Christians: am I saved? (eternal salvation)

[an anarchist]

Christians, in your opinion, am I going to heaven when I die aka "saved"?

Dont give me that "only god knows" answer. I'm not interested in that.

Let me make my case for why I'm going to heaven if Jesus Christ is literally God and stuff.

I was a Christian from the time I understood it. This lasted until the time I was around 22-23. I prayed the salvation prayer so many times in middle school, for fear I didn't do it right the first time. The stakes were the highest ya know? Get it wrong or something and you will be in literal hell forever. But I really believed in Jesus Christ as a deity. It's not like I never believed in Him in the first place. I worshiped Him earnestly.

I have taken in new knowledge and life experiences. My beliefs have matured. I'm not calling Christianity immature, I'm saying my personal understanding's maturity led me away from Christ. Do you tell a person they never believed in Santa because they no longer do? No!

Is salvation eternal?

 

[Eddi]

Is salvation eternal?

The question as to whether or not one can become saved and then lose one's salvation has occupied theologians for centuries and I am not qualified to give you a good overview of this extensive issue and there will be many differing opinions out there, I have not looked into this in any depth but am aware that it is an issue in Christian theology......

Since I made a public commitment to Christ by getting baptised in I think 2020 or 2021 (I forget!) I have alternated between believing in Jesus and not believing in Jesus, I've gone through some pretty mad swings but in the end I have always swung back to him

During the phases in which I did not believe in Jesus did I lose any salvation I may have somehow gained?

I have absolutely no idea, and I don't think any human can satisfactorily answer that question!

Perhaps God knew I'd eventually come back to him? Like the Parable of The Prodigal Son:

Parable of the Prodigal Son - Wikipedia

So, in answer to your question: I don't know and nobody else knows either

The way I see it (and others may disagree with me) your question is a question that cannot be conclusively answered

Nobody knows!

It's a mystery but we will all find out in the end

 

[an anarchist]

So, in answer to your question: I don't know and nobody else knows either

Noooo you doubled down on giving me the answer I asked not to be given!

Lol just messing thanks for the response

 

[Sir Joseph]

Christians, in your opinion, am I going to heaven when I die aka "saved"?

Dont give me that "only god knows" answer. I'm not interested in that.

Let me make my case for why I'm going to heaven if Jesus Christ is literally God and stuff.

I was a Christian from the time I understood it. This lasted until the time I was around 22-23. I prayed the salvation prayer so many times in middle school, for fear I didn't do it right the first time. The stakes were the highest ya know? Get it wrong or something and you will be in literal hell forever. But I really believed in Jesus Christ as a deity. It's not like I never believed in Him in the first place. I worshiped Him earnestly.

I have taken in new knowledge and life experiences. My beliefs have matured. I'm not calling Christianity immature, I'm saying my personal understanding's maturity led me away from Christ. Do you tell a person they never believed in Santa because they no longer do? No!

Is salvation eternal?

You probably won't like my response either, but such is the case in asking for truth on a major disputed issue. You see, there are respected Christian sources on both sides providing reasonable, opposing views based upon scriptural interpretation.

Here's an excellent article from an evangelical Christian source that affirms the once saved always saved view:

Can a Christian lose salvation? | GotQuestions.org

Can a Christian lose salvation? Is there any way that salvation can be lost? Once I am saved, is that salvation assured and secured?

www.gotquestions.org

That should be enough to convince you of what you'd probably like to hear - that your insurance policy against going to hell is still in force even though you no longer pay the premiums. But, this article does an excellent job of negating that view:

Debunking "Once-Saved, Always Saved"

Does Scripture actually say you can never lose your salvation, regardless of what you do? Read this blog to find out what the Bible says.

pastorvlad.org

So, the answer is in fact not clear for most people holding no presuppositional viewpoints. Might I suggest an alternative thought for you to ponder instead?

