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Book club
- Thread starter Kalidas
- Start date
Kalidas
Well-Known Member
okay that wory. Don't worry they are super shot chapters
I think one chapter a week is the plan for now to start off with to get a feel or grounding in the process, so that is what I have started to do.
Maybe folks will pick up the pace a bit later once the "process" is played out or figured out.
I think the idea is to also inspire exploring Hinduism in a fun and sharing way.
I am starting to note down some commentary on this first chapter. It appears to me this first go at it via Devi Gita was a good choice. Actually this is the first time seriously reading the Devi Gita, and I am excited to see what members suggest next.
Om Namah Sivaya
Maybe folks will pick up the pace a bit later once the "process" is played out or figured out.
I think the idea is to also inspire exploring Hinduism in a fun and sharing way.
I am starting to note down some commentary on this first chapter. It appears to me this first go at it via Devi Gita was a good choice. Actually this is the first time seriously reading the Devi Gita, and I am excited to see what members suggest next.
Om Namah Sivaya
Kalidas
Well-Known Member
I thinking getting to know one another's sect and beliefs can go a LONG way in building strength among the sects.
So far I like the first chapter, it is really quit nice and my head is already bubbling with questions lol
Jaskaran Singh
Divosūnupriyaḥ
I realize that this has nothing to do with the thread, but your siggy is so beautiful.
More on topic, I loved the following verses (even though much of the imagery is similar to that of the Muṇḍakopaniṣad):
The Devas said:--"O Mother! Forgive our faults. Protect us, the miserable, that are born of Thee. O Protectress of the Devas! Withhold Thy anger we are very much terrified at the sight of Thy this form. "O Devî! We are inferior immortals; what prayers can we offer to Thee! Thou Thyself canst not measure Thy powers; how then can we, who are born later, know of Thy greatness! Obeisance to Thee, the Lady of the Universe! Obeisance to Thee of the nature of the Pranava Om; Thou art the One that is proved in all the Vedântas. Obeisance to Thee, of the form of Hrîm! Obeisance to Thee, the Self of all, whence has originated the Fire, the Sun, and the Moon and whence have sprung all the medicinal plants. Obeisance to the Devî, the Cosmic Deity, the Self in all whence have sprung all the Devas, Sâdhyas, the beasts, birds, and men! We bow down again and again to the Great Form, Mâhâ Mâyâ, the Self of all, whence have-sprung the vital breath Prana, Apâna, grains and wheats, and Who is the source of asceticism, faith, truth, continence and the rules what to do and what not to do under the present circumstances. The seven Prânas, the seven Lokas, the seven Flames, the seven Samidhas, the seven Oblations to Fire, have sprung from Thee! Obeisance to Thee, the Great Self in all! Obeisance to the Universal form of the Deity of the Universe whence have sprung all the oceans, all the mountains, all the rivers, all the medicinal plants and all the Rasas (the tastes of all things). We bow down to that Virât Form, the Great Self, the Mahâ Mâyâ, whence have originated the sacrifices, the sacrificial post (to which the victim about to be immolated is bound) and Daksinâs (the sacrificial fees) and the Rik, the Yajus, and the Sâma Vedas. O Mother! O Mahâ Mâyâ! We bow down to Thy front, to Thy back, to Thy both the sides, to Thy top, to Thy bottom and on all sides of Thee. O Devî! Be kind enough to withhold this Extraordinary Terrific Form of Thine, and show us Thy Beautiful Lovely Form.
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Kalidas
Well-Known Member
I realize that this has nothing to do with the thread, but your siggy is so beautiful.
Agreed it is. I wonder where he is getting these I am jealous lol
Jaskaran Singh
Divosūnupriyaḥ
Oh yeah, and I was supposed to translate those verses for you, but still haven't gotten around to that. I'm such a procrastinator, lol...
Kalidas
Well-Known Member
Oh yeah, and I was supposed to translate those verses for you, but still haven't gotten around to that. I'm such a procrastinator, lol...
Lol me too. I have a 50 page novel I have not written in for about a year...I know the feeling.
Philomath
Sadhaka
I realize that this has nothing to do with the thread, but your siggy is so beautiful.
