Jonathan Rex
Member
What is a Christian, by your definition? What is the requirement (so to speak)?
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Christians: What is a Christian?
- Thread starter Jonathan Rex
- Start date
Katzpur
Not your average Mormon
To me a Christian is someone who looks to Jesus Christ as his Savior and who seeks to emulate Him. If a person considers himself to be a Christian, I'll take him at his word. I don't see any specific doctrines as legitimately including or excluding anyone who claims to be a Christian from the Christian family. The Bible is far more clear on how Christians should behave than it is on what Christians should believe. According to Jesus Christ himself, "By this shall all men know that ye are my disciples, if ye have love one to another."Jonathan Rex said:
Jonathan Rex
Member
sojourner said:
How does one follow Jesus?
s2a
Heretic and part-time (skinny) Santa impersonator
Christian:"the name given by the Greeks or Romans, probably in reproach, to the followers of Jesus. It was first used at Antioch.
The names by which the disciples were known among themselves were "brethren," "the faithful," "elect," "saints," "believers."
But as distinguishing them from the multitude without, the name "Christian" came into use, and was universally accepted. This name occurs but three times in the New Testament (Acts 11:26; 26:28; 1 Pet. 4:16)."--Easton's 1897 Bible Dictionary
The names by which the disciples were known among themselves were "brethren," "the faithful," "elect," "saints," "believers."
But as distinguishing them from the multitude without, the name "Christian" came into use, and was universally accepted. This name occurs but three times in the New Testament (Acts 11:26; 26:28; 1 Pet. 4:16)."--Easton's 1897 Bible Dictionary
Scuba Pete
Le plongeur avec attitude...
Christian in the vox populi refers to anyone who believes that Jesus is the Christ.
In the words of the man himself:
John 13:34 "A new command I give you: Love one another. As I have loved you, so you must love one another. 35 By this all men will know that you are my disciples, if you love one another." NIV
In the words of the man himself:
John 13:34 "A new command I give you: Love one another. As I have loved you, so you must love one another. 35 By this all men will know that you are my disciples, if you love one another." NIV
Jonathan Rex
Member
NetDoc said:
Beautiful quote.
Now, read Chapters 14,15, and 16 of that same book and see where Yeshua prophesies the coming King Messiah. Yeshua was not the King Messiah.
Scuba Pete
Le plongeur avec attitude...
Can we stick to the OP? I don't participate in the "Jesus isn't the Christ" discussions for a reason. I did not think this is within the scope of the OP.
Jonathan Rex
Member
What does OP mean?
I've seen people use the term a couple times since I started posting a few days ago and I still don't know what it means. Too many abbreviations on line.
I've seen people use the term a couple times since I started posting a few days ago and I still don't know what it means. Too many abbreviations on line.
Scuba Pete
Le plongeur avec attitude...
OP= Original Post or Poster. It sets the topic and the scope of the topic for a thread.
joeboonda
Well-Known Member
Er, back to the topic, I believe a true Christian is anyone who at some point in their life believed in or on, that is trusted alone in Christ for salvation. That is, on some day they realized they were a sinner, that all sinners fall short of the glory of God and cannot exist with Him in their own righteousness, which is as filthy rags before a Holy God. So, they accepted what Christ did for them: He died on the cross, for the wages of sin is death, so He died, once for all. When we believe Christ's death was sufficient to pay for all our sins, and trust alone in Christ alone, for salvation, then we have his blood which washes away all our sins, past, present, and future, and we have His robe of righteousness imputed unto us in place of our own righteousness, we are sealed and indwelt with the Holy Spirit until the day of redemption, and are now adopted children of God, sometimes out of fellowship, but never out of relationship. Sometimes weak and doubting, but He never fails us. So, one who placed their trust alone in Christ alone, to me is a true Christian.
Jonathan Rex
Member
NetDoc said:
Ahh, thank you.
I'm not familiar with all the message board terms.
Jonathan Rex
Member
Btw, saying that Yeshua was not the King Messiah does not mean that he was not Messiah. It just means that he was the suffering Messiah. Messiah/Moshiach means Anointed One. Many were called Moshiach all through the Old Testament. In fact, Isaiah was called Moshiach (Anointed). Moses was Moshiach. Abrahim was Moshiach. Daniel, Ezekiel, Jeremiah, Micah, etc. All Moshiach. BUT, the King Moshiach is another story. Christians don't know this because their churches don't teach it. Read John Chapters 14-16 and you will see talk of the Counselor to come. That is the King Moshiach and Yeshua is the one speaking of him. Here I'll post it for you:
John 16:12
"I have much more to say to you, more than you can now bear. But when HE, the Spirit of Truth, comes HE will guide you into all truth. HE will not speak on HIS own; HE will speak only what HE hears, and HE will tell you what is yet to come. HE will bring glory to me by taking from what is mine and making it known to you. All that belongs to the Father is mine. That is why I said the Spirit will take from what is mine and make it known to you. In a little while you will see me no more, and then after a little while you will see me."