As you've acknowledged, the fate of your eternal soul is too important to leave to luck or chance. Perhaps you did accept Christ into your heart at one time, but the fact that you rejected the faith a few years later tells me that you had little or no grounding in your beliefs. Like many young believers today, I suspect your faith was challenged by the secular school system, media, and culture teaching of evolution and relative morality values that oppose Genesis. Once Genesis is discredited, the whole Bible and Christian faith can be rejected by those wanting an excuse to live a self serving life of freedom from religion.

The problem is, Biblical truth remains valid regardless of the cultural trends of society. Look up at the night sky and the evidence for God is apparent to any reasonable person. Don't trust the Bible as representing that obvious creator we call God? Thanks to the past 100 years of critical thinking and attacks against the Bible, we now have abundant answers and evidence supporting it as divinely inspired.

If you perceive any chance whatsoever that you possess a soul, that there's something more to life than this short time here, then prudence dictates that you pursue truth on the matter with a serious open mind. I'd encourage you to study the Christian faith again - not just by reading the Bible, praying, or going to church, but by delving into the fascinating topic of Christian apologetics. There, you can find a preponderance of historical, archaeological, scientific, prophetic, textual criticism, and manuscript authority evidence supporting the Christian faith as the world's one and only true religion.

In time, you'll also learn that you want more than just the assurance of going to heaven instead of hell. The rewards and punishments in the next life will not all be equal. How you live your life here and now will affect your position and condition for eternity to come.

 

[an anarchist]

Perhaps you did accept Christ into your heart at one time, but the fact that you rejected the faith a few years later tells me that you had little or no grounding in your beliefs.

I was vibing with your response until I got here. You are absolutely wrong in your assertion. My whole life is not a few years either.

Like many young believers today, I suspect your faith was challenged by the secular school system, media, and culture teaching of evolution and relative morality values that oppose Genesis. Once Genesis is discredited, the whole Bible and Christian faith can be rejected by those wanting an excuse to live a self serving life of freedom from religion.

"I suspect" is the key phrase here. You are wrong.

I reconciled a literalistic interpretation of Genesis with critical thinking. It's called the Omphalos Hypothesis.

I love the last sentence there. Those who reject the Bible as literal truth want an excuse to live a self serving life. I love it because of how wrong it is.

I'd encourage you to study the Christian faith again - not just by reading the Bible, praying, or going to church, but by delving into the fascinating topic of Christian apologetics.

DUDE! OMG! It was APOLOGETICS that killed my Christian faith for good. Man I read apologetics and studied it earnestly all throughout highschool and allowed myself to be convinced by it. Then I tried using apologetics here on RF and the wise folk here shot my posts full of holes. Apologetics is weak. I have Christian apologetic books in my collection Evidence that Demands a Verdict for example. I tried reading that book again this year with an actual open mind and I was offended at the lack of intellectuality in the arguments for apologetics!

 

[nPeace]

Christians, in your opinion, am I going to heaven when I die aka "saved"?

Why do you want an opinion, may I ask?

Dont give me that "only god knows" answer. I'm not interested in that.

You can know, if you want to. I can show you how, if you like.

Let me make my case for why I'm going to heaven if Jesus Christ is literally God and stuff.

I was a Christian from the time I understood it. This lasted until the time I was around 22-23. I prayed the salvation prayer so many times in middle school, for fear I didn't do it right the first time. The stakes were the highest ya know? Get it wrong or something and you will be in literal hell forever. But I really believed in Jesus Christ as a deity. It's not like I never believed in Him in the first place. I worshiped Him earnestly.

I have taken in new knowledge and life experiences. My beliefs have matured. I'm not calling Christianity immature, I'm saying my personal understanding's maturity led me away from Christ. Do you tell a person they never believed in Santa because they no longer do? No!

Is salvation eternal?

I'll like to ask a few questions, if that's okay with you.
You said you were "a Christian from the time I understood it." Understood what exactly... What is is you understood?
You said, you "prayed the salvation prayer". Who said that was the right thing to do?
Why did you believe Jesus was a deity, and why did you believe you should worship Jesus?

Are you asking if salvation is eternal, to hear what the 'Christian' says?
The Bible says no.

As someone who is no longer 'Christian', I'll like your opinion on this.
Do you find it strange that the 'Christian' believes in Jesus, but believes or knows nothing the same book that tells him about jesus, says?

