Can a Genesis God be Explained from a Science Perspective? (part 2)

[Dante Writer]

If you have not read part 1 of this discussion it is here:

http://www.religiousforums.com/thre...ned-from-a-science-perspective-part-1.186233/

In part one of this discussion I examined the "God" as described in Genesis KJV as creating the heavens and earth. That chapter does not say what God is and only describes it as "God" with some force to mold particles, matter and energy together into some form.

1-."In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth."

I looked for a scientific explanation of a force that could do that and it is the "Laws" that govern all particles, matter and energy in the universe.

Some people didn't like the term "laws" applied that way and I have tried to make it clear that the term "law" is how we describe the phenomena and forces that applies to all things in the universe.

phe·nom·e·non: a fact or situation that is observed to exist or happen, especially one whose cause or explanation is in question.
PHILOSOPHY
the object of a person's perception; what the senses or the mind notices

The Laws of science and nature are observed to exist and happen and while we can measure and test those laws the explanation of those laws is in question and the question is why those laws exist at all.

So we can examine a common definition of God and see if it can be considered a phenomenon.

God: 1- (in Christianity and other monotheistic religions) the creator and ruler of the universe and source of all moral authority; the supreme being.

2- (in certain other religions) a superhuman being or spirit worshiped as having power over nature or human fortunes; a deity.

Since I am using the KJV version of the bible accepted widely by christian and other God faiths we will use only the definition number 1.

Now the definition says a "supreme being" which I think throws many people off as it has a connotation that God is a being like us.

su·preme: (of authority or an office, or someone holding it) superior to all others.

Since the laws do exist and can not be violated and controls all actions and reactions in the universe then it is fair to say the laws are supreme even to the will of man which must follow those laws.

Being: the quality or state of having existence

I looked through many definitions and they all seem to state that "Being" is a state of existence and can be applied to any object or organism or in this case the laws of science and nature.

So from that I can say that God as described in Genesis can be the Laws that are a phenomenon we know exists in the Universe and that controls and holds the universe together down to the smallest particles and energy and whose force we do not fully understand and is supreme even to the will of man is a Supreme Being.

Your thoughts?

 

[Sapiens]

If you have not read part 1 of this discussion it is here:

http://www.religiousforums.com/thre...ned-from-a-science-perspective-part-1.186233/

In part one of this discussion I examined the "God" as described in Genesis KJV as creating the heavens and earth. That chapter does not say what God is and only describes it as "God" with some force to mold particles, matter and energy together into some form.

1-."In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth."

I looked for a scientific explanation of a force that could do that and it is the "Laws" that govern all particles, matter and energy in the universe.

Some people didn't like the term "laws" applied that way and I have tried to make it clear that the term "law" is how we describe the phenomena and forces that applies to all things in the universe.

phe·nom·e·non: a fact or situation that is observed to exist or happen, especially one whose cause or explanation is in question.
PHILOSOPHY
the object of a person's perception; what the senses or the mind notices

The Laws of science and nature are observed to exist and happen and while we can measure and test those laws the explanation of those laws is in question and the question is why those laws exist at all.

So we can examine a common definition of God and see if it can be considered a phenomenon.

God: 1- (in Christianity and other monotheistic religions) the creator and ruler of the universe and source of all moral authority; the supreme being.

2- (in certain other religions) a superhuman being or spirit worshiped as having power over nature or human fortunes; a deity.

Since I am using the KJV version of the bible accepted widely by christian and other God faiths we will use only the definition number 1.

Now the definition says a "supreme being" which I think throws many people off as it has a connotation that God is a being like us.

su·preme: (of authority or an office, or someone holding it) superior to all others.

Since the laws do exist and can not be violated and controls all actions and reactions in the universe then it is fair to say the laws are supreme even to the will of man which must follow those laws.

Being: the quality or state of having existence

I looked through many definitions and they all seem to state that "Being" is a state of existence and can be applied to any object or organism or in this case the laws of science and nature.

So from that I can say that God as described in Genesis can be the Laws that are a phenomenon we know exists in the Universe and that controls and holds the universe together down to the smallest particles and energy and whose force we do not fully understand and is supreme even to the will of man is a Supreme Being.

Your thoughts?

I think that you are repeating claims that lots of folks have already demonstrated are horse pucky. The hamburger discussion was more useful and had more truth in it,

 

[Ingledsva]

... In part one of this discussion I examined the "God" as described in Genesis KJV as creating the heavens and earth. That chapter does not say what God is and only describes it as "God" with some force to mold particles, matter and energy together into some form.

1-."In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth."

I looked for a scientific explanation of a force that could do that and it is the "Laws" that govern all particles, matter and energy in the universe.

Some people didn't like the term "laws" applied that way and I have tried to make it clear that the term "law" is how we describe the phenomena and forces that applies to all things in the universe.
...
So from that I can say that God as described in Genesis can be the Laws that are a phenomenon we know exists in the Universe and that controls and holds the universe together down to the smallest particles and energy and whose force we do not fully understand and is supreme even to the will of man is a Supreme Being.

Your thoughts?

What? You are trying to turn the simple story teaching myth of an ancient people, into science!

It says ELOHIYM in Gen 1 - meaning Gods, - not some scientific concept.

And tells us this Elohiym is named YHVH in Gen 2. Thus it says - YHVH ELOHIYM. Which I read as YHVH of the ELOHIYM (Gods.)

It also has those ELOHIYM (Gods) making male and female in their image.

Gen 1:26 And the Elohiym said, Let us make mankind in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.

Gen 1:27 So the Elohiym created mankind in their own image, in the image of Elohiym created they them; male and female created they them.

Also - they show us in Gen 2:3 and Exodus 20 that they mean actual days, - not ages.

Gen 2:3 And Elohiym blessed the seventh day and sanctified it, because He rested from all His work on it, which Elohiym had created to make.

Exo 20:11 For in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore the LORD blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it.

ONE day made holy, - because he rested on that ONE day. Thus Not an age.

*

 

[Altfish]

Why do we have to have a 'God' to do this? It only moves the discussion one place further, i.e. we are left with the question "Who created god?"

It also doesn't explain why this 'thing' can watch over me, decide if I'm going to hell, stops me picking sticks on the Sabbath.

I'm sorry but trying to bring god into this discussion is folly.

 

[LegionOnomaMoi]

If you have not read part 1 of this discussion

Have you?

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

So from that I can say that God as described in Genesis can be ...

You're deriving your description of "God as described in Genesis," from an early (and questionable) Christian translation of Jewish text. All the rest is babble.