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Poeticus
| abhyAvartin |
Fireside_Hindu
Jai Lakshmi Maa
Kalidas
Well-Known Member
Seems I missed all the fun last night.
Maya
You did lol
Planets and the Sun
Member
It seems like the thread has gone a bit off-topic (but fun to read) in my absence! Anyway, I think it's interesting to hear different perspectives on gurus and freedom, so thank you to both Aupmanyav and Vinayaka (and those who agreed with him) for sharing their points of view.
I don't know if the "Hinduism is becoming fashionable" line of discussion was intended to be about me. If it was, I think I've explained my reasons for being interested already. In any case, I agree, I've noticed that sort of commercialism too (I think it's been going on for a long while now) and even though I'm not Hindu it seems disrespectful. Just as when people take concepts from Hinduism and Buddhism and twist them into some very strange, fluffy theories that sound nothing like what you actually find in those religions.
I don't know if the "Hinduism is becoming fashionable" line of discussion was intended to be about me. If it was, I think I've explained my reasons for being interested already. In any case, I agree, I've noticed that sort of commercialism too (I think it's been going on for a long while now) and even though I'm not Hindu it seems disrespectful. Just as when people take concepts from Hinduism and Buddhism and twist them into some very strange, fluffy theories that sound nothing like what you actually find in those religions.
Maya3
Well-Known Member
Not at all about you.
Several people here are converts, including me (though I was never a religion before Hindu).
You are very welcome to the club
We can all get very silly at times here, but also have hefty and interesting debates.
Maya
Poeticus
| abhyAvartin |
It wasn't about you. It's an inside joke we do here in the HinduDIR from time to time; we can't help ourselves from getting off topic, because we do not want to forget how to laugh. EDIT: Shucks, Maya beat me to it. :sad4:
Planets and the Sun
Member
Not at all about you.
Several people here are converts, including me (though I was never a religion before Hindu).
You are very welcome to the club
We can all get very silly at times here, but also have hefty and interesting debates.
Maya
Thanks!
I actually like the sense of humour that people in this section of the forum seem to have. It's very refreshing and I think that being able to not forget how to laugh is definitely very important! I've noticed how people here have a tendency to make jokes in other threads too
I'm glad it wasn't about me, by the way! I'm mainly interested in it since it was the religion of my ancestors and I'm interested in religions in general. I've ran into unpleasant people online before, so I'm sorry if I sounded too defensive.
I also have a tendency to come across as harsh in writing (maybe because English isn't my first language) unless I'm overusing smilies, so I'm sorry in advance for any instances of that.
Planets and the Sun
Member
Hello, I have some more questions, brought on by what's being said in another thread about the afterlife and "punishment".
From what I understand, in Hindu thinking, your next life depends on your karma in this life and what you do. So isn't a form of "punishment" for someone to have a less rewarding life in their next one because of what they've done in this one?
Another thing is, do all Hindus believe strongly in what happens after you die? No matter how hard I try, I have a hard time believing in knowing what happens after people die. I can understand where different opinions (a place where souls go, reincarnation, absolute nothingness) come from but I always feel like we can't truly know until we actually die. I find it easier to believe in deities for some reason. Any perspectives that may be helpful are very welcome.
Sorry if these questions sound silly. I've been thinking about them a lot lately and that thread made me think about it even more, and I'm very confused.
EDIT: Another thing that I nearly forgot to ask. Is divination forbidden in Hinduism? I've never seen any prohibitions about it mentioned anywhere and I've been searching for some information, but all I can find was this article and then lots and lots of fluffy New Agey books, plus the odd article about Sikhism here and there, and some mentions of practices that are regional and so aren't mine to take, so I don't know.
From what I understand, in Hindu thinking, your next life depends on your karma in this life and what you do. So isn't a form of "punishment" for someone to have a less rewarding life in their next one because of what they've done in this one?
Another thing is, do all Hindus believe strongly in what happens after you die? No matter how hard I try, I have a hard time believing in knowing what happens after people die. I can understand where different opinions (a place where souls go, reincarnation, absolute nothingness) come from but I always feel like we can't truly know until we actually die. I find it easier to believe in deities for some reason. Any perspectives that may be helpful are very welcome.
Sorry if these questions sound silly. I've been thinking about them a lot lately and that thread made me think about it even more, and I'm very confused.
EDIT: Another thing that I nearly forgot to ask. Is divination forbidden in Hinduism? I've never seen any prohibitions about it mentioned anywhere and I've been searching for some information, but all I can find was this article and then lots and lots of fluffy New Agey books, plus the odd article about Sikhism here and there, and some mentions of practices that are regional and so aren't mine to take, so I don't know.
