did Jesus ever say he was god?

[Breathe]

Satan is a fallen angel who does as much as he is allowed to do and hates righteous men.
See JOB 1:6-12 and JOB 2:1-7

Both of these say they came to "present" themselves to God. When God sees Satan, He does not say anything like "Cursed be thee, o sinner and doer of evil! Depart from Me, and be descend thou into the Lake of Fire thereof!" (like my KJV-style pseudo-Biblical text guys? ) or anything like that - he effectively says, "What have you been up to recently?". When Satan answers, God says "Have you seen Job? He's very pious." - in effect, pointing out Satan's next job. Satan simply says "I think it's because he's been spoilt by you". Hardly proof of a fallen angel, but definitely proof of a tempter who's doing Divine work.

GOD is not evil. But HE will not suffer evil to have eternal access to HIM. MEN choose their eternity. They either listen to GOD and trust HIM, or they lean on the temptation to take charge of their own destiny (much as satan). GOD will allow man to build his own bed. GOD provides opportunities for repentence. Judas hanged himself ---- don't blame GOD. Perfect example of a person who will not say he is sorry. Then there is Peter.

Indeed, I don't believe God is evil either - in fact, I believe God is most likely outside of such morality as they are human concepts. I never mentioned Judas, nor Peter once -- nor do I believe that God doesn't allow man to 'build his own bed'; these are your words (and I don't see how they are relevant to the discussion, myself..). I just happen to believe God isn't so small-minded that He is going to send people into a hellish existence of suffering for all eternity simply for following their heart and following a religion they feel more comfortable and connected to.

I myself have been a Christian, yet I have since left the fold. This does not mean I oppose God, nor Jesus (whom many members here know, I regard him as a great guru and spiritual leader, he is my favourite "prophet" or guru) nor Christianity - it simply isn't right for me myself.

 

[snow duck]

is there any verse in the bible that says something like:

i jesus, the father or something similar to this?

if jesus is god, there should be a verse like that in the bible right?

now i personally do not know nything about the bible, but am curious about this.

John 20:28 Thomas answered him, "My Lord and my God!"

 

[LittleNipper]

Both of these say they came to "present" themselves to God. When God sees Satan, He does not say anything like "Cursed be thee, o sinner and doer of evil! Depart from Me, and be descend thou into the Lake of Fire thereof!" (like my KJV-style pseudo-Biblical text guys? ) or anything like that - he effectively says, "What have you been up to recently?". When Satan answers, God says "Have you seen Job? He's very pious." - in effect, pointing out Satan's next job. Satan simply says "I think it's because he's been spoilt by you". Hardly proof of a fallen angel, but definitely proof of a tempter who's doing Divine work.


Indeed, I don't believe God is evil either - in fact, I believe God is most likely outside of such morality as they are human concepts. I never mentioned Judas, nor Peter once -- nor do I believe that God doesn't allow man to 'build his own bed'; these are your words (and I don't see how they are relevant to the discussion, myself..). I just happen to believe God isn't so small-minded that He is going to send people into a hellish existence of suffering for all eternity simply for following their heart and following a religion they feel more comfortable and connected to.

I myself have been a Christian, yet I have since left the fold. This does not mean I oppose God, nor Jesus (whom many members here know, I regard him as a great guru and spiritual leader, he is my favourite "prophet" or guru) nor Christianity - it simply isn't right for me myself.

Satan is already headed to the Lake of Fire. That goes without saying; however, for the moment satan is still in charge of this world. That is where GOD put him and that is where he will remain until GOD finally destroys this earth and creates NEW HEAVENS and a NEW EARTH ---FINAL JUDGMENT DAY. See Revelation Chapter 20. This is to be compaired with Isaiah Chapter 14, where the King of Babylon is condemned and also satan and their ideals, desires, and final outcome metaphorically mirror each other.

So you see, while I am a literalist, I also understand that there is an invisible war going on ---- both the physical and spiritual.

People go to hell because they will not choose GOD's and SALVATION. They get nothing more than what GOD promised to Adam. GOD keeps HIS word.

