Can You Choose To Believe/Disbelieve?

[Sunstone]

Can a person actually choose to believe in deity? That's to say, if someone has no experience of deity, can they choose to believe in deity, or will there always be a part of them that doubts?

Can a person actually choose NOT to believe in deity? Again, that's to say, if a someone has an experience of deity, can they choose not to believe in deity, or will there always be a part of them that believes?

Is there some important sense in which a person can neither choose to believe something nor choose not to believe something? If so, what sense is that? If not, why not?

IF a person chooses to believe something they don't really believe -- or chooses not to believe something they really believe -- what happens to them emotionally? What are the psychological or spiritual consequences of such a course of action? Do they loose touch with themselves and their values?

 

[Nanda]

No, you can't choose what you believe, you either do, or you don't. You can pretend to have a belief, and go through all the motions of believing, but if you don't honestly believe on that gut level, no amount of protestation is going to change that. And vice versa.

 

[FFH]

Wow, such an active mind...

The thing that comes to mind strongly is that every man/woman is given the "light of Christ" and it's hard to just put that aside and ignore it..

At least for me it is...

It's like a constant nagging, but in a good way...

 

[wizanda]

Always Known Go'o'd......................... then ran off..... Got in trouble and have too seek help………………………………………………….......now doing all this to help others see............................

 

[ChristineES]

It depends on each person. I think there may be some who choose, but most people I have seen either believe or don't believe. But I have only met about 1% or less of the population of the earth.

 

[vandervalley]

Can a person actually choose to believe in deity? That's to say, if someone has no experience of deity, can they choose to believe in deity, or will there always be a part of them that doubts?

Well Christian priests and Buddhist monks are good examples. Some of them may not have experienced any "divine stuff" but their believe is so strong that they are willing to give up their normal life for it

 

[eudaimonia]

I tend to agree with Nanda, but here is something I have been speculating about:

I don't see how I could choose to believe in the existence of a deity any more than I could choose to believe that the Moon is made of green cheese (and pass a lie detector test). I would have to be persuaded.

But I don't know if this applies to all people. Certainly, some New Agers I have known seem to have been able to believe just about anything without much thought...

Perhaps people who are trained in critical thinking must be rationally convinced because that is their personal epistemology. And people who have a more permissive personal epistemology can pick and choose their beliefs.

Just a thought. I still think that most beliefs one might have are not held with great conviction -- they haven't "gotten under one's skin" to become one's personal truths. Still, I wonder if we all play by the same rules.


eudaimonia,

Mark

 

[PureX]

For many years I viewed life very negatively. I looked around me and all I saw was greed and stupidity, men and women acting like dumb animals in a world full of life forms that have to kill and eat each other to survive. I felt like I was being forced to run a race that I didn't want any part of, and was losing.

Then one day a person came along who was willing to take the time and expend the effort to teach me that the way I see and experience the world is the result of how I am choosing to look at it. And although it took some time, this person succeeded, and I did finally come to realize that I had been choosing to look only at the negative aspect of existence, and ignoring the positive, and that the result was that life had become a very negative experience for me.

If one had asked me before I was made to see this, I would have insisted that I was NOT choosing to see the world as I did, and that the world really IS as I was seeing it. But now I understand that I was in fact choosing to see on;y the negative, and not see the positive, and that as a result the world looked a lot more negative to me that it really is.

So now I have a new understanding and appreciation of the inaccuracy of my own perceptions, and of how my own bias can create it's own "truth". When things begin to look bad in my life, I now can consciously choose to seek out the positives within the negatives, and focus on them and nurture them until they grow within my field of perception, and so change my pessimistic attitude.

People who don't know that they have a choice in what they believe to be the "truth", of course will say that they don't have a choice in what they believe, even though they DO have a choice, and are already engaged in exercising that choice. It's just that they are not yet aware that they're doing so.

 

[Nanda]

PureX, there's an enormous differenece between trying to see both sides of an issue and believing with all your conviction that something supernatural exists.

 

[Willamena]

Can a person actually choose to believe in deity? That's to say, if someone has no experience of deity, can they choose to believe in deity, or will there always be a part of them that doubts?

On the flowchart of Life, belief follows understanding, so the method to belief is through information. The experience is information, and if interpreted as "God" then they can believe.

Can a person actually choose NOT to believe in deity? Again, that's to say, if a someone has an experience of deity, can they choose not to believe in deity, or will there always be a part of them that believes?

Disbelief is a type of belief; it, too, follows understanding and so requires information. If they have some information that contradicts the experience, then they can disbelieve.

If there is a "part of them that believes" or disbelieves, it is more accurately belief or disbelief about a part (particular aspect) of the thing.

Is there some important sense in which a person can neither choose to believe something nor choose not to believe something? If so, what sense is that? If not, why not?

I don't believe it's possible to not formulate belief (or disbelief) of a thing if information is present. When we do say things like, "I don't have a belief one way or the other," it's usually meaning that opinion is being withheld or abstained from ("belief" is often used as a synonym for opinion). Hence apathy.

IF a person chooses to believe something they don't really believe -- or chooses not to believe something they really believe -- what happens to them emotionally? What are the psychological or spiritual consequences of such a course of action? Do they loose touch with themselves and their values?

I don't believe it's possible to choose to believe something that is actually disbelieved. Belief and disbelief are involuntary, and therefore part of being "true to oneself." It is possible, though, to express an opinion either way, regardless of your actual beliefs, or to be "programmed" for an opinion of rote.

If they consistently express (or are forced to express) an opinion that contradicts their beliefs, I can see the possibility of it being emotionally damaging.

I don't know what the psychological consequences might be.

I don't believe in "spiritual consequences." Spirit is what is, and consequence happens over a period of time.