Thanks
I get my signatures from
VISHNU108's deviantART Gallery
Poeticus
| abhyAvartin |
O, o, guys what about this? This one is also beautiful! (from same source as that of Philomath's: http://vishnu108.deviantart.com/art/KRISHNA-GOVINDA-412033330)
For Ratiben:
For Ratiben:
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Jaskaran Singh
Divosūnupriyaḥ
Meh, this one (also from the same link) is better:
This one is also cool, only the cow looks a bit strange:
This one is also cool, only the cow looks a bit strange:
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Poeticus
| abhyAvartin |
ratikala
Istha gosthi
namaskaram :namaste
for MV ji .......
the best painter of gomata's is BG Sharma :namaste
even many indian artists copy him , because his painting is so beautifull
now really we shouldnt be hijaking kalidas's thread too much with pictures ....
but I have to say something realy important , ....I hope that we will all understand the importance of rejecting a baddly a badly translated script .....
we must also be very wary of accepting some depictions of the lord , many of these moddern paintings are too fancyfull and not containing correct details ....
I do not want to criticise modern devotee artists but I do want to stress the importance of correct depiction , ...if we look at incorect depictions this leaves an incorect imprint on our minds . it is just as important to have a correct visual understanding of any subject as it is to hear mantra correctly .
so thank you so much for thinking I will like theese pictures if krsna , but I prefer to keep to the very traditional depictions because these artists have done long apprentiships to learn what is correct and incorrect .
many modern artists are using too much artistic licence , it is like altering parts of mantra's to suit ones own taste . depictions can be styalised this is ok , but must be correct , if you look at a good picture you are learning from every detail , when one sees an image , that image stays in ones mind , it creates a lasting impression , this is very very important .
sorry to sound so strict , but I hope any of you would be equaly as strict to reject corruptions of text , without needing to criticise the artist as unfortunately like many translators they are well meant .
for MV ji .......
the best painter of gomata's is BG Sharma :namaste
even many indian artists copy him , because his painting is so beautifull
now really we shouldnt be hijaking kalidas's thread too much with pictures ....
but I have to say something realy important , ....I hope that we will all understand the importance of rejecting a baddly a badly translated script .....
we must also be very wary of accepting some depictions of the lord , many of these moddern paintings are too fancyfull and not containing correct details ....
I do not want to criticise modern devotee artists but I do want to stress the importance of correct depiction , ...if we look at incorect depictions this leaves an incorect imprint on our minds . it is just as important to have a correct visual understanding of any subject as it is to hear mantra correctly .
so thank you so much for thinking I will like theese pictures if krsna , but I prefer to keep to the very traditional depictions because these artists have done long apprentiships to learn what is correct and incorrect .
many modern artists are using too much artistic licence , it is like altering parts of mantra's to suit ones own taste . depictions can be styalised this is ok , but must be correct , if you look at a good picture you are learning from every detail , when one sees an image , that image stays in ones mind , it creates a lasting impression , this is very very important .
sorry to sound so strict , but I hope any of you would be equaly as strict to reject corruptions of text , without needing to criticise the artist as unfortunately like many translators they are well meant .
Book review commentary 1 on Chapter 1 Devi Gita
The Birth of Pârvatî in the House of Himâlayâs
(Disclaimer: The following commentary is my own and does not claim any authority, it is no more than the adventures of a layman Saiva inspired by the Devi Gita. It purposely does not take sides, it does not place one over another, it simply grasps at the context of time, place and history. There is no "us and them". Everyone has their passion, their focus or interest, their path. My passion is the Histories and leelas, the past, present and future of the Devatas. All 330 million Devatas, Devis and Suras and their manifestations, emanations, aspects, incarnations, reincarnations, soldiers, angels and abstracts, all 33 million Guardians, all 33 Shree Devatas, all 3 Trimurti. It is in one way an impossible and unreasonable passion. Every Hindu is my friend.)
This Devi Gita begins with a discussion between one Janamejaya and the famous Sage Vyasa.
My first inspiration is, who are these men who inspire us to praise Devi? And what was the circumstance of time and place when they shared at that moment their bhakti for the Mother?