 

[nPeace]

I tried reading that book again this year with an actual open mind and I was offended at the lack of intellectuality in the arguments for apologetics!

Keep on seeking, and you will find. Keep on knocking, and it will be opened to you.

 

[Sir Joseph]

I'm surprised and disappointed with your response an anarchist but am impressed that you did some good Christian apologetics reading in earlier years. For sure though, our experiences have steered us in different directions.

As a child, I quickly absorbed and believed every Bible doctrine my Sunday school teacher taught me. I maintained a genuine but ignorant, blind faith in the Bible's accuracy and authority. And like most Christians of the day, I believed in evolution, long time periods, abortion rights, and other unbiblical values impressed upon me by the educational system, media, and culture. How did I reconcile such contradictory beliefs? Mostly by dismissing the Bible's authority and not worrying about such details. I accepted the Gospel message but remained ignorant and uninterested in the numerous related controversial Bible issues.

I started to assess my faith seriously for the first time in my late 30's when I met a Catholic girl. After studying the Catholicism vs Protestant issue, I moved on to other religions, then on to scientific, prophetic, and other evidential issues that finally shored up my faith in the Bible's unique features and reliability.
Concerning the creation vs evolution issue, I had no problem reconciling evolution and the Bible when I started and thus no bias view to favor. But, a learned preponderance of evidence against evolution and for creationsim, including the short time frames, prompted me to change my life-long views.

Evidence That Demands A Verdict by Josh McDowell was one of my first, big apologetic books. I thought, and still do, that it was excellent. I wonder what other books we've both read and drawn opposing conclusions from.

For the past several years, I've been building a library of sermons and presentations rather than reading books. I think it's conclusive evidence for the Christian faith, but no doubt it takes a receptive heart to change one's world view to a biblical view.

I compliment you on your time and effort towards the issue and am distressed that your extra apologetic studies have steered you away from the faith rather than to it. At least you seem to care unlike so many others. If you have time and desire, I'd be interested in your impression of this one example video presentation. If it seems intellectually reasonable and intriguing to you, then perhaps there's more Christian apologetic material for you to study. If you're not impressed, then I'll give up here, leave you alone, and just wish you well.

 

[Hermit Philosopher]

Christians, in your opinion, am I going to heaven when I die aka "saved"?

Dont give me that "only god knows" answer. I'm not interested in that.

Let me make my case for why I'm going to heaven if Jesus Christ is literally God and stuff.

I was a Christian from the time I understood it. This lasted until the time I was around 22-23. I prayed the salvation prayer so many times in middle school, for fear I didn't do it right the first time. The stakes were the highest ya know? Get it wrong or something and you will be in literal hell forever. But I really believed in Jesus Christ as a deity. It's not like I never believed in Him in the first place. I worshiped Him earnestly.

I have taken in new knowledge and life experiences. My beliefs have matured. I'm not calling Christianity immature, I'm saying my personal understanding's maturity led me away from Christ. Do you tell a person they never believed in Santa because they no longer do? No!

Is salvation eternal?

It is likely that:
• If you genuinely understand the harm that you have contributed onto others and genuinely repent the perspective you had when you caused/contributed to those harms;
• If you genuinely have cast aside the mindset which led you to contribute to the harming of others and replaced it with one by which you contribute to their harmony and peace instead;
• If you genuinely have understood that the mindsets of your own perpetrators too were misplaced and but rooted in a chain of lives, lived in harm and pain and never actions about you, but always actions entirely about them;
• If you genuinely have forgiven your own perpetrators for having expressed their own pains, damages and sufferings at your expense;
• If you thus have freed yourself from the burdens of your hatred

…then, you are yourself at peace in God already.


Humbly,
Hermit

 

[DNB]

Christians, in your opinion, am I going to heaven when I die aka "saved"?

Dont give me that "only god knows" answer. I'm not interested in that.

Let me make my case for why I'm going to heaven if Jesus Christ is literally God and stuff.

