Conversations with people with delusions of infallibility

[Niatero]

Sometimes people look to me like they think their views can't be wrong. Maybe they don't always really think that, and it just looks that way, but for purposes of this discussion I'm just thinking of how it looks to me. What do you do when it looks that way to you and/or what are some good ideas about what to do? Leave them alone? Try to break through their defenses? Never give up trying to reason with them? I only just thought of this question and haven't thought much about it, so I'm having trouble thinking of examples of what to do.

 

[Estro Felino]

I think it's normal to disagree with someone.
Socrates said that debate, dialogue are productive because the truth is delivered from disagreement.

So whenever I believe there is disagreement, I think it's a positive thing, because I think of Socrates' method.

What scares me is when people do anything to elude the questions or to avoid debate.
So answering your question...I think one should debate with them nicely and explaining why you disagree with them.
Maybe thanks to you they can change their mind...thanks to your arguments.

 

[Heyo]

Sometimes people look to me like they think their views can't be wrong. Maybe they don't always really think that, and it just looks that way, but for purposes of this discussion I'm just thinking of how it looks to me. What do you do when it looks that way to you and/or what are some good ideas about what to do? Leave them alone? Try to break through their defenses? Never give up trying to reason with them? I only just thought of this question and haven't thought much about it, so I'm having trouble thinking of examples of what to do.

Pretty much what @Estro Felino said - at first. Some people are just confident in their opinion, but will admit having been wrong when shown to be. But there are people who know they are wrong but will never admit it. I will still debate them for the benefit of the audience, so their misinformation doesn't spread, but only to the point where I think I have made it obvious to the audience.

 

[Soandso]

Depends. What do you get out of such interactions? For me, I've learned various new things from discussing issues with folks I deeply disagree with. It's always important to keep an open mind in dealing with folks as you may glean a few useful things here and there from your interactions with them, imo

That said, I've also talked to some people that are so deeply delusional or are so deeply unreasonable that trying to have a conversation with them is just pointless. Using this website as an example, I haven't blocked anyone on here yet, but I've been tempted... I find that if I just scroll past someone's posts every time I see them because I know what they're going to say and that there will never be anything of value for me to read through, there probably isn't much point in trying to engage with them. Time is the most precious resource anyone has

 

[Tomef]

Sometimes people look to me like they think their views can't be wrong. Maybe they don't always really think that, and it just looks that way, but for purposes of this discussion I'm just thinking of how it looks to me. What do you do when it looks that way to you and/or what are some good ideas about what to do? Leave them alone? Try to break through their defenses? Never give up trying to reason with them? I only just thought of this question and haven't thought much about it, so I'm having trouble thinking of examples of what to do.

What bugs me is when people seem to want a discussion, but in fact only want to repeat what they already think over and over, or just randomly go off on tangents to avoid any questioning of their ideas or lack of clarity in expressing those ideas. Really gets my goat. Usually I give up after a few attempts to generate some sort of two way convo.

 

[Vinayaka]

Sometimes people look to me like they think their views can't be wrong. Maybe they don't always really think that, and it just looks that way, but for purposes of this discussion I'm just thinking of how it looks to me. What do you do when it looks that way to you and/or what are some good ideas about what to do? Leave them alone? Try to break through their defenses? Never give up trying to reason with them? I only just thought of this question and haven't thought much about it, so I'm having trouble thinking of examples of what to do.

We're all individuals. We have different intellectual abilities, English writing abilities, social skills, variations on humility and pride, etc. I think it's helpful to try to look at the person, as much as the words they are writing. I limit my debate/discussion just as I would in real life with certain kinds of people. We all have the right of disassociation.

 

[Niatero]

I'm trying to think how to describe what I do. It's different now from what I've ever done before, because my goals are different. Now my goal is mostly to post friendly comments and questions in discussions that interest me, without getting sidetracked into arguing and debating about anything. I do get into discussions sometimes about my disagreements with people, and it does look to me sometimes like they think they can't be wrong. I'm having trouble thinking of how to describe what I do. It's like, I just ... more or less don't let it bother me, and I explain my ideas like I would to anyone ... actually I'm not sure what I do. I'll try to pay more attention to it next time.

 

[Estro Felino]

Depends. What do you get out of such interactions? For me, I've learned various new things from discussing issues with folks I deeply disagree with. It's always important to keep an open mind in dealing with folks as you may glean a few useful things here and there from your interactions with them, imo

That said, I've also talked to some people that are so deeply delusional or are so deeply unreasonable that trying to have a conversation with them is just pointless. Using this website as an example, I haven't blocked anyone on here yet, but I've been tempted... I find that if I just scroll past someone's posts every time I see them because I know what they're going to say and that there will never be anything of value for me to read through, there probably isn't much point in trying to engage with them. Time is the most precious resource anyone has

I think the point of debate is challenging one's own opinion.
That's why I love debate.
Because I question my convictions every day. It's thirst for knowkedge.

But... a very good psychiatrist once said that many people have very faint convictions, that unfortunately can easily disintegrate, as soon as they are challenged. As soon as someone cast doubts on them.

Convictions are often what gives us comfort and balance.