 

[blueman]

John 20:28 Thomas answered him, "My Lord and my God!"

Although there are many passages in NT scripture in which Jesus implied or stated explicitly that He shared attributes and deity with God The Father.

- He stated that He was the one to forgive sins (only God can forgive sins)
- He stated that He and the Father were one (in essence and owning the attributes of deity)
- He stated that before Abraham was a thought, He existed (John 8:58)

In addition to those claims, the religious leaders of His day expicitly felt that Jesus was a blasphemer and that He put Himself on an equal playing field with God. That's why they were so diligent to convince Pontious Pilate to have Him cruxified. I think the argument that continues to be raised on whether Jesus said or thought He was God gets old after awhile based on what we know regarding the historical record.

 

[Breathe]

Satan is already headed to the Lake of Fire. That goes without saying;

I beg to differ.

however, for the moment satan is still in charge of this world. That is where GOD put him and that is where he will remain until GOD finally destroys this earth and creates NEW HEAVENS and a NEW EARTH ---FINAL JUDGMENT DAY. See Revelation Chapter 20. This is to be compaired with Isaiah Chapter 14, where the King of Babylon is condemned and also satan and their ideals, desires, and final outcome metaphorically mirror each other.

Sure I guess?

So you see, while I am a literalist, I also understand that there is an invisible war going on ---- both the physical and spiritual.

I disagree with you here, but I'm glad you're so confident.

People go to hell because they will not choose GOD's and SALVATION. They get nothing more than what GOD promised to Adam. GOD keeps HIS word.

And I believe there are many, many paths to God - I don't understand why we would need to be saved from God's creation considering He made it anyway.

This is, though, off-topic in regards to the original thread.

 

[snow duck]

I beg to differ.


Sure I guess?


I disagree with you here, but I'm glad you're so confident.


And I believe there are many, many paths to God - I don't understand why we would need to be saved from God's creation considering He made it anyway.

This is, though, off-topic in regards to the original thread.

Romans 9:21 Has the potter no right over the clay, to make out of the same lump one vessel for honorable use and another for dishonorable use?

 

[URAVIP2ME]

I beg to differ.

Sure I guess?

I disagree with you here, but I'm glad you're so confident.

And I believe there are many, many paths to God - I don't understand why we would need to be saved from God's creation considering He made it anyway.

This is, though, off-topic in regards to the original thread.

Did Jesus believe there are many paths to God or that all paths lead to God?

Matthew recorded (7:13,22) that 'many' or the majority are on the broad road leading to destruction not God.

According to Psalm (92:7) what upright people will be 'saved' from is the wicked.
Those wicked have corrupted themselves (Deuteronomy 32:5; 30:19) or, in other words, they made themselves enemies of God.

Why did Noah have to be 'saved' from the wicked was because if there would have not been divine intervention the wicked would have killed off all righteous ones. The same is true today. If Jesus would not take the coming action as described at Isaiah (11:4) and Revelation (19:11,15) all righteous ones would end up being killed off the face of the earth.

Because Jesus will take action the humble meek of Revelation (7:9,10,14) will as in verse 10 says, that 'salvation' or being 'saved' is thanks to divine intervention by God through Jesus.
In this way Jesus fulfills the promise to Abraham (Genesis 12:3; 22:18) that all families of the earth will be blessed and all nations of the earth will be blessed. Thus as Jesus promised, when he referred to Psalm (37:11,29,38) that the humble meek will inherit the earth.

 

[URAVIP2ME]

Romans 9:21 Has the potter no right over the clay, to make out of the same lump one vessel for honorable use and another for dishonorable use?

The Pharaoh of Moses day ended up a dishonorable vessel. God refrained from immediate destruction so all could see he was beyond reform.
So Pharaoh was a vessel for dishonorable use.

Romans 9:21 in comparison to 2nd Timothy 2:21 shows if a man purges himself he will be an honorable vessel. Please notice that the person, not the Potter, does the purging.

The Great Potter thus gives time for vessels to be molded by Him into vessels of godly mercy.

