Are you for bringing back sacrifice in your religion?

[Faybull]

Well, we do just that with pretty much every action we take. Including building stuff.

We are talking about animal sacrifice as an act of reverence or the only what to reverence God in acknowledging we have transgressed the divine.

So, how profane is it to profess that in order to maintain intimacy or have a relationship with Go, in order to worship the creator, we must destroy what he has created.

It may just be the abomination of desolation spoken of by Daniel.

 

[Faybull]

Do you eat meat? Even if you don't eat meat, you still have to eat. Are you thankful to eat? Do you have gratitude for what you eat?

The Cain and Abel example is rather ironic since Yahweh rejected Cain's offering of plants. Yahweh loves animal sacrifice.

Except...

It says that God was dismayed towards Abel and his offering, but to Cain's he was NOT dismayed.

 

[Faybull]

Except...

It says that God was dismayed towards Abel and his offering, but to Cain's he was NOT dismayed.

I don't eat as an act of worship or reverence. I eat as an act of survival. Nor do I kill animals in a belief that their death atones for my actions against the divine.

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

Except...

It says that God was dismayed towards Abel and his offering, but to Cain's he was NOT dismayed.

No, it doesn't. No idea where you're getting that from:

3 In the course of time Cain brought to the Lord an offering of the fruit of the ground, 4 and Abel brought of the firstlings of his flock and of their fat portions. And the Lord had regard for Abel and his offering, 5 but for Cain and his offering he had no regard. So Cain was very angry, and his countenance fell. Genesis 4:3-5

 

[Riverwolf]

We are talking about animal sacrifice as an act of reverence or the only what to reverence God in acknowledging we have transgressed the divine.

So, how profane is it to profess that in order to maintain intimacy or have a relationship with Go, in order to worship the creator, we must destroy what he has created.

It may just be the abomination of desolation spoken of by Daniel.

Churches are built, and requires destroying things in the world.

Besides, we're not talking about a specific religion's animal sacrificial practice. Just in general.

If I were to practice animal sacrifice, it would not be to acknowledge a transgression and ask forgiveness. It would be to honor the animal and the Gods.

Then again, I don't regard the Gods as creators.

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

I don't eat as an act of worship or reverence. I eat as an act of survival. Nor do I kill animals in a belief that their death atones for my actions against the divine.

Oh, you never eat for pleasure? Most of the eating we do is for pleasure, not survival. To an animist, when you eat, you are taking in a gift from that animal or plant and it becomes a part of you. So, in that view, a sacrifice is a celebration of that and a way to offer thanks. Nothing to do with atonement for some perceived wrong doing. We're not talking about just the Abrahamic religions.

 

[Riverwolf]

Oh, you never eat for pleasure? Most of the eating we do is for pleasure, not survival.

Well... not really for me. I hate eating.

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

Well... not really for me. I hate eating.

Strange.

 

[Riverwolf]

Strange.

Strange, indeed. Scary, too.

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

Strange, indeed. Scary, too.

Why do you feel that way and why is it scary?

 

[Riverwolf]

Why do you feel that way and why is it scary?

It's scary because if I were not reminded somehow, I'm prone to forget to eat, or eat way too little.

We (my friends and family) have been trying to figure out an exact reason for years, now, and have come up short. Best I can figure is that it's some sort of food equivalent to asexuality.

EDIT: I don't want to derail the thread, though, so I'd rather not talk about this more here.

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

It's scary because if I were not reminded somehow, I'm prone to forget to eat, or eat way too little.

We (my friends and family) have been trying to figure out an exact reason for years, now, and have come up short. Best I can figure is that it's some sort of food equivalent to asexuality.

EDIT: I don't want to derail the thread, though, so I'd rather not talk about this more here.

Fair enough. It's just interesting to me.

 

[EtuMalku]

The notion of separation you bring up doesn't exist in the animistic-mindset. Here, even you and I communicating now across the internet are not entirely separate. That communication connects us. But so do other things, such as our same species, same Planet, etc.

