Desire and pleasure

[an anarchist]

Desire and pleasure are major obstacles in my spiritual path.

A life where one seeks to satisfy their fleshly desires is a destructive one. However, it is tempting and feels good at the moment.

A haiku

Sex activity
The happiness is fleeting
then it is over

Are you above desire, at this stage of your life? Is pleasure a detriment to you? My need for pleasure is.

Ultimate satisfaction comes from morality and spirituality, yes? I know this from personal experience.

 

[Twilight Hue]

I'd say it's far far more destructive to intentionally pent up ones natural inclinations and functions.

 

[Aupmanyav]

then it is over
Are you above desire, at this stage of your life? Is pleasure a detriment to you? My need for pleasure is.
Ultimate satisfaction comes from morality and spirituality, yes? I know this from personal experience.

It should be over, how long one can be at it? But how does it hinder spiritual development? Never felt like that. These are two separate things.
Of course, I am 80+ and my days to romp are over. If there is pleasure, then it is in the family and fulfilling our duties towards it.

 

[exchemist]

Desire and pleasure are major obstacles in my spiritual path.

A life where one seeks to satisfy their fleshly desires is a destructive one. However, it is tempting and feels good at the moment.

A haiku

Sex activity
The happiness is fleeting
then it is over

Are you above desire, at this stage of your life? Is pleasure a detriment to you? My need for pleasure is.

Ultimate satisfaction comes from morality and spirituality, yes? I know this from personal experience.

There is a well known quotation, often attributed to the 4th Earl of Chesterfield, about this:

"The pleasure is momentary, the position ridiculous, and the expense damnable."

 

[JustGeorge]

I don't see why sex can't be part of one's spirituality.

Though obsession with sex can be bad for one's spirit.. Obsession with anything can be.

 

[PureX]

Desire and pleasure are major obstacles in my spiritual path.

A life where one seeks to satisfy their fleshly desires is a destructive one. However, it is tempting and feels good at the moment.

A haiku

Sex activity
The happiness is fleeting
then it is over

Are you above desire, at this stage of your life? Is pleasure a detriment to you? My need for pleasure is.

Ultimate satisfaction comes from morality and spirituality, yes? I know this from personal experience.

"Pleasure" is a relative value assessment. Pleasure can be experienced in many different ways, and sometimes there will be a cost. But there is also a cost to the avoidance of pleasure. And it can be severe.

So it seems to me that the goal is to try and assess the various pleasures that we seek in life, and the possible costs that might come from engaging in them, and then proceed with both wisdom and caution. Trust the spirit. Trust the path. Be willing to forgive, and to ask for forgiveness as circumstances proscribe. Understand that pleasure is a not a sin. The sin, if it occurs, is in how and why we engage in it.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

Desire and pleasure are major obstacles in my spiritual path.

A life where one seeks to satisfy their fleshly desires is a destructive one. However, it is tempting and feels good at the moment.

A haiku

Sex activity
The happiness is fleeting
then it is over

Are you above desire, at this stage of your life? Is pleasure a detriment to you? My need for pleasure is.

Ultimate satisfaction comes from morality and spirituality, yes? I know this from personal experience.

I have real trouble even relating to your paradigm.

I have no idea what "fleshly desires" are and how they might be different from just "desires." I also have no idea what you mean by "spirituality."

I agree that it's important to act morally, but for me, this is because of empathy, which ultimately comes down to desire: if I were to hurt someone else - physically or figuratively - I would feel their pain as my pain, which would be contrary to what I desire.

As far as "being above desire" goes, I don't think humans would be capable of such a thing. Hopefully, we can have mature desires that don't only reflect personal self-interest, but someone completely without desire would be an unmotivated lump.

IMO, there's absolutely nothing wrong with desire or pleasure. The trick is just to make sure we express these feelings in healthy, productive ways.

 

[exchemist]

I have real trouble even relating to your paradigm.

I have no idea what "fleshly desires" are and how they might be different from just "desires." I also have no idea what you mean by "spirituality."

