Christians: Kill family who mentions other beliefs to you?

[Primordial Annihilator]

ps. this is New Testament stuff... so get the shears!

Much of the Bible is tainted with the subjectivity of its authors..but that does not invalidate the central tenents of the message of Christ...it does not invalidate the christian religion and it's central message of love.
True christians ie ones who think for themselves and understood enough to have made a free choice do not see the Bible as some divine object in its own right...as if it where truly written by the guided hand of God inspired man and somehow immune to the immutable laws of entropy and decay.

These christians have nothing to fear from topics like these.

 

[Primordial Annihilator]

We Luciferians (I guess) do not 'like' seeing our closely related christian brethern under attack for some reason...I feel obliged to lend support.

 

[painted wolf]

Much of the Bible is tainted with the subjectivity of its authors..but that does not invalidate the central tenents of the message of Christ...it does not invalidate the christian religion and it's central message of love.
True christians ie ones who think for themselves and understood enough to have made a free choice do not see the Bible as some divine object in its own right...as if it where truly written by the guided hand of God inspired man and somehow immune to the immutable laws of entropy and decay.

These christians have nothing to fear from topics like these.

Agreed... I'm talking about those Christians who think the Bible is inerrant word of God.

wa:do

 

[Primordial Annihilator]

Agreed... I'm talking about those Christians who think the Bible is inerrant word of God.

wa:do

Yes they are a different breed entirely and very unlike true christians.

As my born again christian mother says fundamentalism is no fun and completely mental...how apt.

 

[Sententia]

Each is entitled to his own opinion.

The bible as fiction seems unfortunately for you to not be an opinion...

I do like how the bible starts though.

In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth.

God did it. The End.

I always enjoy people arguing against science while falling back on the bible in the same way medieval kings must have enjoyed fools that were less entertaining and more foolish.

The lions ate well. Just saying.

 

[Jeremiah]

Logic will only get you so far. You can't reason your way to God, no matter how smart you may be. No one ever found God through logic.

No one will ever find their way to God without reason and logic. True faith on can only rest on a foundation of true comprehension. You can't gloss over what you don't like simply because you find it disagreeable. You must do the calculations or you will ended up with nothing but blind faith.

The historical-philological criticism of the Bible is considered by the softminded as blasphemous, reason is often looked upon as the exercise of a corrupt faculty. Softminded persons have revised the Beatitudes to read, "Blessed are the pure in ingorance; for they shall see God.

Martin Luther King, Jr.

 

[smokydot]

No one will ever find their way to God without reason and logic.

Not so. Faith is not the result of reason and logic.

True faith on can only rest on a foundation of true comprehension. You can't gloss over what you don't like simply because you find it disagreeable. You must do the calculations or you will ended up with nothing but blind faith.

True faith can rest on the foundation of God.
However, faith with comprehension is so much richer and deeper.
But reason is not its master, it is only its servant, the intention for which it was given. . .to inform faith.

 

[smokydot]

The commandments of the OT are routinely discarded except for the ones Jesus alludes to by orthodox Christian interpretation as a new covenent is made between man and God the Father through Christ which centres upon his teachings in the gospels of the NT.

Christianity is not the simple monotheistic worship of the Abrahamic God Jehova of the Torah and OT (God the Father) it is the worship of the new triparite God of the Christians who is God the Father God the Son and God the Holy Spirit....Jesus was God the Son whilst on Earth and now as God the Holy Spirit.

Jesus is not now God the Holy Spirit. He is still God the Son. God the Holy Spirit is the third person of the (triparite) Godhead.

 

[smokydot]

Much of the Bible is tainted with the subjectivity of its authors..

That is a matter of opinion, based in pure conjecture, for the Bible presents itself as the revelation of God.
We get to decide whether to believe it or not.

but that does not invalidate the central tenents of the message of Christ...it does not invalidate the christian religion and it's central message of love.

Actually, the central message of Christianity is that, for love of them, Jesus came to satisfy the wrath of God on sin for those who believe in him.
Those who don't believe in him remain under God's wrath (Jn 3:18,36).

True christians ie ones who think for themselves and understood enough to have made a free choice

The true Christian is born again through faith in Jesus Christ (Jn 3:3).

do not see the Bible as some divine object in its own right...as if it where truly written by the guided hand of God inspired man and somehow immune to the immutable laws of entropy and decay.

The testimony of the Bible is quite contrary--"All Scripture is God-breathed". . .from the very mouth (breath) of God.

These christians have nothing to fear from topics like these.

No true Christian has anything to fear. . .including topics like these.

 

[smokydot]

Agreed... I'm talking about those Christians who think the Bible is inerrant word of God.

wa:do

Jesus said it was the word of God.

He believed it was the "word of God" in every detail. He believed that every jot and little tittle of the Law (the OT word for Scriptures) was the very truth of God
vested with the authority of God and backed by the power of God (Matt 5:17-19).