 

[fullyveiled muslimah]

If we cannot choose what to believe, and what not to believe, and whether or not to act on it, what do we choose in this life? Can we choose anything that has a profound bearing on our own existance and possibly others?

I think saying one cannot choose to believe/disbelieve are displaying a fatalist attitude. You either will or won't and it's not up to you, is a major cop out to me. It is my belief that we can choose a whole lot more about our lives, actions, and outlooks then we want to take credit for.

 

[Nanda]

If we cannot choose what to believe, and what not to believe, and whether or not to act on it, what do we choose in this life? Can we choose anything that has a profound bearing on our own existance and possibly others?

I think saying one cannot choose to believe/disbelieve are displaying a fatalist attitude. You either will or won't and it's not up to you, is a major cop out to me. It is my belief that we can choose a whole lot more about our lives, actions, and outlooks then we want to take credit for.

Could you choose not to believe in God? Would you actually stop believing?

 

[Wandered Off]

All beliefs are a choice. You cannot believe or disbelieve something unless you choose to.

 

[Nanda]

All beliefs are a choice. You cannot believe or disbelieve something unless you choose to.

What if I chose to believe in God, but never actually believe? Isn't that lying to yourself?

 

[Wandered Off]

What if I chose to believe in God, but never actually believe? Isn't that lying to yourself?

I would say you didn't really choose to believe but rather wanted to believe. Some mental process kept you from doing so, whether it be not having convincing evidence or whatever standard of belief you set. Because you set that standard that the belief didn't meet, you chose not to believe. At least that's how I see it.

I want there to be a Santa Clause who gives all the children in the world gifts, but I don't believe in one. I choose not to believe because the evidence overcomes my wish, and I'm the one who decided that evidence was more important in this case.

 

[Booko]

Can a person actually choose to believe in deity? That's to say, if someone has no experience of deity, can they choose to believe in deity, or will there always be a part of them that doubts?

I don't think they can just choose to believe in deity. They can choose to look, though.

Can a person actually choose NOT to believe in deity? Again, that's to say, if a someone has an experience of deity, can they choose not to believe in deity, or will there always be a part of them that believes?

See above.

Is there some important sense in which a person can neither choose to believe something nor choose not to believe something? If so, what sense is that? If not, why not?

If you believe something to be "true" can you choose to believe it is "not true"?

Again, you can choose to look for a reason to change a belief, but to choose to believe something you don't actually believe is otherwise known as living in denial. Or cognitive dissonance.

IF a person chooses to believe something they don't really believe -- or chooses not to believe something they really believe -- what happens to them emotionally? What are the psychological or spiritual consequences of such a course of action? Do they loose touch with themselves and their values?

I've never noticed that people living in denial are particularly happy.

Heck, in extreme cases, people can be driven to suicide.

That ain't a nice place to be.

 

[Booko]

The thing that comes to mind strongly is that every man/woman is given the "light of Christ" and it's hard to just put that aside and ignore it..

I found it much easier to put it aside and ignore it than to participate in things that I knew to be morally wrong done in Christ's name.

While obviously I can't speak for my husband directly, for years he was agnostic, and honestly, how could he belong to a religion he didn't believe in without being a hypocrite? He found no reason to believe, so he didn't.

 

[Booko]

But I don't know if this applies to all people. Certainly, some New Agers I have known seem to have been able to believe just about anything without much thought...

Perhaps people who are trained in critical thinking must be rationally convinced because that is their personal epistemology. And people who have a more permissive personal epistemology can pick and choose their beliefs.

I think you've hit something here, eudamonia. There's more to epistemology than just one method, and each person has a personal preference for some methods over others.

For those of us who lean more toward reason and empiricism, we require more tangible, more objective proofs. Others are naturally inclined towards intuition, or tradition (historical knowledge) and so they require less of that sort of thing.

If there is one common thread among atheists, it's the tendency towards reason and demanding objective empirical evidence. Unfortunately, metaphysics doesn't always work that way, so many of us remain unsatisfied during our search for the Divine and remain athiests.

In my case, I was unwilling to move away from atheism until I went searching for "tradition" -- that is looking at the broad swath of human history where religion is concerned.

But that won't work for everyone either.

 

[Nanda]

I would say you didn't really choose to believe but rather wanted to believe. Some mental process kept you from doing so, whether it be not having convincing evidence or whatever standard of belief you set. Because you set that standard that the belief didn't meet, you chose not to believe. At least that's how I see it.

What's the difference? How could choosing to believe in something I don't believe in be any different than simply wanting to believe?

 

[Halcyon]

I don't think they can just choose to believe in deity. They can choose to look, though.

Yeah i agree with this.

People can't usually wake up one day and say to themselves "Today, i will mostly be believing in Zeus?" (frubals for the first person to guess the TV show i'm imitating ) It wouldn't be sincere.

I think people can choose to follow a path that could very well end in belief, even a belief that they currently couldn't imagine holding. And vice verse for the disbelief.

For example, a skeptic could willingly enter a spiritualist course, or an atheist could go to church for six months just for the experience/see what its like. During the experience they may be persuaded that God or whatever might deserve further research, which ten years down the line could result in their ordination as a priest.

On the other hand, a believer may choose to research the origins and doctrines of their faith at a high academic level, in doing so they will come across much evidence and gain a great deal of knowledge that could fill them with doubt, to the extent that they could even loose their faith.

Having said that, i also believe it is possible for someone to create a belief within themselves from nothing. It has to be possible, as a similar process is involved in brainwashing and indoctrinating children.
So, perhaps someone couldn't wake up with a rock solid belief in Zeus, but maybe if they devoted time everyday to thinking about Zeus, praying to Zeus, wanting to believe etc, then eventually that devotion could evolve into belief.