I agree that it's important to act morally, but for me, this is because of empathy, which ultimately comes down to desire: if I were to hurt someone else - physically or figuratively - I would feel their pain as my pain, which would be contrary to what I desire.

As far as "being above desire" goes, I don't think humans would be capable of such a thing. Hopefully, we can have mature desires that don't only reflect personal self-interest, but someone completely without desire would be an unmotivated lump.

IMO, there's absolutely nothing wrong with desire or pleasure. The trick is just to make sure we express these feelings in healthy, productive ways.

I think the point, as far as most religions are concerned, is that mankind benefits from not allowing himself to become a slave to desires.

Obesity, drunkenness and other addictions can obviously follow from failure to exercise self-control. More generally, attaining any kind of fulfilment normally involves the self-discipline to accomplish tasks without being excessively distracted by short-term appetites. But I quite agree there is no need to regard such appetites as unhealthy, or evil. They just need to be kept in their place and indulged under the control of a disciplined mind.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

I think the point, as far as most religions are concerned, is that mankind benefits from not allowing himself to become a slave to desires.

Right. It does end up in a weird contradictory loop, though: is the desire not to be a slave to your desires then a desire you need to be "freed" from?

Obesity, drunkenness and other addictions can obviously follow from failure to exercise self-control. More generally, attaining any kind of fulfilment normally involves the self-discipline to accomplish tasks without being excessively distracted by short-term appetites.

Right... but this is a matter of prioritizing desires, not eliminating desire altogether. Living a fulfilled life sounds like a good idea; it makes sense to desire it, and to approach this desire in a thoughtful way.

But I quite agree there is no need to regard such appetites as unhealthy, or evil. They just need to be kept in their place and indulged under the control of a disciplined mind.

It isn't even necessarily about "short-term appetites" vs. bigger goals and priorities. Both are types of desire.

That being said, I don't really see the point of asceticism for its own sake. Sure, we should probably avoid things that we find immediately tempting that cause us a net harm overall, but this idea that we need to avoid any and every pleasure simply because it's pleasurable makes no sense at all to me.

 

[Treasure Hunter]

Desire and pleasure are major obstacles in my spiritual path.

A life where one seeks to satisfy their fleshly desires is a destructive one. However, it is tempting and feels good at the moment.

A haiku

Sex activity
The happiness is fleeting
then it is over

Are you above desire, at this stage of your life? Is pleasure a detriment to you? My need for pleasure is.

Ultimate satisfaction comes from morality and spirituality, yes? I know this from personal experience.

Awareness of this issue is an important part of the solution. As long as you keep the issue in your conscious awareness, you will resolve it eventually. Don’t allow frustration to demoralize you. You will get there.

 

[Jimmy]

Desire and seek pleasure from healthy things like walking, watching tv, drawing, gaming, reading, or painting.

 

[Brian2]

I'd say it's far far more destructive to intentionally pent up ones natural inclinations and functions.

Self control is a good thing in society. Better than a "Brian want, Brian take, now" attitude.
I think it is "suppressing" our feelings which is meant to be bad for us. Controlling them is different.

 

[The Sum of Awe]

Self control is a good thing in society. Better than a "Brian want, Brian take, now" attitude.

Maybe a bit of moderation is best? Not fully giving into mindless indulgence but not overly disciplining yourself like a demanding boss?

I think it is "suppressing" our feelings which is meant to be bad for us.

How do you tell the difference between suppressing and resisting?

 

[an anarchist]

I don't see why sex can't be part of one's spirituality.

Though obsession with sex can be bad for one's spirit.. Obsession with anything can be.

Sex itself isn't bad. The human species continually exists because of sex, so it is apparent it is not inherently bad.

Sex is one of the most powerful tools available to man for his personal growth. But this requires disciplined self control.

From what I've experienced and witnessed, this self control is not often there. What is there is an insatiable desire for sex. Sex is often the most damning force in an individual's life. Everything can and will be forsaken in pursuit of it.

