling,intimidating and coercing. That is reflected in religions.

God must be above all those negative petty things because you see no action of them from Him.

This leads me to the question. If one is truly on the path to be like God, can one really follow religions? And religion seems to be the single greatest source people depend on to discover God. At some point, won't a person have to rise above the condemning, judging, controlling. hating, and such in order to rise to a High Level? Perhaps one can keep the Love and Kindness part and move on.

In conclusion, I don't see Religion is about God. I see Religion is about mankind. In the end, I see Religion is no more nor no less than a catalyst which brings out so many problems of mankind to the surface so they have to be dealt with. After all, when one thinks they have God's backing, they won't hold anything back. Look around, Isn't it all coming out?

Religion is not just about God. And religion is not just about man. Religion is about man's perceived relationship with God.