Are there any socialists here?

[Mathematician]

As I mentioned in another thread, I'm debating with myself if I'm just another far-left liberal or a socialist. I was wondering if there are any socialists here, and if so what brought about your transformation in a capitalist society?

I also have more questions, but I'll reserve them for later.

 

[lombas]

I am one of the following:

- Agorist
- Anarchist
- Anarcho-capitalist
- Anarcho-syndicalist
- Distributionist
- Individualist Anarchist
- Libertarian
- Libertarian Socialist

(list not complete)

 

[standing_alone]

I tend to consider myself a democratic socialist, but I also debate with myself if I'm just a far-left liberal or a socialist--or if there is really any difference between a far-left liberal and a democratic socialist. However, since we live in a capitalistic society, I feel we must work within capitalism to ease unnecessary inequality, rather than dismantle the capitalist system entirely. How did I come to accept a more democratic socialist ideology in a capitalistic society? I live in (what was) an industrial town and as the factories left to exploit cheaper labor in Latin America, I saw how those hard-working Americans (who spent the majority of their working lives working their butts off for those factories lost their jobs) were disregarded. My mother also works in the public schools (not as a teacher, she has no college degree, but does comparable work to a college-educated teacher) and if it wasn't for the union she is a member of (and was president of for a time), they wouldn't have anywhere near the pay and benefits they have now. I, myself, have also worked in a factory, and seeing how hard people are working to only be paid eight dollars an hour with no benefits at all also seemed very wrong to me; it's hard to live on eight dollars an hour and then to not even have any form of health insurance... I believe workers should be treated with respect and dignity and that the work place (while still having hierarchy to maintain order) should be a more democratic place. Heck, if the factory would have let us workers have more of a say, I bet that factory would have ran a hell of a lot smoother because those in charge demanded we do stuff that was counter-productive. This is just an introduction to why I consider myself a democratic socialist.

 

[Guitar's Cry]

I'm actually not sure if I'm a socialist. I think I may be bordering on it, though.

Honestly, I think the state of capitalism in this country is a bit skewed. While I do believe that private ownership of the economy is the best way to go, I think it needs to be more democratic than it currently is. Right now, the control of the economy is primarily in the hands of a few big businesses (or, that is how it seems to be). The distribution of wealth is becoming increasingly narrow.

 

[Mathematician]

I tend to consider myself a democratic socialist, but I also debate with myself if I'm just a far-left liberal or a socialist--or if there is really any difference between a far-left liberal and a democratic socialist. However, since we live in a capitalistic society, I feel we must work within capitalism to ease unnecessary inequality, rather than dismantle the capitalist system entirely. How did I come to accept a more democratic socialist ideology in a capitalistic society? I live in (what was) an industrial town and as the factories left to exploit cheaper labor in Latin America, I saw how those hard-working Americans (who spent the majority of their working lives working their butts off for those factories lost their jobs) were disregarded. My mother also works in the public schools (not as a teacher, she has no college degree, but does comparable work to a college-educated teacher) and if it wasn't for the union she is a member of (and was president of for a time), they wouldn't have anywhere near the pay and benefits they have now. I, myself, have also worked in a factory, and seeing how hard people are working to only be paid eight dollars an hour with no benefits at all also seemed very wrong to me; it's hard to live on eight dollars an hour and then to not even have any form of health insurance... I believe workers should be treated with respect and dignity and that the work place (while still having hierarchy to maintain order) should be a more democratic place. Heck, if the factory would have let us workers have more of a say, I bet that factory would have ran a hell of a lot smoother because those in charge demanded we do stuff that was counter-productive. This is just an introduction to why I consider myself a democratic socialist.

Interesting post. I find myself agreeing with your point about working within the capitalist society, though I'm left to wonder when the next big transition in human interactions will come.

 

[Mathematician]

I am one of the following:

- Agorist
- Anarchist
- Anarcho-capitalist
- Anarcho-syndicalist
- Distributionist
- Individualist Anarchist
- Libertarian
- Libertarian Socialist

(list not complete)

Libertarian socialism -- interesting.

 

[UnityNow101]

Early Christianity was kind of some sort of socialism. Believers lived together within little communities and would share the wealth among each other, thus demolishing the extremes between rich and poor within their small communities. I would say that I am border-line socialist and am definantely anti-capitalistic. The problem is, capitalism is what our country is founded upon and is what keeps the country on top of the world. Capitalistic imperialism is what the good 'ol USA stands for.

 

[The Seeker]

I live in (what was) an industrial town and as the factories left to exploit cheaper labor in Latin America, I saw how those hard-working Americans (who spent the majority of their working lives working their butts off for those factories lost their jobs) were disregarded.

I don't consider myself a socialist but am somewhat anti-capitalist due to the above example. Capitalism in this country has always exploited varying groups of people simply because they would work for cheap. I would personally like to see taxes raised on the wealthy (not too extreme, but say around 40% - 50%) and have that extra money go to health care, housing and education so that everyone in this country could have an equal opportunity to share in the wealth of this nation.

 

[Ciscokid]

Early Christianity was kind of some sort of socialism. Believers lived together within little communities and would share the wealth among each other, thus demolishing the extremes between rich and poor within their small communities. I would say that I am border-line socialist and am definantely anti-capitalistic. The problem is, capitalism is what our country is founded upon and is what keeps the country on top of the world. Capitalistic imperialism is what the good 'ol USA stands for.

I'd bet socialism would work great in a small community like the one you describe.