 

[osgart]

I'd have to be in love with the person not for sex to be an empty experience on par with eating junk food. I personally want to feel good about myself after the experience.

 

[JustGeorge]

Sex itself isn't bad. The human species continually exists because of sex, so it is apparent it is not inherently bad.

Sex is one of the most powerful tools available to man for his personal growth. But this requires disciplined self control.

From what I've experienced and witnessed, this self control is not often there. What is there is an insatiable desire for sex. Sex is often the most damning force is an individual's life. Everything can and will be forsaken in pursuit of it.

I think in general, self control is a good virtue to cultivate.

I personally don't have an issue with sex, but don't leave me in the room with a good lookin' cake...

I think vices are different for everyone. A person can spend 3 hours looking at porn or spend 3 hours doomscrolling, and either way they've contributed nothing of value to their lives.

It sounds like sex is an issue for you, though. How will you manage these impulses?

 

[mangalavara]

Desire and pleasure are major obstacles in my spiritual path.

You are very young. Naturally, as such a young person, the desire for pleasure will be very strong. As you get older, the strength of the desire weakens.

I don’t know much about your spiritual path, but as a follower of Sanātana Dharma, I think that strong desire is an obstacle in one’s spiritual path if one is pursuing moksha. The good news is that such desire can be controlled. One thing required here is the will to control desire. Another thing required is patience because controlling desire the way that a yogi does doesn’t happen instantaneously for most of us. It is gradual.

A life where one seeks to satisfy their fleshly desires is a destructive one.

From my perspective as a follower of Sanātana Dharma, the pursuit of kāma, that is, love, affection, emotional fulfillment, and sensual fulfillment, is perfectly legitimate. It is completely valid and acceptable as long as we pursue it in accordance with dharma—marriages have to be respected, people cannot be used as means to ends, and we have to be moderate.

Are you above desire, at this stage of your life? Is pleasure a detriment to you?

I have more control over desire than I used to when I was of your age range. Now, I tend to find pleasure in food and drink more than anything else that is physical. Additionally, I used to love music, but when I started chanting Sanskrit mantras and repeating divines names, I quickly lost 98% of the love for music that I had.

My need for pleasure is.

As the desire weakens over time, the less an obstacle it will be.

Ultimate satisfaction comes from morality and spirituality, yes?

I think some of the Hellenes from long ago believed that virtue or aretē gives true satisfaction. From my perspective, living a life of complete righteousness and virtue would strangely not be satisfying. Nothing temporal, be it pleasure or morality, can fill the vast gap in one’s being. Something vast has to fill it.

I know this from personal experience.

Learning from personal experience is a very good thing. Please keep it up.

 

[ChristineM]

Are you above desire

No, i found it late in life and I'm hanging on to it.

Is pleasure a detriment to you?

Just the opposite, it's a mood enhancer, I'm not spiritual but i imagine that without sexual pleasure spirituality must be pretty miserable

 

[an anarchist]

It sounds like sex is an issue for you, though. How will you manage these impulses?

In the Dhammapada the Buddha says -
"Just like rain breaks through the roof of a poorly thatched house, lust breaks through the non vigilant mind.
Just like rain does not break through the roof of a skillfully thatched house, lust does not break through the vigilant mind."

I must build up my temple. I must be spiritually active. If I am spiritually lazy, I will not have the power to control my impulses. If I am not being spiritually minded, I can convince myself that there is nothing wrong with unrestrained sexual behavior, and go at it. I must look out for it, and be honest with myself about the results of my actions.

I suppose one can channel their sexual energy into a committed relationship. That is a method I'm trying/tried. But being in a relationship where sex is available isn't a proper solution. Because what happens then when my interests starts to wane? If I am simply relying on a partner to satiate me, I don't think it'll do. I must solve the issue from within. Being in a relationship is helping me, on this front, though. In order to achieve honor, I cannot sleep around while dating. And sometimes that matters to me. But sometimes it doesn't.

 

[SalixIncendium]

Are you above desire, at this stage of your life?

Yes.

Except for jelly beans.