Step back a little bit to 16:7-11
"But I tell you the truth: It is for your good that I am going away. Unless I go away, the Counselor (NOT THE HOLY SPIRIT) will not come to you; but if I go, I will send HIM to you. When HE comes, HE will convict the world of guilt in regard to sin and righteousness and judgment: in regard to sin, because men do not believe in me; in regard to rightousness, because I am going to the Father, where you can see me no longer; and in regard to judgment, because the prince of this world now stands condemned."
There is more about the counselor throughout Chapters 14-15.
Christians (and even those who write Bible commentary) claim that this is the Holy Spirit exposing their ignorance. Ruach HaKodesh (Holy Spirit in Hebrew) is FEMININE, not masculine. Yeshua did NOT speak Greek. He spoke Hebrew/Aramaic. He may have understood Greek and spoke it when necessary but only when necessary and never when preaching to Jews.
Ruach HaKodesh and Shekinah are NOT Masculine Concepts.
There is NO WAY that Yeshua would have referred to the Holy Spirit as a HE.
It's out of the question.
Not possible.
The Counselor is the King Messiah.
Do not believe those who tell you otherwise.
Or at the least, ask them what word Counselor was translated from.
They will tell you Greek.
Ask them what the word is in Aramaic and Hebrew.
They won't have a clue.
If they do, then they will say King Moshiach.
That is the only Counselor promised.
John 16:12
"I have much more to say to you, more than you can now bear. But when HE, the Spirit of Truth, comes HE will guide you into all truth. HE will not speak on HIS own; HE will speak only what HE hears, and HE will tell you what is yet to come. HE will bring glory to me by taking from what is mine and making it known to you. All that belongs to the Father is mine. That is why I said the Spirit will take from what is mine and make it known to you. In a little while you will see me no more, and then after a little while you will see me."
Step back a little bit to 16:7-11
"But I tell you the truth: It is for your good that I am going away. Unless I go away, the Counselor (NOT THE HOLY SPIRIT) will not come to you; but if I go, I will send HIM to you. When HE comes, HE will convict the world of guilt in regard to sin and righteousness and judgment: in regard to sin, because men do not believe in me; in regard to rightousness, because I am going to the Father, where you can see me no longer; and in regard to judgment, because the prince of this world now stands condemned."
There is more about the counselor throughout Chapters 14-15.
Christians (and even those who write Bible commentary) claim that this is the Holy Spirit exposing their ignorance. Ruach HaKodesh (Holy Spirit in Hebrew) is FEMININE, not masculine. Yeshua did NOT speak Greek. He spoke Hebrew/Aramaic. He may have understood Greek and spoke it when necessary but only when necessary and never when preaching to Jews.
Ruach HaKodesh and Shekinah are NOT Masculine Concepts.
There is NO WAY that Yeshua would have referred to the Holy Spirit as a HE.
It's out of the question.
Not possible.
The Counselor is the King Messiah.
Do not believe those who tell you otherwise.
Or at the least, ask them what word Counselor was translated from.
They will tell you Greek.
Ask them what the word is in Aramaic and Hebrew.
They won't have a clue.
If they do, then they will say King Moshiach.
That is the only Counselor promised.
Jonathan Rex
Member
joeboonda said:
Ruach HaKodesh (The Holy Spirit) is a feminine concept. Look up the meaning of Ruach HaKodesh. Look up the Hebrew meaning. The concept of the Ruach HaKodesh is NOT a masculine concept and would never be referred to as a HE. Why do Christians insist on taking from other cultures and beliefs and altering them and then telling the people who originally believed it that they are wrong?
Ruach HaKodesh cannot be referred to as a HE. The Comforter is the King Moshiach, NOT the Holy Spirit. The prophecy of the coming comforter and King Moshiach was made VERY clear in Isaiah 9:6 but Christians try to pretend that it was fulfilled in Yeshua and it was not. Yeshua prophesied that it was still to come. He even said that he must leave for the comforter to come.
"Every warrior's boot used in battle and every garment rolled in blood will be destined for burning, will be fuel for the fire. For to us a child is born, to us a son is given, and the GOVERNMENT will be on his shoulders. And he will be called WONDERFUL COUNSELOR, Mighty God, Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace. Of the increase of his government and peace there will be no end. He will reign on David's throne and over his kingdom, establishing and upholding it with justice and righteousness from that time on and forever." - Isaiah 9:6-7
Yeshua did NOT establish a government. Yeshua did not bring peace to the world. Yeshua did not sit on Davids throne and unite the world under one faith. Yeshua did not fulfill the prophecies of the King Moshiach. Christians are accepting lies when they believe that. Yeshua WAS Moshiach. He WAS Anointed by God. But he was NOT King Moshiach and he even made that clear by saying that the counselor is to come.