1st Corinthians 6:9-11A uses the word 'were'. 'Were' is past tense.
Past tense would mean those dishonorable vessels repented and were washed spiritual clean, so to speak, and now fit for 'honorable use' by the Great Potter.

 

[URAVIP2ME]

Although there are many passages in NT scripture in which Jesus implied or stated explicitly that He shared attributes and deity with God The Father.

- He stated that He was the one to forgive sins (only God can forgive sins)
- He stated that He and the Father were one (in essence and owning the attributes of deity)
- He stated that before Abraham was a thought, He existed (John 8:58)

In addition to those claims, the religious leaders of His day expicitly felt that Jesus was a blasphemer and that He put Himself on an equal playing field with God. That's why they were so diligent to convince Pontious Pilate to have Him cruxified. I think the argument that continues to be raised on whether Jesus said or thought He was God gets old after awhile based on what we know regarding the historical record.

What Scripture shows that the Jewish clergy believed Jesus put himself on equal playing field with God?
Please notice: John (19:7) because the Jews answered that Jesus ought to die why? because Jesus made himself the: Son of God.

John also recorded (10:36) that Jesus was called a blasphemest. Why? because Jesus said he was the Son of God.

John (8:58) of course Jesus was before Abraham because didn't Jesus have a pre-human existence? Since Jesus was the beginning of the creation by God (Rev 3:14) and firstborn in the heavens (Col 1:15,16) then Jesus existed before Abraham. On the other hand, God had no birth nor a beginning. (Psalm 90:2)

John (17:11,21-23) in what way were Jesus and his Father one? First, we know, according to John (14:28), that the Father is greater than Jesus.
Besides Jesus and his Father mentioned in chapter 17 Jesus prays that his followers be one just as Jesus and his Father are one. Was Jesus praying they all be God? Rather, that they be one in purpose, goal, belief, works, objective or be in union as one.

Matthew recorded (27:43) that the people believed Jesus trusted in God, why? because Jesus said: I am the Son of God.


As far as forgiveness of sins, Ephesians (1:7) shows release from sin is through Jesus shed blood. 1st John (1:7 B) Jesus blood cleanses us from all sin. All except for the unforgivable sin of Matthew (12:32; Hebrews 6:4-6).

 

[URAVIP2ME]

John 20:28 Thomas answered him, "My Lord and my God!"

In chapter 20 looking back to verse 17 Jesus states that he will ascend to his (my) God. Even today on the news when something shocks someone, we might he hear someone exclaim, "Oh my God!" and we know the person is not calling the person in front of them God but rather calling out to God in the heavens.

Besides Jesus believing he had a God at John (20:17), Jesus also, after he ascended to heaven, still believed he had a God at Revelation 3:12.

 

[URAVIP2ME]

That's rather an appeal to extremes - I prefer myself the middle ground, containing truths.

There's no proof God created the Earth in seven days, for example - and to believe such a thing would be considered intellectually dishonest considering the mass of evidence that we have to support the contrary.

1. The Tanakh ("Old Testament") is completely independent from the New Testament
2. 3. It doesn't have to be "wrong" or made up. Sections of it are most likely historical, but other parts are probably not.
3. 4. The Tanakh contains metaphors and historical acts (or pseudo-historical), so why would this not also be for the New Testament?

Either way, a bunch of men (not necessarily Jewish men) wrote the whole thing, over time. Matthew did not pen the Gospel of Matthew, nor did John pen John or Revelation, just like Moses didn't write the Torah (first five books of the Tanakh).

It doesn't make it wrong, but this is what happens when you delve into literalism, you can destroy the beauty of the message.

The word 'day' in scripture has various shades of meaning. The length of the 'creative days' are not mentioned, but all of those creative days are summed up as 'a day' at Genesis 2:4.

God's 'rest day' was still on-going in Paul's day . Hebrews 4:4-10.

Even Jesus coming rule can be called a thousand-year day.

 

[URAVIP2ME]

JESUS proved that HE could control nature, heal the sick and crippled, know what people were doing without being informed, put satan in his place, prophesy of the future, and raise the dead. ONLY GOD can do that much.