Let me admire them for who they are. Let me go back to that time and place. Perhaps the power of this Gita can take me on this adventure. For me, the best "book" plants the seeds and harvests such adventure. The adventure of Hinduism. And so I looked, and was not disappointed. I find in my limited capacity, 1,000 stories and a never ending story.
Janamejaya was the Raj of Hastinapur (also known as the "City of Elephants"), the Capital of the Kuru Clan Dynasty, and who was the great-grandson of Arjuna of the Mahābhārata fame.
Arjuna had married Subhadra who was the half-sister of Krishna, the daughter of Vasudev, and she is considered an emmination of Parvati shaktipat (confering energy of Parvati directly from Parvati into the birth state of Subhadra). This is the same Subhadra seen as the Deity in the center of the three wooden murthis of Jagannatha triad in Puri, Orissa, where you have Her brothers Balaram and Krishna on Her left and right.
From Arjuna, who to me had possesed a direct power and gifts of Shiva, and Subhadra, was born the son Abhimanyu, the son of Abhimanyu was Parik**** the Chief of the Kurus, and the son of Parik**** was Janamejaya the King of Hastinapur, the very same Janamejaya of this Devi Gita.
Now what was the state of mind of Janamejaya at that time? In terms of perspective of his mindset and personality, he attempted a great sacrifice to exterminate the Nagas or serpent-snake beings since one of the powerful Nagas named Takshak had killed his father Parik**** the famous "Chief" of the Kuru tribe who attained a status considered an Emperor, with a snake bite. So he had this torment always on his mind, and seeking peace from it.
Keep in mind, Hastinapur was also known for snakes (and was also known as the "City of Snakes"). No doubt the Nagas were near by in those days. This aspect of Janamejaya's hatred of the Nagas may be a clue to later dialog within this Gita or song itself, we shall see.
There is an old ravine here, it is an old ravine carved in the times long ago etched by the Holy Ganges. Here is found a Linga established by Karna, also of Mahabharata fame. The worship of Kali also has deep roots here to the past.
And so we can see that this conversation occured many years after the Battle of Kurukshektra in historical timeline, and probably occured in or near The City of Elephants, Hastinapur. This City by the way, the "City-State" of the Kurus, was also known as a center for Jaina religion and not just Hindu, there are leelas associated here with the earliest of Arhants of Jainism from the deep shadows of the hoary past, the birthplace of 3 Jaina Tirthankaras.
No doubt many elephants were enlisted into the fighting machine of these Kuru warriors of that time, and so the City of Elephants. These elephants must have had large herds in the adjacent forests of Hastinapur. But in the future to come, the Mahouts or elephant drivers would see their diaspora as many would find their new future at a place known as Old Delhi.
So this Gita begins as a request from King Janamejaya to the sage Vyasa that the Sage tell of the glory of Saktidevi, asking Vyâsa of the Devi we know of called Parvati, but particular to Her charming genre as the One who resides on top of the Himalayas.
This Sage Vyasa is considered one of the seven Chiranjivins or those who have a life that is so very long they can be called Imortal, and he is the same sage who not only lived during the time of Krishna but also documented the events known as the Mahabharata.
I picture this conversation between Janamejaya and the Sage Vyasa taking place in the assembly square of the Raj, I imagine many columns or pillars forming a boundary of this assembly square, each column crowned on top with elephant motif, probably four faced looking in all four directions. Even the courtly priests listen in respect to the Sage. Arjun would have been remembered, no doubt his favorite horse depicted in stone, and Arjun himself alongside his Ever Well Wisher, Krishna. The murti of Devi Herself would be in a shrine not far away. At that time, Ganga Maa was near. There was a famed Linga found in a prominent temple that could be seen from the assembly square, and water birds on flight to the Ganga could be seen from the open air ceilings of this square.
We can see clearly, this descendent of Arjuna was already a great devotee of Devi. And perhaps there is this fondness due also to Parvati's energy within Krishna's half-sister. A pride in the Goddess from which you could claim family descent no doubt may have contributed to Janamejaya's devotion to Devi.
She is known as The Queen of the Mountains to this lineage of Kurus. The manifestation known as Annapurna, Who is the Queen of Kashi (which fell within the realm of the Kuru empire) is said to have come first from mountains of Kashmir.