Christians have altered the scriptures to fit their beliefs. They want to believe that Yeshua fulfilled all the prophesies, but he clearly did not. There are still wars. Wars MUST end during the reign of the King Moshiach and NEVER occur again. Yeshua did NOT accomplish this. The concept of the King Moshiach was even declared by Buddha before Christianity existed:
There will arise in the world a king, a fully enlightened Buddha endowed with wisdom and conduct. He will teach the law and proclaim the holy life in its fullness and purity. Siddhartha Buddha
The fact that the Holy Spirit had been with man since the beginning of human existence defies the idea that the Holy Spirit came after Yeshua's crucifixion. The fact that the Holy Spirit descended upon Yeshua at baptism defies the idea that he was conceived of the Holy Spirit. If Mariam was impregnated by the Holy Spirit (which is impossible because Ruach HaKodesh was FEMININE and considered the Mother aspect of God) then Yeshua would be the Holy Spirit and thus the Holy Spirit could NOT descend upon him, if he was already the Holy Spirit. Christians do not even understand the original language and they call themselves followers. How? How can you follow a man if you don't even know his language and what he spoke?
The Prophets ALL Prophesied through Ruach HaKodesh. Have you even read Isaiah, Daniel, Ezekiel, Micah and Jeremiah? Have you read about Samuel (who Anointed David as Moshiach)? Stop ignoring the truth. For two thousand years Christians have distorted Yeshua's teachings and have strayed from the path. Now there are thousands of versions of the Christian religion and the worst part is, YESHUA WAS A NAZARENE! He wasn't a Christian. He didn't teach Christianity.
Stop altering the message of the Word of God. Yeshua was the Word of God embodied in a human being. Yeshua was not God he was a Messenger of God. "I do only what my Father shows me." "If it written, 'Ye are gods, all of you are children of the Most High,' then why are you angry that I tell you that I am the son of God?" "
Yeshua was not a supernatural being who walked on water, raised the dead and performed magical acts throughout Israel. Those are LIES that were added by Romans who already believed in others gods who did those things. Yeshua was Yosef's son. He was born of a YOUNG WOMAN, not a Virgin. Christians have intentionally ignored that fact for years. Isaiah 7:14 "The young woman will be with child and will give birth to a son, and will call him Immanuel." The word "almah" does NOT mean virgin. It means a young woman who is to be married. Christians ignore the fact that Yeshua was born of Mariam and Yosef because that would mean that Yosef and Mariam came together before the marriage was completed. Christians, like Jews and other religions believe that Marriage is the ceremony and the contract. They have no knowledge of true marriage. To them it is a piece of paper and a ring. Yet Adam and Eve were called Husband and Wife by God after they slept together. They became one physically and spiritually.
To be a Christian by definition is to follow Christ. But Yeshua (whom you call Christ) was a Nazarene. Christians do not live as Nazarenes, therefore they do not follow Yeshua (whom you call Christ). Christians follow Paul. Paul is constantly quoted by Christians even though Paul contradicted Yeshua.
Do you think Yeshua ate pork? Even as a Jew that would be forbidden.
"What goes into the mouth comes out of the body" was not a reference and excuse for eating pork. It was a reference to washing your hands before eating meals. Stop taking things out of context and reapplying as you will. Yeshua said, "Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law (of Moses). No, I have not come to abolish it. I came to fulfill it (EMBRACE IT and MAKE IT COMPLETE)." Complete does not mean ablosished. It means, PERFECTED.
If I seem frustrated, it is because I am.
If I seem angry, it is because I am tired of lies being taught in the Father's name.
Yeshua was not GOD.
Stop worshipping a Moshiach and worship GOD.
Yeshua taught man to worship GOD.
"Our FATHER WHO ART IN HEAVEN" - Yeshua
"Woman, why do you call me good? None is good but the Father who is in Heaven." - Yeshua
How many ways can you be shown you are wrong before you repent and turn away from error? Why do you think Jews do not discuss religion and faith with Christians.
Christians don't like being told that they are confused and flat out wrong.
Muslims don't either but the fact that the Quran says Yeshua was born of a Virgin Mother (with no father) shows that Mohammed borrowed from Christianity which was a combination of numerous local religions throughout the Roman Empire.
His name wasn't even Jesus. It was Yeshua Ben Yosef.
BEN YOSEF means Son of Joseph. Yeshua translated properly is JOSHUA, not JESUS.
