Are transgender/transsexual people accepted in your religion?

[Saint Frankenstein]

I just believe that beauty fades and one should strive for virtue instead. I guess I just think it's a bit shallow.

True beauty comes from within, anyway.

 

[Rival]

And that sometimes happens to women. It doesn't make them less of a woman though.

They've tried addressing it mentally, and it went no where. But, what science has shown us is that transitioning improves the quality of life for those who have gender dysphoria. And, of course, improving a clients quality of life as much as possible is the goal of clinical psychology and psychiatry.

If the mind isn't healthy, there isn't a healthy or well functioning body to be had. Gender dysphoria has been best shown to be treated with physical/medical intervention. Treating it as a mental disorder really hasn't worked out, much how treating homosexuality as a mental disorder didn't work out (nor heterosexuality).

Whilst I understand all that you're saying, I was under the impression that the suicide rates for those who have fully transitioned are still disproportionately high. However, I learnt this from a Christian radio host, so feel free to correct me.

 

[Mister Silver]

True beauty comes from within, anyway.

And if one wants the outside decor to match the indoor drapes, there should be no harm in that.

 

[Rival]

Pretty much as shallow as any opposition to it though? It takes all sorts, some people don't much care for "virtue"
(whatever that means) in life, they are never going to feel happiness or fulfillment from it. If surgery releases them into a happier realm who are we to say "no, you're doing it wrong"? Only a religionist would come out with something like that.

Please do not pretend you are ignorant about what virtue is.

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

And if one wants the outside decor to match the indoor drapes, there should be no harm in that.

Eventually we're all going to rot or be burnt to ash so this cultural obsession with beauty standards is but another useless thing that quickly passes away.

 

[Mister Silver]

Eventually we're all going to rot or be burnt to ash so this cultural obsession with beauty standards is but another useless thing that quickly passes away.

Considering there is no guarantee of anything after life, it makes sense to make the best of the one life on Earth that one is offered.

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

Considering there is no guarantee of anything after life, it makes sense to make the best of the one life on Earth that one is offered.

Even then, there's better things to spend money on.

 

[The Holy Bottom Burp]

Please do not pretend you are ignorant about what virtue is.

No pretence there, "virtue" is as vague a word as "spiritual", it means different things to different people. You are avoiding my point.
My point was this; if surgery brings personal happiness into a person's life what business is it of anyone to say it is wrong? That is their choice isn't it?

 

[Mister Silver]

Even then, there's better things to spend money on.

That is also entirely dependent on how much money one has and how long it took one to earn the money. After all, we can't all be in the one percentile of wealth.

 

[Politesse]

Yeah, you are making a lot of assumptions about me there, I think theists get irritated by atheists telling them what they believe, just saying mate. I wasn't looking for a fight, I was just curious about Rival's stance.

Making assumptions about you? How on earth is my description of my roommate an assumption about you?

Unless you are she...

Wait, are you she?

If so, the trash needs to be taken out and I did it the last two times.

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

That is also entirely dependent on how much money one has and how long it took one to earn the money. After all, we can't all be in the one percentile of wealth.

Hence, why it's stupid to waste it on a nose job or whatever.

 

[Mister Silver]

Hence, why it's stupid to waste it on a nose job or whatever.

Your opinion is duly noted.

 

[Rival]

No pretence there, "virtue" is as vague a word as "spiritual", it means different things to different people. You are avoiding my point.
My point was this; if surgery brings personal happiness into a person's life what business is it of anyone to say it is wrong? That is their choice isn't it?

I'm not saying it's wrong, just that there are way better things to spend money on; or realise that happiness comes from within. I was bullied like hell for being 'ugly' at school but I never thought plastic surgery the answer; I just thought the bullies were plain idiots. One would be better emotionally equipped if one focussed on self-discipline, honesty, punctuality, emotional intelligence and so on. Then perhaps that person would find that happiness comes not from fading beauty and chasing ever changing standards, but from building character and being above all that consumer, commercial nonsense.

 

[Rival]

Making assumptions about you? How on earth is my description of my roommate an assumption about you?

Unless you are she...

Wait, are you she?

If so, the trash needs to be taken out and I did it the last two times.

It's me, I'm sorry it's just that I put a body in the trash and I didn't want to be accused o...yeh.

 

[The Holy Bottom Burp]

I'm not saying it's wrong, just that there are way better things to spend money on; or realise that happiness comes from within. I was bullied like hell for being 'ugly' at school but I never thought plastic surgery the answer; I just thought the bullies were plain idiots. One would be better emotionally equipped if one focussed on self-discipline, honesty, punctuality, emotional intelligence and so on. Then perhaps that person would find that happiness comes not from fading beauty and chasing ever changing standards, but from building character and being above all that consumer, commercial nonsense.

No problems with any of the above. but what works for you might not work for others. Why not go for a strong mental attitude and a physical change? Because people in the wider world might condemn you for it? F**k them, is what I'd say.

 

[The Holy Bottom Burp]

Making assumptions about you? How on earth is my description of my roommate an assumption about you?

