Dating Preferences: Bigotry or a Right?

[Saint Frankenstein]

One day you'll have to accept the fact that not everyone you want to screw wants to screw you due to various reasons, sometimes because you have a biological feature which he/she doesn't like.

People call it life. It's generally a good idea to accept it.

Maybe one day you'll grow up and discover the field of social sciences, instead of making everything out to be something puerile.

 

[Buttercup]

@Saint Frankenstein - What are your suggestions for choosing a romantic prospect to fit your guidelines as to what's not discriminatory?

 

[Flankerl]

Maybe one day you'll grow up and discover the field of social sciences, instead of making everything out to be something puerile.

So will "social sciences" reeducate people so that they want to screw everyone?
If so, why would that be good?

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

Boy, this thread has sure fallen into the gutter very quickly. Not my problem.

 

[MysticSang'ha]

So, straight people who are curious about sex with a bi chick like me can be partially influenced from cultural conditioning including bi-erasure. We aren't considered real people with real orientations typically except for when we are offered up as toys for straight women or Herero couples.

Lesbians who find me undatable can be partially influenced from cultural conditioning including bi-phobia. We aren't considered for our individual personalities but stereotypes of infidelity. I myself may be in an open relationship, but typically bi people - especially bisexual males - are seen as liars and manipulators.

Sometimes it isn't just a preference. Sometimes it's a Blind Spot of prejudice that influences dating preferences.

 

[Sunstone]

I think that some dating preferences like restricting onesself to certain races might not be a matter of deliberately choosing to be racist, but the fact that a person finds certain races unattractive can be an expression of underlying racism.

Perhaps. But it can also be no more than an aesthetic preference. Some psychologists argue that we tend to be attracted to people who have some of the features of our parents, especially our mothers. That by itself might explain a preference in many people for dating people of the same race as themselves.

I was once rejected by a Black woman because, she said, she just wasn't attracted to "white skin and blonde hair", but she was anything but racist in how she generally treated me, and we got along great -- except for that one time when, after she said she wouldn't date me, she had to call the janitor to detach me from clinging to her ankles.

 

[MysticSang'ha]

@Saint Frankenstein - What are your suggestions for choosing a romantic prospect to fit your guidelines as to what's not discriminatory?

I think it's very easy to tell somebody like SF to accept that not everyone will want to date him, but based on societal norms that all of us are unaware that we enjoy and benefit from except for non-binary and/or trans people. WE have been rejected before as cis people, but comparing the two is presumptuous IMO.

There is still a lot I have to learn, but I have my daughter to thank because she has a lot of friends who do not fit into the norms of gender identity. It's through her and her friends that I get a better idea of the unique struggles that non-cis people experience. Dating and pair-bonding is a very different kind of struggle for them.

Let me give an example...when a man tells a woman that being groped on a crowded subway is something they have either a) experienced and thought nothing much of, or b) something they WISH would happen to them. Usually these rebuttal occur when women bring up being groped and talking about how it really is a big problem with us, and it's something men don't quite understand.

Telling us that we shouldn't complain about it is similar to what is being offered to SF as the problems he and other non-cis people experience.

If we all had a solution that fit neatly into our current paradigm, I'm sure somebody would have figured it out by now. This is not a simple solution. But I think we can start by understanding the struggle exists.

 

[Buttercup]

I think it's very easy to tell somebody like SF to accept that not everyone will want to date him, but based on societal norms that all of us are unaware that we enjoy and benefit from except for non-binary and/or trans people. WE have been rejected before as cis people, but comparing the two is presumptuous IMO.

There is still a lot I have to learn, but I have my daughter to thank because she has a lot of friends who do not fit into the norms of gender identity. It's through her and her friends that I get a better idea of the unique struggles that non-cis people experience. Dating and pair-bonding is a very different kind of struggle for them.

Let me give an example...when a man tells a woman that being groped on a crowded subway is something they have either a) experienced and thought nothing much of, or b) something they WISH would happen to them. Usually these rebuttal occur when women bring up being groped and talking about how it really is a big problem with us, and it's something men don't quite understand.

Telling us that we shouldn't complain about it is similar to what is being offered to SF as the problems he and other non-cis people experience.

If we all had a solution that fit neatly into our current paradigm, I'm sure somebody would have figured it out by now. This is not a simple solution. But I think we can start by understanding the struggle exists.

I asked Frank in another thread if my straight son, who prefers Caucasian brunettes, was racist or discriminatory regarding his preferences. This thread was started because of some of the responses from Frank in the other thread. I don't think Frank is going to answer the question I posed here.

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

I asked Frank in another thread if my straight son, who prefers Caucasian brunettes, was racist or discriminatory regarding his preferences. This thread was started because of some of the responses from Frank in the other thread. I don't think Frank is going to answer the question I posed here.

Because this isn't about me as an individual and I don't appreciate multiple people jumping on me, being rude and asking irrelevant questions of me all at the same time. In that other thread, there were about 5 people doing that to me all at once last night. I don't feel the need to subject myself to that. This thread itself is basically a call out thread to me and I think I know why DS started this whole mess in the first place, but I digress.