His disciples called him Yeshua HaMoshiach.
joeboonda
Well-Known Member
Jesus did teach the Holy Spirit would come when He left:
Isaiah 7:14
Therefore the Lord himself shall give you a sign; Behold, a virgin shall conceive, and bear a son, and shall call his name Immanuel
Matthew 1:23
Behold, a virgin shall be with child, and shall bring forth a son, and they shall call his name Emmanuel, which being interpreted is, God with us.
To a virgin espoused to a man whose name was Joseph, of the house of David; and the virgin's name was Mary. (Luke 1:27)
Only thing I would say about virgin, it can mean either a young woman, OR a virgin. In this case, When God said He would give a SIGN, a young woman conceiving is NOT a SIGN. A VIRGIN conceiving is a miracle and a sign. Very simple.
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John 14
1Let not your heart be troubled: ye believe in God, believe also in me.
2In my Father's house are many mansions: if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you.
3And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again, and receive you unto myself; that where I am, there ye may be also.
4And whither I go ye know, and the way ye know.
5Thomas saith unto him, Lord, we know not whither thou goest; and how can we know the way? 6Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.
Revelation 6: And he said unto me, These sayings are faithful and true: and the Lord God of the holy prophets sent his angel to shew unto his servants the things which must shortly be done. 7Behold, I come quickly: blessed is he that keepeth the sayings of the prophecy of this book.20He which testifieth these things saith, Surely I come quickly. Amen. Even so, come, Lord Jesus.
- John 14:16
And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you for ever;
John 14:15-17 (in Context) John 14 (Whole Chapter) - John 14:26
But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you.
John 14:25-27 (in Context) John 14 (Whole Chapter) - John 15:26
But when the Comforter is come, whom I will send unto you from the Father, even the Spirit of truth, which proceedeth from the Father, he shall testify of me:
John 15:25-27 (in Context) John 15 (Whole Chapter) - John 16:7
Nevertheless I tell you the truth; It is expedient for you that I go away: for if I go not away, the Comforter will not come unto you; but if I depart, I will send him unto you.
John 16:6-8 (in Context) John 16 (Whole Chapter)
Isaiah 7:14
Therefore the Lord himself shall give you a sign; Behold, a virgin shall conceive, and bear a son, and shall call his name Immanuel
Matthew 1:23
Behold, a virgin shall be with child, and shall bring forth a son, and they shall call his name Emmanuel, which being interpreted is, God with us.
To a virgin espoused to a man whose name was Joseph, of the house of David; and the virgin's name was Mary. (Luke 1:27)
Only thing I would say about virgin, it can mean either a young woman, OR a virgin. In this case, When God said He would give a SIGN, a young woman conceiving is NOT a SIGN. A VIRGIN conceiving is a miracle and a sign. Very simple.
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- Matthew 17:9 (Jesus said)
And as they came down from the mountain, Jesus charged them, saying, Tell the vision to no man, until the Son of man be risen again from the dead. - Matthew 20:19 (Jesus said)
And shall deliver him to the Gentiles to mock, and to scourge, and to crucify him: and the third day he shall rise again. - Mark 8:31
And he began to teach them, that the Son of man must suffer many things, and be rejected of the elders, and of the chief priests, and scribes, and be killed, and after three days rise again.
Mark 8:30-32 (in Context) Mark 8 (Whole Chapter) - Mark 10:34
And they shall mock him, and shall scourge him, and shall spit upon him, and shall kill him: and the third day he shall rise again.
John 14
1Let not your heart be troubled: ye believe in God, believe also in me.
2In my Father's house are many mansions: if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you.
3And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again, and receive you unto myself; that where I am, there ye may be also.
4And whither I go ye know, and the way ye know.
5Thomas saith unto him, Lord, we know not whither thou goest; and how can we know the way? 6Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.
Revelation 6: And he said unto me, These sayings are faithful and true: and the Lord God of the holy prophets sent his angel to shew unto his servants the things which must shortly be done. 7Behold, I come quickly: blessed is he that keepeth the sayings of the prophecy of this book.20He which testifieth these things saith, Surely I come quickly. Amen. Even so, come, Lord Jesus.
James the Persian
Dreptcredincios Crestin
I think someone in this thread needs to learn the difference between grammatical gender and actual gender, unless he wants us to believe that in Germany little girls are actually genderless and all Romanian swallows are female.
Oh, and by the way, Paraclete is the word used - that's Comforter, not Counsellor. Not an appellation that really seems to fit much with the role of a King, is it? Plus, it's quite obvious by the mocking sign at the Crucifixion that someone considered Christ to be the Kingly Messiah, isn't it? Otherwise the mockery would make no sense.
James
Oh, and by the way, Paraclete is the word used - that's Comforter, not Counsellor. Not an appellation that really seems to fit much with the role of a King, is it? Plus, it's quite obvious by the mocking sign at the Crucifixion that someone considered Christ to be the Kingly Messiah, isn't it? Otherwise the mockery would make no sense.
James