 

[bobhikes]

Sometimes people look to me like they think their views can't be wrong. Maybe they don't always really think that, and it just looks that way, but for purposes of this discussion I'm just thinking of how it looks to me. What do you do when it looks that way to you and/or what are some good ideas about what to do? Leave them alone? Try to break through their defenses? Never give up trying to reason with them? I only just thought of this question and haven't thought much about it, so I'm having trouble thinking of examples of what to do.

I use the tactic of leaving them alone when I can. Changing one person is going to change the world. If I have to deal with them in a regular manner, then I will try to find common ground and slowly attempt to resolve the issue. I never block or fully cut off anyone, you need all views to accurately make decisions.

 

[Vinayaka]

What I sometimes notice is cognitive dissonance, where actions don't match the words. Just because you say, "I'm smart" doesn't mean you are from the view of others. I've noticed some people claim to have changed their behavior when they continue on the same vein.

But it's really no more than a personality trait they have, and although it's annoying, it more or less has to be tolerated, because the person may or may not be able to recognize they're doing it. Anyone who's worked around somebody with Asperger's, or other quirky personality things eventually gets used to it.

 

[Stevicus]

Sometimes people look to me like they think their views can't be wrong. Maybe they don't always really think that, and it just looks that way, but for purposes of this discussion I'm just thinking of how it looks to me. What do you do when it looks that way to you and/or what are some good ideas about what to do? Leave them alone? Try to break through their defenses? Never give up trying to reason with them? I only just thought of this question and haven't thought much about it, so I'm having trouble thinking of examples of what to do.

Most of the time, it's hardly even worth it, so I would just walk away. If that's not an option, then fighting fire with fire might help. Sometimes, you have to hold your ground and be just as stubborn as they are.

If they say "Yes, it is," then you say "No, it isn't" with equal conviction.

 

[Niatero]

Most of the time, it's hardly even worth it, so I would just walk away. If that's not an option, then fighting fire with fire might help. Sometimes, you have to hold your ground and be just as stubborn as they are.

If they say "Yes, it is," then you say "No, it isn't" with equal conviction.

So you're one of those people that I'm talking about, then.

Seriously though, that gives me an idea of how it might happen sometimes.

 

[Audie]

What I sometimes notice is cognitive dissonance, where actions don't match the words. Just because you say, "I'm smart" doesn't mean you are from the view of others. I've noticed some people claim to have changed their behavior when they continue on the same vein.

But it's really no more than a personality trait they have, and although it's annoying, it more or less has to be tolerated, because the person may or may not be able to recognize they're doing it. Anyone who's worked around somebody with Asperger's, or other quirky personality things eventually gets used to it.

You'd say all creationists have the same personality trait?

 

[Quintessence]

The idea of there being a simplistic "right" and "wrong" is an assumption I aim to not entitle. The painting of the landscape is not the landscape and every artist must paint the landscape in the fashion that suits who and what they are. Do not ask the artist to change their style for this is folly. Instead ask the artist to marvel at many other different paintings of the same landscape they themselves paint and see if they can appreciate the aesthetic. The artist may continue their favored style, honing it and refining it into something even more beautiful. The artist may adopt elements of another style, evolving and changing into something else that is beautiful. A few artists might simply refuse to walk into the gallery and look at other paintings of the landscape that they themselves paint; they only want to look at paintings by themselves or those who paint in a similar style. It could be they just plain don't understand other styles and see no value in them.

So be it. It will be as it must be. I don't really see a "right" or "wrong" to it, usually.

 

[Nakosis]

Sometimes people look to me like they think their views can't be wrong. Maybe they don't always really think that, and it just looks that way, but for purposes of this discussion I'm just thinking of how it looks to me. What do you do when it looks that way to you and/or what are some good ideas about what to do? Leave them alone? Try to break through their defenses? Never give up trying to reason with them? I only just thought of this question and haven't thought much about it, so I'm having trouble thinking of examples of what to do.

 

[Revoltingest]

As a friend told me, God gives Christians
the gift of "spiritual insight". They can't
be wrong about such matters. Any who
disagree with him aren't real Christians.

 

[Quagmire]

Some people have a need to be right even when they're wrong.

 

[Revoltingest]

Some people have a need to be right even when they're wrong.

Duh!
That's when the need is greatest.

 

[Niatero]

The idea of there being a simplistic "right" and "wrong" is an assumption I aim to not entitle. The painting of the landscape is not the landscape and every artist must paint the landscape in the fashion that suits who and what they are. Do not ask the artist to change their style for this is folly. Instead ask the artist to marvel at many other different paintings of the same landscape they themselves paint and see if they can appreciate the aesthetic. The artist may continue their favored style, honing it and refining it into something even more beautiful. The artist may adopt elements of another style, evolving and changing into something else that is beautiful. A few artists might simply refuse to walk into the gallery and look at other paintings of the landscape that they themselves paint; they only want to look at paintings by themselves or those who paint in a similar style. It could be they just plain don't understand other styles and see no value in them.

So be it. It will be as it must be. I don't really see a "right" or "wrong" to it, usually.

Thanks. That gave me a new idea. Thanks.

 

[Niatero]

Duh!
That's when the need is greatest.

Winner!
...

Oops. Sorry for bothering you again. (cringe, cower)