I was a Christian from the time I understood it. This lasted until the time I was around 22-23. I prayed the salvation prayer so many times in middle school, for fear I didn't do it right the first time. The stakes were the highest ya know? Get it wrong or something and you will be in literal hell forever. But I really believed in Jesus Christ as a deity. It's not like I never believed in Him in the first place. I worshiped Him earnestly.

I have taken in new knowledge and life experiences. My beliefs have matured. I'm not calling Christianity immature, I'm saying my personal understanding's maturity led me away from Christ. Do you tell a person they never believed in Santa because they no longer do? No!

Is salvation eternal?

No, you are not a Christian, obviously. And, your Santa analogy was just silly. When a man divorces his wife, is he still married, does he retain all the benefits of a married couple: legal or relationship wise?

You renounced your faith, your heart changed towards Jesus, you have rejected God's precedential creation. On what grounds would you be allowed to enter Christ's kingdom - who will you revere, the one that you trampled under foot? What communion do you have with one who considers Jesus to be King of Kings, and Lord of Lords?

But, understand this if you understand anything; Jesus Christ is not God, never was, and never will be - that's blasphemy, and you will look like an absolute train-wreck trying to prove it either Biblically, or philosophically.
Only the Father is God, He is undivided, unconfused, and one in all facets of His ontology.

...your deified Jesus notion may have precipitated your fall from grace?

 

[Philotheus]

Christians, in your opinion, am I going to heaven when I die aka "saved"?

Dont give me that "only god knows" answer. I'm not interested in that.

Let me make my case for why I'm going to heaven if Jesus Christ is literally God and stuff.

I was a Christian from the time I understood it. This lasted until the time I was around 22-23. I prayed the salvation prayer so many times in middle school, for fear I didn't do it right the first time. The stakes were the highest ya know? Get it wrong or something and you will be in literal hell forever. But I really believed in Jesus Christ as a deity. It's not like I never believed in Him in the first place. I worshiped Him earnestly.

I have taken in new knowledge and life experiences. My beliefs have matured. I'm not calling Christianity immature, I'm saying my personal understanding's maturity led me away from Christ. Do you tell a person they never believed in Santa because they no longer do? No!

Is salvation eternal?

Salvation does not last forever. Nor does any "Salvation Prayer" exist, at least to the what it claims.

 

[seekandfind]

Jesus said "the one who has endured to the end will be saved."-Mt 24:13

Paul said, "For as regards those who were once enlightened and who have tasted the heavenly free gift and who have become partakers of holy spirit and who have tasted the fine word of God and powers of the coming system of things, but have fallen away, it is impossible to revive them again to repentance, because they nail the Son of God to the stake again for themselves and expose him to public shame."Heb:4-6
And.....
"For if we practice sin willfully after having received the accurate knowledge of the truth, there is no longer any sacrifice for sins left, 27 but there is a certain fearful expectation of judgment and a burning indignation that is going to consume those in opposition. 28 Anyone who has disregarded the Law of Moses dies without compassion on the testimony of two or three. 29 How much greater punishment do you think a person will deserve who has trampled on the Son of God and who has regarded as of ordinary value the blood of the covenant by which he was sanctified, and who has outraged the spirit of undeserved kindness with contempt?"Heb 10

According to these and other scriptures you can lose salvation. There is a "once saved always saved" teaching that is a dangerous lie. What are your thoughts?

 

[exchemist]

Christians, in your opinion, am I going to heaven when I die aka "saved"?

Dont give me that "only god knows" answer. I'm not interested in that.

Let me make my case for why I'm going to heaven if Jesus Christ is literally God and stuff.

I was a Christian from the time I understood it. This lasted until the time I was around 22-23. I prayed the salvation prayer so many times in middle school, for fear I didn't do it right the first time. The stakes were the highest ya know? Get it wrong or something and you will be in literal hell forever. But I really believed in Jesus Christ as a deity. It's not like I never believed in Him in the first place. I worshiped Him earnestly.

I have taken in new knowledge and life experiences. My beliefs have matured. I'm not calling Christianity immature, I'm saying my personal understanding's maturity led me away from Christ. Do you tell a person they never believed in Santa because they no longer do? No!