Unless you are she...

Wait, are you she?

If so, the trash needs to be taken out and I did it the last two times.

You were addressing my post, not that of your roommate. Have the conversation with your "roomie", if she is prepared to listen. Fair enough?

 

[SomeRandom]

I'm afraid I don't understand, can you elaborate?? Your Goddess accepts all gender identities and is in fact the unity of masculinity and femininity, but demands femininity specifically of her servants?? Why/how is that consistent??

In Hinduism all humans are thought to possess femininity and masculinity. It is only society that forces us to choose between the two, since the atman (soul) is gender less. In Shaktism specifically the divine energy/power is thought the be inherently feminine. The creative force if you will, whilst the one doing the creating is inherently masculine. But the two must go hand in hand because neither can do their job without the other. Shiva without Shakti is shava (dead.)
Note this is probably not the best explanation, so take it as a sort of shaky translation.

Whilst females are thought to be already in tune with their femininity males are usually not so, because of social pressures to conform to masculinity. Therefore in order to properly understand the divine males must first forego the subconscious and tap into their latent femininity. It is merely a sect quirk. (Shaktism, which is often associated with Eastern Left Hand Paths, also often stresses that one must deliberately do things which are taboo in order to properly transcend into spiritual domains. Because in doing so one has to break down mental barriers that one has put up. So males tapping into their femininity also have the added bonus of going against the norm or engaging in something taboo. Which is thought to help them on their path to enlightenment.)

 

[Liu]

Whilst I understand all that you're saying, I was under the impression that the suicide rates for those who have fully transitioned are still disproportionately high. However, I learnt this from a Christian radio host, so feel free to correct me.

I have no official source on that at hand, but from all I heard, the suicide rate before transitioning is a lot higher than after.

I don't oppose them, I'm not against them. I was just making a statement, from my former atheistic POV, that I viewed it as not biologically normal and trying to turn a woman into a dude is not biologically fully possible. It's trying to treat a metal issue by altering the body. A man who transitions to a woman will never have a period, become pregnant, give birth, lactate or go through menopause. That's not me being against transsexuals, that's just a fact.

Lactation is actually possible (it even happens sometimes to males who are not trans). And of science improves as it does, pregnancies might become possible as well.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

Whilst I understand all that you're saying, I was under the impression that the suicide rates for those who have fully transitioned are still disproportionately high

I don't have any links on hand, but it's a "half truth." While statistically, yes, that is true, there is also the fact that is after a huge decrease from the "risk group" or those who haven't transitioned. And as it's being more accepted, it's being found that the earlier someone starts, the better they fit in and better quality of life they have. Later in life, however, they are also at a higher risk for drug and alcohol problems. But, overall, social support and acceptance have been thus far the best predictors of a successful transition.
I've come to terms with all my "faults." But, really, what woman, or man, or just person in general, doesn't have them? I'm hardly the only woman who can't bear children, and plenty still that are taller are bigger than me. Already I'm feeling much better than I ever have before, mentally I've never been in a better state of mind. You can deny it all you want, and call it whatever, but ultimately, I've never been more at peace with myself. The raging, soul crushing inner storm ended. It's not all calm yet, but at the same time I don't listen to all the death and gloom, roaring pissed and angry music like I used to because it's just not how I feel anymore.

 

[Prestor John]

You consider it charitable to ask a stranger why they didn't commit suicide?

How is asking a rhetorical question that causes someone to think about all the things that make them want to live not charitable?

Is it uncharitable to ask someone who confessed a desire to commit suicide why they chose not to go through with it?

That's deplorable!! At least phrase the question with a little more tact. Geez, there is a difference between bluntness and outright insensitive rudeness.

I think you have a misconception about the question I asked.

I did not ask, "Why don't you commit suicide?"

I asked, "Then why did you never commit suicide?"

Shadow Wolf was the one who initially brought up his desire to never have lived passed birth then claimed that life was precious.

This confused me and caused me to believe he was being disingenuous because someone could not both want to be dead and also believe that life was precious.

However, he later cleared up that confusion on 08/02/17 when he admitted that he had the one attempt at suicide, yet after that he rekindled his love of life.

Before you start getting offended on the behalf of others, how about you first read how they themselves reacted to the supposed "uncharitable" comment?

It was Shadow Wolf who began his conversation with me by belittling my personal beliefs about the Lord Jesus Christ, comparing Him and His Atoning Sacrifice to a grounded child having a "lousy weekend."

He has every right to share his opinion about my beliefs, yet he set the tone for how our conversation would pan out. We would not pull our punches or worry about offending one another. I mean, he didn't worry about offending me, so why should I worry?

What would be the point of walking on eggshells? Aren't we adults? What need would either of us have at being PC?

Anyways, long story short, read Shadow Wolf's response to the supposed "uncharitable" thing that I said and you'll see that he took it in stride. He did not miss a beat. He was not offended or hurt or anything.

I salute him for choosing not to be a victim.

Maybe you could learn something from him.