 

[Buttercup]

Because this isn't about me as an individual and I don't appreciate multiple people jumping on me, being rude and asking irrelevant questions of me all at the same time. In that the thread, there were about 5 people doing that to me all at once last night. I don't feel the need to subject myself to that.

You made it personal when you stated what you thought was bigotry and geared it toward individual posters. I'm asking this question because while it's easy to criticize others for their romantic choices, why don't you give some positive guidelines as to what you find non discriminatory?

 

[Sunstone]

Because this isn't about me as an individual and I don't appreciate multiple people jumping on me, being rude and asking irrelevant questions of me all at the same time. In that other thread, there were about 5 people doing that to me all at once last night. I don't feel the need to subject myself to that.

Buttercup hasn't been rude to you, Frank, and I think her question about her son's preferences is a relevant analogy. But I'll grant that the latter can be disputed.

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

You made it personal when you stated what you thought was bigotry and geared it toward individual posters. I'm asking this question because while it's easy to criticize others for their romantic choices, why don't you give some positive guidelines as to what you find non discriminatory?

I said that what they were saying was bigoted because that's how it looked to me. I really don't give a **** who you want to date. If you need to ask for guidelines about respectful dating in general, that's rather sad. If you would like some tips on dating trans people or whatever, I could help with that. But guidelines on respectful dating in general? Wtf?

 

[Buttercup]

I said that what they were saying was bigoted because that's how it looked to me. I really don't give a **** who you want to date. If you need to ask for guidelines about respectful dating in general, that's rather sad. If you would like some tips on dating trans people or whatever, I could help with that. But guidelines on respectful dating in general? Wtf?

Eh. I don't feel like arguing this, I don't care enough. I'm not asking the question you think I'm asking. Maybe we both should reread that thread.

 

[Acim]

In another thread, the issue of dating preferences came up, and some posts stated that a heterosexual man's refusal to date a transgendered person because the latter has a penis is transphobic. Since I'm open to reconsidering my positions in light of reasoned arguments, I would like to hear others' thoughts on this.

Is having dating preferences such as the above a form of bigotry or a right?

Please discuss.

Decided to read the thread before responding.

I see it as bigotry. Not strong bigotry, as it would plausibly be an assertion that could, rather easily, be mitigated with a whole bunch of other claims that aren't representative of bigotry toward transgendered persons.

I'm currently not aware of the other thread where this discussion came up. But I have wondered myself about own heterosexual friends who claim to (or even demonstrate) great sexual attraction based on physical traits only, when a person is clothed (aka covering genitals). Example: see a female in a thong, and facially and perceived body is so attractive to them, they exclaim, "I'd definitely do that." Could follow up with, "really? That's your type?" And response may be, "oh heck ya. That right there is the ideal body type. I wouldn't hesitate even for a second to be sexual with that person." But then if that person without a thong was revealed to have a penis, it would suddenly lead to everything before that being denied, as if face and rest of body have NOTHING to do with overall physical attraction.

IMO, I think that sort of test could be done with many people and they'd make all sorts of claims about how facial features and other aspects of the body are 'most important in how they evaluate sexual attraction.' But then add in the specific genital part, and that would plausibly (I would say likely) render everything else purported previously as not true. As in lies they are telling themselves. Or possible that the genital thing is the lie they are telling themselves. Either way, it superficially does come across as bigotry (intolerance).

But I think it possible after the ruling out has occurred based on sexual preference, that a whole lot of acceptance could follow, in that the same person could find themselves having a very close, personal, friendly relationship with that (transgendered) person. Learn about the genitalia and decide it doesn't matter for the bond they share and wish to share going forward. While maintaining their sexual preference (and intolerance) to never explore the sexual connection.

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

Eh. I don't feel like arguing this, I don't care enough. I'm not asking the question you think I'm asking. Maybe we both should reread that thread.

I don't really care to continue talking about this, either, but I'm in the position of being forced into it.

 

[Buttercup]

I don't really care to continue talking about this, either, but I'm in the position of being forced into it.

You're not forced to do anything, dear.

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

You're not forced to do anything, dear.

We'll have to agree to disagree there.

 

[Sunstone]

...I'm in the position of being forced into it.

How so?

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

How so?

Because this thread is basically a call out thread to me, after a discussion on another thread went off the rails for various reasons and ended up with me being ganged up on by a bunch of people who were pissy at me for being upset over someone's comments. So now I'm pretty much being called out because I, as a trans person, dared to find someone's comments to be, at least, possibly offensive and based on transphobic perceptions. How dare I.

Well, Flankerl, I probably wouldn't have asked it if nobody had made a big deal out of it.

 

[Sunstone]

Because this thread is basically a call out thread to me, after a discussion on another thread went off the rails for various reasons and ended up with me being ganged up on by a bunch of people who were pissy at me for being upset over someone's comments. So now I'm pretty much being called out because I, as a trans person, dared to find someone's comments to be, at least, possibly offensive and based on transphobic perceptions. How dare I.

Sometimes I've responded to call out threads on me, sometimes I haven't. It's depended on my mood.