Did Jesus say he was God???

[AK4]

Did Jesus ever say He was God?

How many times did He say I AM?

Or are many of you guys fooled by these translations that try to add the word "he" to the places where Jesus repeatedly said I AM?

Do you think Judas, the cohorts and officers drew back and fell to the ground with Jesus saying I am He or do you think they drew back and fell to the ground when He said with all authority and power I AM?

Joh 18:5 - [In Context|Read Chapter|Original Greek] They answered Him, "Jesus the Nazarene." He *said to them, "I am {He.}" And Judas also, who was betraying Him, was standing with them.
Joh 18:6 - [In Context|Read Chapter|Original Greek] So when He said to them, "I am {He,}" they drew back and fell to the ground.
Joh 18:8 - [In Context|Read Chapter|Original Greek] Jesus answered, "I told you that I am {He;} so if you seek Me, let these go their way,"

Jesus knows Hes not the one true God, for He knows that is only for His Father [that many of yall dont know] BUT BUT Jesus repeatedly said all power in heaven and earth HAS BEEN GIVEN TO HIM BY HIS FATHER and since He is the first of God the Father creation and the Father does everything THROUGH Him, it shouldnt be hard to do the math. "I and the Father are One" "I am in the Father and the Father is in Me"---but since most of you dont know who or what the Father is, you wont get it.

Last point, Jesus said no man has seen or heard God at anytime yet YET in the OT all the prophets etc who heard and some who say they had seen like Moses God seen/heard someone/something and that someone/something said He was the Lord God. Now "no man has seen or heard God at anytime". So if you can figure out this then you may figure out who the Father is and who Jesus is and why Jesus can be given the TITLE God. [the word God is a title not the name of God]

Sorry for the sermon but hey what can i say?

 

[Dirty Penguin]

Did Jesus ever say He was God?

How many times did He say I AM?

Or are many of you guys fooled by these translations that try to add the word "he" to the places where Jesus repeatedly said I AM?

Do you think Judas, the cohorts and officers drew back and fell to the ground with Jesus saying I am He or do you think they drew back and fell to the ground when He said with all authority and power I AM?

Joh 18:5 - [In Context|Read Chapter|Original Greek] They answered Him, "Jesus the Nazarene." He *said to them, "I am {He.}" And Judas also, who was betraying Him, was standing with them.
Joh 18:6 - [In Context|Read Chapter|Original Greek] So when He said to them, "I am {He,}" they drew back and fell to the ground.
Joh 18:8 - [In Context|Read Chapter|Original Greek] Jesus answered, "I told you that I am {He;} so if you seek Me, let these go their way,"

Jesus knows Hes not the one true God, for He knows that is only for His Father [that many of yall dont know] BUT BUT Jesus repeatedly said all power in heaven and earth HAS BEEN GIVEN TO HIM BY HIS FATHER and since He is the first of God the Father creation and the Father does everything THROUGH Him, it shouldnt be hard to do the math. "I and the Father are One" "I am in the Father and the Father is in Me"---but since most of you dont know who or what the Father is, you wont get it.

Last point, Jesus said no man has seen or heard God at anytime yet YET in the OT all the prophets etc who heard and some who say they had seen like Moses God seen/heard someone/something and that someone/something said He was the Lord God. Now "no man has seen or heard God at anytime". So if you can figure out this then you may figure out who the Father is and who Jesus is and why Jesus can be given the TITLE God. [the word God is a title not the name of God]

Sorry for the sermon but hey what can i say?

See, for me...I get it...I'm simply arguing against the notion that he is that which he bowed and prayed to. I'm not sure why some present it all as if the biblical Yeshua is speaking of the "Father" as if he is referring to himself in the 2nd/3rd person when speaking to his followers. None of them mistook him as "God"...nor was it something he taught. He said he did not come here by his own will. This should tip people off that he was separate from his god before being sent. He then says his job was to do the will of the one that sent him....People should not make the mistake in believing the biblical Yeshua was "God Almighty" when he says over and over that (he was sent, he was given, he was given a task, he was commanded to speak what he was taught by his god, not his will but his god's will...etc.). With all of the "proof" from Yeshua you'd think figuring out Yeshua isn't "God" would be an easy one..especially considering he said he wasn't and that he had a god. I like you approach to it....

 

[AK4]

See, for me...I get it...I'm simply arguing against the notion that he is that which he bowed and prayed to. I'm not sure why some present it all as if the biblical Yeshua is speaking of the "Father" as if he is referring to himself in the 2nd/3rd person when speaking to his followers. None of them mistook him as "God"...nor was it something he taught. He said he did not come here by his own will. This should tip people off that he was separate from his god before being sent. He then says his job was to do the will of the one that sent him....People should not make the mistake in believing the biblical Yeshua was "God Almighty" when he says over and over that (he was sent, he was given, he was given a task, he was commanded to speak what he was taught by his god, not his will but his god's will...etc.). With all of the "proof" from Yeshua you'd think figuring out Yeshua isn't "God" would be an easy one..especially considering he said he wasn't and that he had a god. I like you approach to it....