Is salvation eternal?

As the only possible answers to your question are:

1) "Yes, you are saved",
2) "No, you are not saved" or
3) "I don't know how God will judge you"

and you forbid us to resort to (3), then either we are forced to agree with you or we are forced to say you are damned!

 

[Tinkerpeach]

Christians, in your opinion, am I going to heaven when I die aka "saved"?

Dont give me that "only god knows" answer. I'm not interested in that.

Let me make my case for why I'm going to heaven if Jesus Christ is literally God and stuff.

I was a Christian from the time I understood it. This lasted until the time I was around 22-23. I prayed the salvation prayer so many times in middle school, for fear I didn't do it right the first time. The stakes were the highest ya know? Get it wrong or something and you will be in literal hell forever. But I really believed in Jesus Christ as a deity. It's not like I never believed in Him in the first place. I worshiped Him earnestly.

I have taken in new knowledge and life experiences. My beliefs have matured. I'm not calling Christianity immature, I'm saying my personal understanding's maturity led me away from Christ. Do you tell a person they never believed in Santa because they no longer do? No!

Is salvation eternal?

No it's not eternal.

You can say the words all day but unless you believe them then you are not actually saved. If you are saved you begin your relationship with Christ and along with that relationship comes a change in your life. You begin living the life of a Christian, if you continue in sin without regards to Christ then you aren't saved.

That's not to say that we as Christians never fall short, we do all the time but you need to recognize that and try to improve.

If you reject God, even after being saved, then you are no longer saved. Now if you were sincere when you were saved then Jesus says He will never leave you and He won't, He will try and bring you back, sometimes by bringing you to rock bottom as He did with me. But you need to be willing to accept His help.

 

[seekandfind]

Do you think "he would bring you to rock bottom"? I know a lot of people think that way but it seems wrong to put that on Jesus. Wouldnt it be more like "he allowed you to go there"?

"When under trial, let no one say: “I am being tried by God.” For with evil things God cannot be tried, nor does he himself try anyone." James 1:13

 

[seekandfind]

Do you think "he would bring you to rock bottom"? I know a lot of people think that way but it seems wrong to put that on Jesus. Wouldnt it be more like "he allowed you to go there"?

"When under trial, let no one say: “I am being tried by God.” For with evil things God cannot be tried, nor does he himself try anyone." James 1:13

@Tinkerpeach

 

[Sargonski]

Christians, in your opinion, am I going to heaven when I die aka "saved"?

Dont give me that "only god knows" answer. I'm not interested in that.

Let me make my case for why I'm going to heaven if Jesus Christ is literally God and stuff.

I was a Christian from the time I understood it. This lasted until the time I was around 22-23. I prayed the salvation prayer so many times in middle school, for fear I didn't do it right the first time. The stakes were the highest ya know? Get it wrong or something and you will be in literal hell forever. But I really believed in Jesus Christ as a deity. It's not like I never believed in Him in the first place. I worshiped Him earnestly.

I have taken in new knowledge and life experiences. My beliefs have matured. I'm not calling Christianity immature, I'm saying my personal understanding's maturity led me away from Christ. Do you tell a person they never believed in Santa because they no longer do? No!

Is salvation eternal?

Existence is Eternal --- Whether or not "Salvation" is eternal .. kind of makes no sense as a question standing alone. Salvation from what ? ans supposed you are saved from Hell .. what ever that is .. whether this "get out of Hell Free" pass is good for eternity .. and can never be expunged .. is all very complicated stuff my friend .. all I can do is refer you to the Concierge - when you get through the pearly gates .. name is Sataniel .. very wise .. may be able to help sort this one out.

 

[Sargonski]

No it's not eternal.

You can say the words all day but unless you believe them then you are not actually saved. If you are saved you begin your relationship with Christ and along with that relationship comes a change in your life. You begin living the life of a Christian, if you continue in sin without regards to Christ then you aren't saved.

That's not to say that we as Christians never fall short, we do all the time but you need to recognize that and try to improve.