Where did Elijah, Elisha, Paul and Jesus get such resurrection power from self or from God? Didn't Peter heal sick and crippled too? Acts 5:15,16; 3:6.
Didn't Paul put demons in their place at Acts 16:16-18?

Did Jesus resurrect himself? According to Luke in the book of Acts he wrote (2:24,32;13:33-37;26:23) that God resurrected Jesus.
Jesus being the first to rise from the dead (26:23) to heavenly life.
Christ being firstfruit of those sleeping in death- 1st Cor 15:20-28.

John wrote (5:26) that God has life within himself (immortality -Psalm 90:2), and that it is God that gives or grants to Jesus to have life within himself. Hebrews 9:24-28. If Jesus was already immortal then there would be no reason to gift or grant immortality to Jesus because Jesus would have already been death proof. Because of God's gift Jesus is granted power and judgment over the resurrection (Acts 24:15).

Since only God is the source of such powers, it is through God's will that Jesus have such powers. (Matt 26:39; Luke 22:42; John 5:50, 6:38)

 

[Breathe]

The word 'day' in scripture has various shades of meaning. <<snip>>

I'm well aware of all this, however it doesn't mean I believe them. Nor do I believe in a seven-day or seven-stage creation, there is far, far too much evidence on the contrary.

The Ancient Hebrews may have took it literally, or maybe not - the problem is, they could no have known any better.

However, this is not related to the thread's topic, "did Jesus say he was god?".

 

[Vile Atheist]

I think the question presupposes that if Jesus said He was God, therefore Jesus IS God. That does not logically follow. What if I say I'm God? Does that mean I am? Of course not.

In order to know that, you'd need evidence of Jesus' miracles and the only account you have of that is an unreliable old book, full of errors and contradictions. Yet some people choose to believe with fervour? Doesn't make much sense to me.

 

[Freelancer7]

The SON of GOD is GOD. and Jesus told Peter that the HOLY SPIRIT revealed to Peter that JESUS was the CHRIST (translated: GOD with us).

Sorry, I beg to Differ, the TRINITY is 3 Seperate Entities,but that is the freedom that God has given us, to believe what we all want to, is it not, Would God tell you what to do? NO, of course not

 

[Freelancer7]

The SON of GOD is GOD. and Jesus told Peter that the HOLY SPIRIT revealed to Peter that JESUS was the CHRIST (translated: GOD with us).

Little Nipper I realy do hope your right, I can't wait for him to explain it, should be good, a right craic

 

[Muffled]

Epic of Gilgamesh is an earlier story than Noah's Ark. So is the Hindu flood.


How do I know what? The flood didn't happen? Geology, archaeology, the sheer impossibility (which has been described in another thread a lot), etc.
If something else, can you please explain?

If I'm wrong, I'm wrong. No worries there.
After all, I am a seeker. :yes:

Gilgamesh is reputed to be written around 2700 BC while the Bible puts the flood at circa 2950 BC. The Hindu account of the flood dates to circa 3100 BC which seems to be pallpark to me condisering the difficulty in dating anything that old.

 

[Muffled]

Sorry, I beg to Differ, the TRINITY is 3 Seperate Entities,but that is the freedom that God has given us, to believe what we all want to, is it not, Would God tell you what to do? NO, of course not

If Jesus were a separate entity He would not be God because God is one. However Jesus said that He and God are one so there is no separate entity.

This is not the case. God has never said "go be free to do whatever you wish and believe whatever you wish." He doesn't like the doctrine of the Trianity and wants us to desist from adhering to it.

 

[URAVIP2ME]

Jesus said at John (14:28) that his Father is greater than him.

Jesus prayed at John (17: 11,21-23) that his followers be one as he and his Father are one.
Jesus was not praying they all be God, but rather they be one in purpose, goal, belief, objective, agreement, unity, etc.

 

[URAVIP2ME]

Gilgamesh is reputed to be written around 2700 BC while the Bible puts the flood at circa 2950 BC. The Hindu account of the flood dates to circa 3100 BC which seems to be pallpark to me condisering the difficulty in dating anything that old.

The Flood was 2370 BC or BCE (before common era)