Thank you and you are a lot further in understanding of God the Father than most christians. But Jesus is the Almighty also only because the Father gave Him all that He {the Father} is so since God {the Father} gave Him [or anyone else [just for argument sake]] all that is Him [the Father] and since Jesus is being in place of Him [the FAther, the one no one can see or hear] and called the Antipas which means in place of and being the first and last, He is the Almighty as is said of Him repeatedly in the OT and specifically in Revelation.

Being seperate "entities" yet as Jesus puts it they are "One". Not a dualality or trinity, but like saying if God [the Father] created you first and gave you all power and you were to be all that is Him that can be seen or heard and you did, said and acted only as your God had you do [Jesus doesnt have a free will either], then you would be "God Almighty" yet humble like Jesus in recognizing that you were given/came from etc etc from a higher source. God [the Father] is spirit and not a man and is everywhere so you couldnt, just as the scripture says could contain Him in one "thing".

Jesus even after His resurrection is called a man but since God created Jesus to "be Him" or represent Him so He could be seen and heard [and not like the teaching from a lot of religions that He is off in some far off place and left us to our mythical freewill] and like you also stated "was given etc etc" everything including the title as God, God Almighty, Lord God, Saviour then He [Jesus] also has those titles. Hes {Jesus} not the one true God but for those who can understand Jesus' statement "I am in the FAther and the Father is in me" and find a scriptural match like Paul saying in Acts about us "we live, move and exist" in God then they will mistake Jesus as the one true God or as being the Father. Although Jesus is a father.

Lol it can be confusing because of that stupid trinity teaching that has screwed up everything. It took me awhile to unlearn that. Sorry again for the rant but once i get going its hard to stop

 

[waitasec]

waitasec-

Why do you write I AM in all upper case letters when Scripture does not?

i'm cutting and pasting scripture online... or from some other reference online...

 

[Muffled]

Jesus believed he existed before Abraham because at Revelation 3v14 B Jesus believed himself to be the beginning of the creation by God.
That would make Jesus a heavenly creation long before being sent to earth.
Colossians 1vs15,16.

Jesus always considers himself to be God's Son or the Son of God as he still refers to himself at Revelation 2v18.

Moses never mentions another entity. He talks specifically about God annd none other.

 

[Muffled]

did jesus say he was god?
well of course he did, what do you think all this hoopla is about?

the question still remains, is jesus god...
sure if you believe
jesus was jealous and that adultery deserves a death sentence
and stands by his eternal word...
(2 Samuel 12:11-14 NAB)

Thus says the Lord: 'I will bring evil upon you out of your own house. I will take your wives [plural] while you live to see it, and will give them to your neighbor. He shall lie with your wives in broad daylight. You have done this deed in secret, but I will bring it about in the presence of all Israel, and with the sun looking down.'
Then David said to Nathan, "I have sinned against the Lord." Nathan answered David: "The Lord on his part has forgiven your sin: you shall not die. But since you have utterly spurned the Lord by this deed, the child born to you must surely die.

however both jesus and the god of the OT believed slavery was ok ...
i wonder if sex slaves and human trafficking were condoned by jesus. anyone?

There is only one way I know of ascertaining whether jesus is God as He claims. I know God through His words. When I hear someone talk as God spoke then I know He is God. That is the case with Jesus. I suppose that the authority that Jesus displayed by casting out evil spirits would qualify also since it isn't likely that evil spirits would recognize the authority of any other except Satan of course but Satan doesn't talk anything like God.

 

[Muffled]

See, for me...I get it...I'm simply arguing against the notion that he is that which he bowed and prayed to. I'm not sure why some present it all as if the biblical Yeshua is speaking of the "Father" as if he is referring to himself in the 2nd/3rd person when speaking to his followers. None of them mistook him as "God"...nor was it something he taught. He said he did not come here by his own will. This should tip people off that he was separate from his god before being sent. He then says his job was to do the will of the one that sent him....People should not make the mistake in believing the biblical Yeshua was "God Almighty" when he says over and over that (he was sent, he was given, he was given a task, he was commanded to speak what he was taught by his god, not his will but his god's will...etc.). With all of the "proof" from Yeshua you'd think figuring out Yeshua isn't "God" would be an easy one..especially considering he said he wasn't and that he had a god. I like you approach to it....

Joh 5:30 I can of myself do nothing: as I hear, I judge: and my judgment is righteous; because I seek not mine own will, but the will of him that sent me.
Joh 6:38 For I am come down from heaven, not to do mine own will, but the will of him that sent me.

"mine own will" is not a statement that Jesus had a will of His own since it is a negation ie it is not His own will.
He states what it is "the will of Him that sent me."