Here in the Devi Gita, The Mother of the World is called the Highest Light by Janamejaya because the place given mention here in the Himalayas was known by the ancients and wise as the highest point in the world on Mother Bhumi Earth.
When Mahadev was described as going into samadhi, forgetting all his knowledge of Samsâra, it seems the normal course of things slowed down, even this wheel of birth and death almost would stop turning, karma itself slowed, rules may not have been so fixed in time and measure - and as typical in such times of uncertainty some take chances in perhaps a desperate need to hedge one's bets and to protect one's self. We are not the only beings between us and the divine, in the middle between both are many others, often very powerful in our own terms, it seems one decided to do something very different and so this demon appears.
When you meditate with success, you effect your very inner self. When more advanced practitioners meditate, this effect can permeate outward even and effect things and those around them. Just imagine, when Siva meditates. Yet, there seems to be a place called Manidvipa, which is said is Sarva Loka, it is a perfumed place where Devi resides, it was Her design. It sits above Bhumi Mother Earth. What you imagine as beautiful and a garden of paradise in your world, this vision can come alive in Her garden. Whatever is the highest concept of beauty, that highest concept becomes a reality there. So you can only fathom, what it looks like when the highest beauty in the minds of the Devatas comes to life there, the beauty may even strike one who is not ready to see it even dead so overwhelming it may be. You are protected, you will see whatever is your highest beauty, this can grow too, if you remember that Devi is Beauty.
This is a place where the rules of the wheel of birth and death are broken, it was before Siva meditated, and while meditating, and after. So such things never applied in the first place where the Devi resides. Kalpa Vriksa is always wakeful for you there, no matter Who is sleeping, and it is full of sounds because many, many Devatas visit that place, their mounts are lined up like so many vehicles parked in front of the palace of the great Maharaja.
Often times She comes first in the Form of Light. It seems that was true, when She answered the call of many and Devatas to crush this demon under Her. It was said by the Sage to be Red in lustre and Cooling. This is how it was described to the descendent of Arjuna. So this must be the vision if he saw it. I do not know what color it would be if you or I saw, but it is not the first time I have heard of the cooling hand of Devi on the forehead of Her children in fever. Strange tropics are not so strange afterall, you can easily recognize things inside those places, yes?
On Her forehead was the half-cresent moon. You have seen that before, no doubt. Devi wears this. She speaks in a sweet cuckoo voice, like a bird.
The Divine Presence of those Who came to call on Her, they asked Her to fullfil the promise that Gauri of the Mountains, the Sakti and spouse of Shiva Who now was in meditation, have a Son as was told. She was to awaken a Child that would spell the end of a demon. And awaken Shiva. Simply Her promise to those Who called upon Her that their wishes would come true, that was enough to awaken Her Father known as the King of the Himalayas. Because He is Her Father, so we benefit that this place on our planet is also called Her home. We are very lucky indeed!
So then begins the next chapter, as She begins to speak the very secret essences. I cannot wait to read the next Chapter. I am finding this Gita can transcend even the simplist of translations to warm the heart, and excite the soul. Jai Devi!
Om Namah Sivaya
The Birth of Pârvatî in the House of Himâlayâs
(Disclaimer: The following commentary is my own and does not claim any authority, it is no more than the adventures of a layman Saiva inspired by the Devi Gita. It purposely does not take sides, it does not place one over another, it simply grasps at the context of time, place and history. There is no "us and them". Everyone has their passion, their focus or interest, their path. My passion is the Histories and leelas, the past, present and future of the Devatas. All 330 million Devatas, Devis and Suras and their manifestations, emanations, aspects, incarnations, reincarnations, soldiers, angels and abstracts, all 33 million Guardians, all 33 Shree Devatas, all 3 Trimurti. It is in one way an impossible and unreasonable passion. Every Hindu is my friend.)
This Devi Gita begins with a discussion between one Janamejaya and the famous Sage Vyasa.
My first inspiration is, who are these men who inspire us to praise Devi? And what was the circumstance of time and place when they shared at that moment their bhakti for the Mother?