To emphasize that the OT was the infallible, inerrant word of God, Jesus used his regular formula for solemn assertion ("Truly, truly, I say to you") when he stated,
"until heaven and earth disappear, not one tittle (smallest stroke of the pen) will by any means disappear from the Law (Scriptures)."

He treated arguments from Scripture as having clinching force. When he said "It is written," that was final. There was no appeal against Scripture, for "the scriptures cannot be broken." God's Word holds good forever. He constantly scolded the Jews for their ignorance and neglect of Scripture: "Are you not in error because you do not know the Scriptures?". . ."Have you not read. . .?" "Go and learn what this means. . ."

And even more importantly, Jesus himself submitted to the OT as the word of God.
He lived a life in obedience to Scripture, and then he died in obedience to Scripture. When he arose, he explained who he was by the Scriptures (Lk 24:44-47, 25).
He presented himself to the Jews as the fulfiller of Scripture (Jn 5:39-40, 46-47).

And in asserting to the Jews that the OT bore divine authoritative witness to him, Jesus thereby bore divine authoritative witness to it.
Belief in the authority and truth of the OT was the foundation of Jesus' whole ministry.

That's all the evidence I need for its infallibility and inerrancy

 

[smokydot]

Yes they are a different breed entirely and very unlike true christians.

As my born again christian mother says fundamentalism is no fun and completely mental...how apt.

Fundamentalsim is nothing more than what its name means:
belief in the fundamentals of faith and evangelical Christianity, which are

inspiration and infallibility of Scripture,
the deity of Christ,
his virgin birth and miracles,
his penal death for our sin,
his physical resurrection and personal return.

Fundamentalism is simply orthodox Christianity.

Those are the beliefs of true Christians.

 

[smokydot]

The bible as fiction seems unfortunately for you to not be an opinion...

That is most definitely a personal opinion, whose authority is the person who holds it.

I do like how the bible starts though.
God did it. The End.

Why do you not like that?

I always enjoy people arguing against science while falling back on the bible in the same way medieval kings must have enjoyed fools that were less entertaining and more foolish.
The lions ate well. Just saying.

I won't be arguing against proven science.

 

[MW0082]

Logic will only get you so far. You can't reason your way to God, no matter how smart you may be. No one ever found God through logic.

Thats because logic only leads to real things....

 

[angellous_evangellous]

Fundamentalism is simply orthodox Christianity.

Those are the beliefs of true Christians.

Except for every historical church and their descendents, such as the Eastern Orthodox, the Coptic Church, the Chinese Orthodox, the Roman Catholics, and even the Reformers (!!).

There really is no basis to exclude the historical churches from "orthodoxy," but in doing so, you've given yourself as much authority as the Mormons or Jehovah's witnesses to exclude "fundamentalists" from "orthodoxy."

 

[angellous_evangellous]

Thats because logic only leads to real things....

If the logic is flawed then is conclusion "real"?

 

[MW0082]

lol that was a non sequitor

Not according to the Christian bible, I know the OT is relevant blah blah. However it did say women were not to speak in church. So that was what I was referring to. The machoism that god must be a man, because the Christian god looks down upon women.... at least the OT does...

 

[MW0082]

If the logic is flawed then is conclusion "real"?

I would have to say I never thought of that, but it would be real to the one with the flawed logic.

Not many Gods use logic, not saying all but most do not.... at least not logical to me...

 

[angellous_evangellous]

I would have to say I never thought of that, but it would be real to the one with the flawed logic.

Not many Gods use logic, not saying all but most do not.... at least not logical to me...

Yes, but how real?

An extreme example: Let's say that a person logically concludes that an oncoming train is a giant marshmallow. Would we allow them to stand on the tracks, gleefully accepting the impact of the train?

I agree that "logic," when fully informed and correct, leads us to the "real," but the "real" has some substance in itself. The trick of it is that we're not fully informed and our logic is usually flawed, but the real can run us over like a speeding train.

 

[smokydot]

Not according to the Christian bible, I know the OT is relevant blah blah. However it did say women were not to speak in church. So that was what I was referring to. The machoism that god must be a man, because the Christian god looks down upon women.... at least the OT does...

Those aren't the fundamentals of Christian faith, presented in post #251.

 

[MW0082]

Yes, but how real?

An extreme example: Let's say that a person logically concludes that an oncoming train is a giant marshmallow. Would we allow them to stand on the tracks, gleefully accepting the impact of the train?

I agree that "logic," when fully informed and correct, leads us to the "real," but the "real" has some substance in itself. The trick of it is that we're not fully informed and our logic is usually flawed, but the real can run us over like a speeding train.

That is a very good example, and I agree 100%.

However, how do you conclude what is flawwed logic from actual logic?

From the my POV religions seem to be one persons logic and than a runoff of that. Not what is actually logically to the Universe.