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Fireside_Hindu
Jai Lakshmi Maa
Hello, I have some more questions, brought on by what's being said in another thread about the afterlife and "punishment".
From what I understand, in Hindu thinking, your next life depends on your karma in this life and what you do. So isn't a form of "punishment" for someone to have a less rewarding life in their next one because of what they've done in this one?
Another thing is, do all Hindus believe strongly in what happens after you die? No matter how hard I try, I have a hard time believing in knowing what happens after people die. I can understand where different opinions (a place where souls go, reincarnation, absolute nothingness) come from but I always feel like we can't truly know until we actually die. I find it easier to believe in deities for some reason. Any perspectives that may be helpful are very welcome.
Sorry if these questions sound silly. I've been thinking about them a lot lately and that thread made me think about it even more, and I'm very confused.
EDIT: Another thing that I nearly forgot to ask. Is divination forbidden in Hinduism? I've never seen any prohibitions about it mentioned anywhere and I've been searching for some information, but all I can find was this article and then lots and lots of fluffy New Agey books, plus the odd article about Sikhism here and there, and some mentions of practices that are regional and so aren't mine to take, so I don't know.
Karma is more like a law of nature, not a tool for punishment. Think of it this way - When a skydiver's parachute fails to open and he hits the ground, does everyone shake their fists at the sky and blame gravity? When a small child touches a hot burner out of curiosity, does the parent get angry at the stove?
The results of karma are cause and effect in this way. You aren't being punished by an angry universe, but things just naturally occur because of actions. That is Karma.
As for what happens when we die, this varies form person so person. I believe in reincarnation, but I don't know for sure, of course. I believe one should focus more on how one lives in this life since we have no way of knowing what happens when we die. All we can do it hope for what sounds the most true to us and leave the rest with a big "?"
As for divination, I have no idea. I don't see a reason for it but I don't know what the rules are, per say.
And these aren't silly questions at all! Thank you for asking. =)
:camp:
'Punishment' will vary from school to school. It's all karma. Suffering or enjoying the consequences of behaviour (either 'good' or 'bad') just happens. In the Abrahamic mindset, it's an external force doing the punishing. In Hinduism, you do it to yourself.
Belief in what happens after you die also varies widely. In my case, if you're a young soul, you hang about in a confused place, unsure of where you are, until you (I mean you in the 'soul' or 'soul body' sense, not in the 'ego' sense) get pulled back into a like-minded group of souls or confused souls in a physical body.
However, the wiser you are, the more likely you are able to choose where you go, so you'll look for a pure group of embodies jivas to reincarnate into, to be a member of that group, on your way to moksha. Each time we returm we learn a little bit more, more karmas are unraveled, the layer of anava becomes thinner.
But, yes, you will get a ton of different ideas on it.
I don't even know what divination is.
Belief in what happens after you die also varies widely. In my case, if you're a young soul, you hang about in a confused place, unsure of where you are, until you (I mean you in the 'soul' or 'soul body' sense, not in the 'ego' sense) get pulled back into a like-minded group of souls or confused souls in a physical body.
However, the wiser you are, the more likely you are able to choose where you go, so you'll look for a pure group of embodies jivas to reincarnate into, to be a member of that group, on your way to moksha. Each time we returm we learn a little bit more, more karmas are unraveled, the layer of anava becomes thinner.
But, yes, you will get a ton of different ideas on it.
I don't even know what divination is.
Nyingjé Tso
Dharma not drama
EDIT: Another thing that I nearly forgot to ask. Is divination forbidden in Hinduism? I've never seen any prohibitions about it mentioned anywhere and I've been searching for some information, but all I can find was this article and then lots and lots of fluffy New Agey books, plus the odd article about Sikhism here and there, and some mentions of practices that are regional and so aren't mine to take, so I don't know.
There is no "divination" in Hinduism as far as I know, the closest thing would be Jyotish but it is more astrology than divination.
In general for all these kind of things (that are optionnal in the path, meaning they are not required to achieve moksha) it have to be learned from a master. And it is not forbidden, no worries ! If it doesn't hurt yourself or anyone, if it doesn't create more karma than you or someone else already bear, then there is no reason for it to be forbidden.
Planets and the Sun
Member
Thanks for the replies, everyone. What you've said about karma and belief in what happens after you die makes a lot more sense now.
This is how I tend to think too. I don't know what's going to happen after I die, so I'd rather focus on living this life the best way I can.
Divination is like fortune-telling, it's using methods such as reading signs in Nature, runes, Tarot cards, casting stones or shells, etc. (of course, which methods people use depend on their culture and beliefs).
Thank you for your answer! I find astrology extremely interesting even if I'm on the fence about it, but most of what I know is about Western astrology.