Let me admire them for who they are. Let me go back to that time and place. Perhaps the power of this Gita can take me on this adventure. For me, the best "book" plants the seeds and harvests such adventure. The adventure of Hinduism. And so I looked, and was not disappointed. I find in my limited capacity, 1,000 stories and a never ending story.
Janamejaya was the Raj of Hastinapur (also known as the "City of Elephants"), the Capital of the Kuru Clan Dynasty, and who was the great-grandson of Arjuna of the Mahābhārata fame.
Arjuna had married Subhadra who was the half-sister of Krishna, the daughter of Vasudev, and she is considered an emmination of Parvati shaktipat (confering energy of Parvati directly from Parvati into the birth state of Subhadra). This is the same Subhadra seen as the Deity in the center of the three wooden murthis of Jagannatha triad in Puri, Orissa, where you have Her brothers Balaram and Krishna on Her left and right.
From Arjuna, who to me had possesed a direct power and gifts of Shiva, and Subhadra, was born the son Abhimanyu, the son of Abhimanyu was Parik**** the Chief of the Kurus, and the son of Parik**** was Janamejaya the King of Hastinapur, the very same Janamejaya of this Devi Gita.
Now what was the state of mind of Janamejaya at that time? In terms of perspective of his mindset and personality, he attempted a great sacrifice to exterminate the Nagas or serpent-snake beings since one of the powerful Nagas named Takshak had killed his father Parik**** the famous "Chief" of the Kuru tribe who attained a status considered an Emperor, with a snake bite. So he had this torment always on his mind, and seeking peace from it.
Keep in mind, Hastinapur was also known for snakes (and was also known as the "City of Snakes"). No doubt the Nagas were near by in those days. This aspect of Janamejaya's hatred of the Nagas may be a clue to later dialog within this Gita or song itself, we shall see.
There is an old ravine here, it is an old ravine carved in the times long ago etched by the Holy Ganges. Here is found a Linga established by Karna, also of Mahabharata fame. The worship of Kali also has deep roots here to the past.
And so we can see that this conversation occured many years after the Battle of Kurukshektra in historical timeline, and probably occured in or near The City of Elephants, Hastinapur. This City by the way, the "City-State" of the Kurus, was also known as a center for Jaina religion and not just Hindu, there are leelas associated here with the earliest of Arhants of Jainism from the deep shadows of the hoary past, the birthplace of 3 Jaina Tirthankaras.
No doubt many elephants were enlisted into the fighting machine of these Kuru warriors of that time, and so the City of Elephants. These elephants must have had large herds in the adjacent forests of Hastinapur. But in the future to come, the Mahouts or elephant drivers would see their diaspora as many would find their new future at a place known as Old Delhi.
So this Gita begins as a request from King Janamejaya to the sage Vyasa that the Sage tell of the glory of Saktidevi, asking Vyâsa of the Devi we know of called Parvati, but particular to Her charming genre as the One who resides on top of the Himalayas.
This Sage Vyasa is considered one of the seven Chiranjivins or those who have a life that is so very long they can be called Imortal, and he is the same sage who not only lived during the time of Krishna but also documented the events known as the Mahabharata.
I picture this conversation between Janamejaya and the Sage Vyasa taking place in the assembly square of the Raj, I imagine many columns or pillars forming a boundary of this assembly square, each column crowned on top with elephant motif, probably four faced looking in all four directions. Even the courtly priests listen in respect to the Sage. Arjun would have been remembered, no doubt his favorite horse depicted in stone, and Arjun himself alongside his Ever Well Wisher, Krishna. The murti of Devi Herself would be in a shrine not far away. At that time, Ganga Maa was near. There was a famed Linga found in a prominent temple that could be seen from the assembly square, and water birds on flight to the Ganga could be seen from the open air ceilings of this square.
We can see clearly, this descendent of Arjuna was already a great devotee of Devi. And perhaps there is this fondness due also to Parvati's energy within Krishna's half-sister. A pride in the Goddess from which you could claim family descent no doubt may have contributed to Janamejaya's devotion to Devi.
She is known as The Queen of the Mountains to this lineage of Kurus. The manifestation known as Annapurna, Who is the Queen of Kashi (which fell within the realm of the Kuru empire) is said to have come first from mountains of Kashmir.