If you reject God, even after being saved, then you are no longer saved. Now if you were sincere when you were saved then Jesus says He will never leave you and He won't, He will try and bring you back, sometimes by bringing you to rock bottom as He did with me. But you need to be willing to accept His help.

God does not care about your rejection or lack of belief .. this has no bearing on Salvation .. That much is clear. The big question for you to consider is what Song will be played as you cross through the pearly gates ... and then after re-aquainting .. and some period of time has passed .. deciding on your where your next vacation will be .. In heaven there are millions of reality TV channels.. from which you can Choose. Just remember the rule though that you will not remember your past life while on vacation.

Oh and another rule ... there is not many rules in heaven but a few .. This one perhaps the most important .. Absolutely Praising of God .. after the first Million years .. every entity God encountered blowing nothing but smoke up backside became irritating and so God put an end to the practice. .. but .. this is not why I say your rejection has no bearing on salvation .. the Bible Tells you that.

 

[Tinkerpeach]

God does not care about your rejection or lack of belief .. this has no bearing on Salvation .. That much is clear. The big question for you to consider is what Song will be played as you cross through the pearly gates ... and then after re-aquainting .. and some period of time has passed .. deciding on your where your next vacation will be .. In heaven there are millions of reality TV channels.. from which you can Choose. Just remember the rule though that you will not remember your past life while on vacation.

Oh and another rule ... there is not many rules in heaven but a few .. This one perhaps the most important .. Absolutely Praising of God .. after the first Million years .. every entity God encountered blowing nothing but smoke up backside became irritating and so God put an end to the practice. .. but .. this is not why I say your rejection has no bearing on salvation .. the Bible Tells you that.

The doctrine of once saved, always saved is not taught in the Bible.

The versus that refer to that are referring to followers of Christ, if you don't follow Christ the salvation doesn't apply to you.

 

[Sargonski]

The doctrine of once saved, always saved is not taught in the Bible.

The versus that refer to that are referring to followers of Christ, if you don't follow Christ the salvation doesn't apply to you.

I think you missed a few of the central points and questions - 1) Existence is Eternal --- the question is then salvtion from what ? ... ohh our Sins .. No silly .. what is the purpose of Salvation .. after the cleansing away of Sin .. why would some one want such a thing .. what is the Prize ? did you miss the question ? I think not .. as is rhetorical as much as anything

"The Prize" = ?? not just Eternal Life .. a doctrine otherwise is not taught in the Bible .. but Eternal life not suffering eternal Torture.

So what is it you mean by once saved .. always saved .. is way unclear in space and time .. but to say what it is that "YOU think you mean ... and I have to guess at this point because you have not clarified .. is that a person who is "Saved" while here on the Earth .. can lose that ticket through the pearly gates while still here on earth .. if they do What ?? (insert clarificatio statement here)

I never said this silly doctrine was taught in the Bible - "once saved - always saved" so why have you put such word in the Mouth of the Prophet .. tell you when and where the sun shine come .. the way the Truth the Light.. which clearly you are running from or perhaps better put deflecting in failing to address the central points.

"Followers of Christ" (FOC)- followed by some suggesting that I am not part of this group .. in a backhanded way I know .. but is FINE .. as much as it is ironic and prophetic .. the words of the Prophet come true .... your deflection and subsequent projection .. your failings onto others !? (and do learn chess notation .. will help the progression towards enlighenment)

How .. and how not .. can ye be called FOC - if you don't know what following Christ means .. following what = The teachings of Christ.. and what are those .. with respect to the question of Salvation .. and how one achieves this prize ... avoids the bad place .. Hot Hot Hot. .. Some claim one can earn a free pass through Judgement .. which I find highly desirable.. but highly heretical ... for the Sola Fide adherents in the room.

So tell us .... I really want to know .. like the Rich Man ....following Jesus around saying "Savior" What must I do to be put right with God .. to get into heaven .. ? .

And with that the Floor is yours. -- What are the teachings of Jesus I must follow -->>>> to get the ticket into heaven .. pass through Judgement and not be thrown into the place of eternal torture. Por Favor !!