Animism (from Latin animus, -i "soul, life") is the worldview that non-human entities (animals, plants, and inanimate objects or phenomena) possess a spiritual essence.

I'm not following you at all . . . Animal Sacrifice is the offering of a living energy / soul / by ritual slaughter to a non-objective, usually divine representation of some Ideal. This does in fact assume there is this non-objective divine Ideal.

 

[The Hammer]

Well, it has been mentioned a few times already, but I will post anyways. I am not opposed to animal sacrifice, as long as the animal in question is humanely killed, and all the parts are utilized (food, items, clothes, etc). I do not think we should be sacrificing people though, that was part of my path (at least according to Julius Caesar), and I don't think that is necessary.

But, I do not see anything wrong with the ritual use of human blood between willing participants.

 

[Riverwolf]

Animism (from Latin animus, -i "soul, life") is the worldview that non-human entities (animals, plants, and inanimate objects or phenomena) possess a spiritual essence.

Correct. That implies, to me, interconnectedness.

I'm not following you at all . . . Animal Sacrifice is the offering of a living energy / soul / by ritual slaughter to a non-objective, usually divine representation of some Ideal. This does in fact assume there is this non-objective divine Ideal.

It can. But that doesn't mean there's separation without the sacrifice.

 

[EtuMalku]

It's sharing with other outside our self Doesn't mean the divine isn't within us or is separated from us.

Not everybody sees it as Everything is within Us, We are One/All, All is One, One is All, etc.

And an animal sacrifice would be offering something (vital energy / life force / etc.) to something 'assumed' higher than the self, otherwise where would the 'sacrifice' come in? What other reasons are there for animal sacrifice?

 

[Riverwolf]

And an animal sacrifice would be offering something (vital energy / life force / etc.) to something 'assumed' higher than the self, otherwise where would the 'sacrifice' come in? What other reasons are there for animal sacrifice?

The word "sacrifice" doesn't mean offering something to another thing that's assumed to be "higher" than one's self. It means to give up something of value, usually (though not necessarily) with the hope of receiving something else of equal or greater value.

I've already given another member the reason I'd do it: give honor to the animal and the Gods. The animal itself stays with us, as food and tools; how can it be offered to the Gods if they don't get it?

 

[EtuMalku]

The word "sacrifice" doesn't mean offering something to another thing that's assumed to be "higher" than one's self. It means to give up something of value, usually (though not necessarily) with the hope of receiving something else of equal or greater value.

I've already given another member the reason I'd do it: give honor to the animal and the Gods. The animal itself stays with us, as food and tools; how can it be offered to the Gods if they don't get it?

I stated: Sacrifice, like prayer, assumes a gap between the divine and the human. Luciferians shun activities which keep them further from their own godhood. Those who seek energy outside of their own Minds and Wills, are too weak for this Path.

Animal sacrifice is the ritual killing and offering of an animal to appease or maintain favour with a divine agency.

Sacrifice
1.a. The act of offering something to a deity in propitiation or homage, especially the ritual slaughter of an animal or a person.
b. A victim offered in this way.
2.a. Forfeiture of something highly valued for the sake of one considered to have a greater value or claim.
b. Something so forfeited.
3.a. Relinquishment of something at less than its presumed value.
b. Something so relinquished.
c. A loss so sustained.

How am I incorrect in my statement?

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

I stated: Sacrifice, like prayer, assumes a gap between the divine and the human. Luciferians shun activities which keep them further from their own godhood. Those who seek energy outside of their own Minds and Wills, are too weak for this Path.

Please don't presume to speak for all Luciferians. We don't need a Luciferian version of Anton LaVey or Peter Gilmore.

 

[EtuMalku]

Please don't presume to speak for all Luciferians. We don't need a Luciferian version of Anton LaVey or Peter Gilmore.

You're right . . . I should have said "REAL Luciferians" . . . pardonne moi