I find divination and fortune-telling extremely interesting and I enjoy it a lot. I personally love using Tarot cards especially but I sometimes use or enjoy reading about other methods too. I don't use it to hurt others, I mainly read for personal guidance (to get more perspectives on a problem in my life and reflect about it), or to help others. I have rules I use when reading about someone else too which are related to my personal ethics.
I don't have a master (at least not yet) so I don't have anyone to help me find answers to these questions. Thank you for your reply, it's good to know it depends on the path and what people are doing with it. I know some religions or paths within them have very strict forbidding it which is why I asked.
Now I'm curious, are there any paths that are more open to using divinatory methods? I use methods mainly for personal use and personal exploration, but I find it interesting when people of religions that use divination rituals for religious purposes use them, so I'm very open to that idea. I'm going to have to do some research about that and see if I can find anything.
This is how I tend to think too. I don't know what's going to happen after I die, so I'd rather focus on living this life the best way I can.
Divination is like fortune-telling, it's using methods such as reading signs in Nature, runes, Tarot cards, casting stones or shells, etc. (of course, which methods people use depend on their culture and beliefs).
Thank you for your answer! I find astrology extremely interesting even if I'm on the fence about it, but most of what I know is about Western astrology.
I find divination and fortune-telling extremely interesting and I enjoy it a lot. I personally love using Tarot cards especially but I sometimes use or enjoy reading about other methods too. I don't use it to hurt others, I mainly read for personal guidance (to get more perspectives on a problem in my life and reflect about it), or to help others. I have rules I use when reading about someone else too which are related to my personal ethics.
I don't have a master (at least not yet) so I don't have anyone to help me find answers to these questions. Thank you for your reply, it's good to know it depends on the path and what people are doing with it. I know some religions or paths within them have very strict forbidding it which is why I asked.
Now I'm curious, are there any paths that are more open to using divinatory methods? I use methods mainly for personal use and personal exploration, but I find it interesting when people of religions that use divination rituals for religious purposes use them, so I'm very open to that idea. I'm going to have to do some research about that and see if I can find anything.
Thanks for the explanation. Other than astrology and perhaps palmistry, it's not part of Hinduism, as far as I know.
Aupmanyav
Be your own guru
Something sure happens after death. When there is no life, only body is left. And the body disintegrates. What constitutes one disperses into the environment and forms new associations.
They say ".. purushasya bhagyam, devo na janati kuto manushyah.' (Even the Gods do not know a man's future, what to talk of men?). They say even with all the astrological matching Mother Sita that must have preceeded her marriage with Lord Rama, she had to endure exile twice. It is futile. Only the Vidhatr knows (Lord Brahma, responsible for writing destinies).
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Kalidas
Well-Known Member
You will find there isn't much that is "forbidden" in Hinduism. Aside from what you as a person trying to do go determines is not the proper course of action.
But if it's not part of Hinduism, sometimes it's really hard to make any statement at all. I guess I'm a bit frustated at not being able to answer some of these types of questions. But if you ask a question about the New Age (or, more obviously about Judaism, say) to a Hindu, then I think maybe it's unrealistic to expect an answer.
I guess I don't like being accused of intolerance when in reality I just don't know, and am unable to answer because of that. I am the quick to admit a lack of knowledge on subjects outside of my own faith. Oh well.
Kalidas
Well-Known Member
But if it's not part of Hinduism, sometimes it's really hard to make any statement at all. I guess I'm a bit frustated at not being able to answer some of these types of questions. But if you ask a question about the New Age (or, more obviously about Judaism, say) to a Hindu, then I think maybe it's unrealistic to expect an answer.
I guess I don't like being accused of intolerance when in reality I just don't know, and am unable to answer because of that. I am the quick to admit a lack of knowledge on subjects outside of my own faith. Oh well.
I hope I didn't offend you. I was just mentioning that Hinduism allows for many interpretations and practices for the HONEST devottee to choose from. I highlighted HONEST for a reason. If you wish to find freedom to be imoral look else where. If you look for freedom to define morality in a honest attempt to be a better human being, look no farther.
Kalidas
Well-Known Member
But if it's not part of Hinduism, sometimes it's really hard to make any statement at all. I guess I'm a bit frustated at not being able to answer some of these types of questions. But if you ask a question about the New Age (or, more obviously about Judaism, say) to a Hindu, then I think maybe it's unrealistic to expect an answer.
I guess I don't like being accused of intolerance when in reality I just don't know, and am unable to answer because of that. I am the quick to admit a lack of knowledge on subjects outside of my own faith. Oh well.
I'm sure one day I will get there too, when I'm older. Once we get to a point that we know all we want to know and wish to develop on what we have instead of learning new things we become content with what we know. Tis the way of human development.