 

[PureX]

I'm a socialist in that I believe that essential production and services should belong to the communities they serve. Otherwise, they become monopolies that exploit the communities they're supposed to be serving for the profits of a few. All that Regan-era deregulation was a very bad idea that has resulted in countless public utilities being turned over to private profiteers who are now seriously gouging the communities they serve and are causing real suffering for a lot of people just so that a few unscrupulous pigs can become very rich. Free markets work fine for any products or services that people don't have to buy. But for products and services that people must have to live in such an integrated and specialized society, these need to be community owned and operated. I'm referring to items like food, clothing, shelter, energy, transportation, and communication.

 

[RevOxley_501]

<socialist



why? because we are all really equal and should be treated as such

 

[Yerda]

As I mentioned in another thread, I'm debating with myself if I'm just another far-left liberal or a socialist.

You can be both.

I was wondering if there are any socialists here, and if so what brought about your transformation in a capitalist society?

I'm a socialist.

My transformation came about as a high school rebelliousness. I used to argue for communism in Modern Studies class just to be against everyone else. I ended up a Manifesto spouting Marxist. I cringe at the thought....

 

[Faminedynasty]

Yeah, I'm a socialist. Becauase my sympathies generally side with the worker rather than the CEO. My view has been influenced by witnessing one of the biggest class divides in history and the death of organized American labor.

 

[Darkness]

Libertarian socialism

Let it be known that Libertarian Socialism is different from Libertarianism, despite the name. (I believe it is technically a form of Socialism, not Libertarianism) I am a Libertarian and Libertarianism believes in freedom of the people; freedom to have possessions of your own. Libertarian Socialism is the belief that all people should be forcefully equalize. That is repugnant to us Libertarians. We believe everyone should have an "equal" opportunity to better themselves, which is vastly different to forced equalization.

 

[PureX]

Let it be known that Libertarian Socialism is different from Libertarianism, despite the name. (I believe it is technically a form of Socialism, not Libertarianism) I am a Libertarian and Libertarianism believes in freedom of the people; freedom to have possessions of your own. Libertarian Socialism is the belief that all people should be forcefully equalize. That is repugnant to us Libertarians. We believe everyone should have an "equal" opportunity to better themselves, which is vastly different to forced equalization.

I don't believe that socialism demands that everyone must be "equalized". I don't even believe that communism demands that. I believe that's basically a "red herring" that pro-capitolists like to throw out there to essentially slander socialists.

My understanding of socialism is that it involves collective ownership and control of some economic assets and endeavors. That doesn't have anything to do with "forced equalization" that I can see.

 

[lombas]

I am a libertarian as well, but the discussion is quite different from the mere "forced equalization" thing. The question is about people.

I am a libertarian, an agorist, a left-libertarian, a Bastiat fan, a libertarian socialist, an anarcho-syndicalist, an anarcho-capitalist, I'm anything libertarian you want.

And I believe any true libertarian understands why I am all those things, and not merely a "libertarian capitalist". To be a mere libertarian capitalist is good, but not libertarian enough.

 

[Mathematician]

I'm a socialist in that I believe that essential production and services should belong to the communities they serve. Otherwise, they become monopolies that exploit the communities they're supposed to be serving for the profits of a few. All that Regan-era deregulation was a very bad idea that has resulted in countless public utilities being turned over to private profiteers who are now seriously gouging the communities they serve and are causing real suffering for a lot of people just so that a few unscrupulous pigs can become very rich. Free markets work fine for any products or services that people don't have to buy. But for products and services that people must have to live in such an integrated and specialized society, these need to be community owned and operated. I'm referring to items like food, clothing, shelter, energy, transportation, and communication.

Interesting. In regard to your statements about the socializing the essentials and allowing other stuff go through the capitalist market, I see that as a good compromise. However, you mentioned food -- food is a huge market in the United States. Do you mean providing the poor with food money, or taking control of the current food market?

 

[PureX]

Interesting. In regard to your statements about the socializing the essentials and allowing other stuff go through the capitalist market, I see that as a good compromise. However, you mentioned food -- food is a huge market in the United States. Do you mean providing the poor with food money, or taking control of the current food market?

Right now the free market is working OK with food because there are so many different kinds of foods available that we can easily refuse to buy almost any product that any business tries to monopolize. And I think that as long as the free market works, we may as well let it. However, the government is spending massive amounts of money subsidizing huge corporate farms, and I think we should stop that. I also think we should encourage smaller family-owned farming enterprises, again, even if it makes food cost a little more.

I truly believe that we need to make our economic decisions based on quality of life rather than maximum profits, and cheapest costs.

 

[Darkness]

I don't believe that socialism demands that everyone must be "equalized". I don't even believe that communism demands that. I believe that's basically a "red herring" that pro-capitolists like to throw out there to essentially slander socialists.

That depends on the socialist. Not all socialists think alike. I find the idea of all professions recieving the same wages ridiculous. People need a selfish insentive to work. That might seem wrong, but it is a great affirmation of life.

The basic tenents of Socialism/Communism is that the economy is equalized, everyone gets paid the same, whether or not it is based on career class. But is not the idea of socialism to remove classes?

My understanding of socialism is that it involves collective ownership and control of some economic assets and endeavors. That doesn't have anything to do with "forced equalization" that I can see.

Removing the poor from our society may seem like a good thing, yet it is a double-edge sword. It removes a core element which makes us human. It removes the need to succeed in life. If one is creative enough start a successful business, he cannot command his own destiny under Socialism. He has to follow the wishes of the collective whole. This destroys a "sacred" part of individualism -- a part I am not willing to give up.

 

[lombas]

The basic tenents of Socialism/Communism is that the economy is equalized, everyone gets paid the same, whether or not it is based on career class.

I don't even think that is an objective.