Here in the Devi Gita, The Mother of the World is called the Highest Light by Janamejaya because the place given mention here in the Himalayas was known by the ancients and wise as the highest point in the world on Mother Bhumi Earth.
When Mahadev was described as going into samadhi, forgetting all his knowledge of Samsâra, it seems the normal course of things slowed down, even this wheel of birth and death almost would stop turning, karma itself slowed, rules may not have been so fixed in time and measure - and as typical in such times of uncertainty some take chances in perhaps a desperate need to hedge one's bets and to protect one's self. We are not the only beings between us and the divine, in the middle between both are many others, often very powerful in our own terms, it seems one decided to do something very different and so this demon appears.
When you meditate with success, you effect your very inner self. When more advanced practitioners meditate, this effect can permeate outward even and effect things and those around them. Just imagine, when Siva meditates. Yet, there seems to be a place called Manidvipa, which is said is Sarva Loka, it is a perfumed place where Devi resides, it was Her design. It sits above Bhumi Mother Earth. What you imagine as beautiful and a garden of paradise in your world, this vision can come alive in Her garden. Whatever is the highest concept of beauty, that highest concept becomes a reality there. So you can only fathom, what it looks like when the highest beauty in the minds of the Devatas comes to life there, the beauty may even strike one who is not ready to see it even dead so overwhelming it may be. You are protected, you will see whatever is your highest beauty, this can grow too, if you remember that Devi is Beauty.
This is a place where the rules of the wheel of birth and death are broken, it was before Siva meditated, and while meditating, and after. So such things never applied in the first place where the Devi resides. Kalpa Vriksa is always wakeful for you there, no matter Who is sleeping, and it is full of sounds because many, many Devatas visit that place, their mounts are lined up like so many vehicles parked in front of the palace of the great Maharaja.
Often times She comes first in the Form of Light. It seems that was true, when She answered the call of many and Devatas to crush this demon under Her. It was said by the Sage to be Red in lustre and Cooling. This is how it was described to the descendent of Arjuna. So this must be the vision if he saw it. I do not know what color it would be if you or I saw, but it is not the first time I have heard of the cooling hand of Devi on the forehead of Her children in fever. Strange tropics are not so strange afterall, you can easily recognize things inside those places, yes?
On Her forehead was the half-cresent moon. You have seen that before, no doubt. Devi wears this. She speaks in a sweet cuckoo voice, like a bird.
The Divine Presence of those Who came to call on Her, they asked Her to fullfil the promise that Gauri of the Mountains, the Sakti and spouse of Shiva Who now was in meditation, have a Son as was told. She was to awaken a Child that would spell the end of a demon. And awaken Shiva. Simply Her promise to those Who called upon Her that their wishes would come true, that was enough to awaken Her Father known as the King of the Himalayas. Because He is Her Father, so we benefit that this place on our planet is also called Her home. We are very lucky indeed!
So then begins the next chapter, as She begins to speak the very secret essences. I cannot wait to read the next Chapter. I am finding this Gita can transcend even the simplist of translations to warm the heart, and excite the soul. Jai Devi!
Om Namah Sivaya
Kalidas
Well-Known Member
Nice review Shivafan. My favorate quote was this one, I may just change my sig.
What intelligent man can desist from hearing these nectar-like words about the S'akti? The danger of death may come even to the Davas that drink nectars but no such danger can possibly come to those that drink the nectar of the Devî's glorious deeds.
To me it means that even the devas can fall to evilnrss if they give into wordly pleasures. But if you get your pleasure and joy from ma Devi you never have to worry. What a powerfuly thoutght that even the Gods can fall prey to to the sins of mortals but with Devi not even us lowly mortals have to worry.
What intelligent man can desist from hearing these nectar-like words about the S'akti? The danger of death may come even to the Davas that drink nectars but no such danger can possibly come to those that drink the nectar of the Devî's glorious deeds.
To me it means that even the devas can fall to evilnrss if they give into wordly pleasures. But if you get your pleasure and joy from ma Devi you never have to worry. What a powerfuly thoutght that even the Gods can fall prey to to the sins of mortals but with Devi not even us lowly mortals have to worry.