Also Jesus never says that He had a will to do something different than being sent. This is an assumption on your part that a sending ought to involve two different wills but in this case it does not.

 

[waitasec]

Joh 5:30 I can of myself do nothing: as I hear, I judge: and my judgment is righteous; because I seek not mine own will, but the will of him that sent me.
Joh 6:38 For I am come down from heaven, not to do mine own will, but the will of him that sent me.

"mine own will" is not a statement that Jesus had a will of His own since it is a negation ie it is not His own will.
He states what it is "the will of Him that sent me."

Also Jesus never says that He had a will to do something different than being sent. This is an assumption on your part that a sending ought to involve two different wills but in this case it does not.

i'm sorry, hope you don't mind me putting in my 2 cents...
i agree with dirty penguin...very good post.
jesus said,
"i can of myself do nothing ... because i seek not mine own will"
meaning his will is to seek gods will (to seek is an action of will).

he also said
"as I hear, I judge: and my judgment is righteous; because I seek not mine own"
sounds like the christians of today.

if someone is compelled to do something, isn't it out of their will to do it?
so yes, there are 2 wills involved. jesus was a separate entity. willing to do gods will.

correct me if i am wrong, but wasn't jesus baptism supposed to be when the holy spirit entered his body and at that point he became the messiah
not born as the messiah from a virgin birth?

 

[waitasec]

There is only one way I know of ascertaining whether jesus is God as He claims. I know God through His words. When I hear someone talk as God spoke then I know He is God. That is the case with Jesus.

how do you know when someone talks as god spoke? you were not there.
so it must be through faith that you know. but faith without works is dead. where is the proof someone believes someone else is speaking as god did? if someone sells all their possessions and gave all they had to the poor as jesus commanded, then i will have nothing to say to question their faith. is faith supposed to be easy and convenient? no, however, from what i see all that is required to gain faith is to listen and use these teachings to gain "righteous judgement" of others....

I suppose that the authority that Jesus displayed by casting out evil spirits would qualify also since it isn't likely that evil spirits would recognize the authority of any other except Satan of course but ...

remember miracle workers were a dime a dozen. that is why it was hard for many people to take him seriously because it was nothing new... simple illusions/magic tricks.

Satan doesn't talk anything like God.

so explain how satan's talk differs from god's talk.
if you mean the thoughts that go through your mind
the right thing to do or the thing you want to do...
the way i see it it is your conscience speaking to your ego...
have you heard of the amygdala? it exists in you left and right brain

"the right amygdala is more responsive to existing environmental threats, and the left amygdala to verbal fear conditioning and anticipated threats.

this is what you consider to be the devil. your own mind.
when we are conditioned into thinking about how we protect ourselves it is the amygdala that tells us how to do it.

"The amygdala in the right hemisphere functions differently than its leftward twin, and this difference coincides with the general differences in hemispheric processing. The left amygdala is entrenched in the language-based world of the left brain, and can be taught to fear something based solely on verbal clues, without having any direct contact. If someone tells you there is a shark in the ocean, your left amygdala will activate when you think about going swimming. However, if you see a shark swimming in the ocean, your right amygdala will activate as you watch it."

my source
Conservative Left Brain, Liberal Right Brain

there is also a book called "my stroke of insight" is about the left and right brain functions by a brain scientist that experienced a stroke in her left brain and was a wake for it...if you are interested.

 

[Muffled]

i'm sorry, hope you don't mind me putting in my 2 cents...
i agree with dirty penguin...very good post.
jesus said,
"i can of myself do nothing ... because i seek not mine own will"
meaning his will is to seek gods will (to seek is an action of will).

he also said
"as I hear, I judge: and my judgment is righteous; because I seek not mine own"
sounds like the christians of today.

if someone is compelled to do something, isn't it out of their will to do it?
so yes, there are 2 wills involved. jesus was a separate entity. willing to do gods will.

correct me if i am wrong, but wasn't jesus baptism supposed to be when the holy spirit entered his body and at that point he became the messiah
not born as the messiah from a virgin birth?[/quote]

This is not logically true. I have two wills: the will of my flesh and the will of my spirit yet I am one entity. The fact that Jesus has the same dispostion of body and spirit should come as no surprise. However the truth is that the Spirit of God is in Jesus as the spirit controlling His body and is outside of His body as well.

I believe you are wrong. I believe that the spirit of God entered Jesus at conception and the virgin birth names Him Messiah from the beginning.

Joh 1:32 And John bare witness, saying, I have beheld the Spirit descending as a dove out of heaven; and it abode upon him.

One can not see a spirit, so John's testimony is that of a vision of a dove which he identifies as the spirit of God. The spirit appeared to abide upon Jesus instead of entering into Him.

 

[Muffled]

how do you know when someone talks as god spoke? you were not there.
so it must be through faith that you know. but faith without works is dead. where is the proof someone believes someone else is speaking as god did? if someone sells all their possessions and gave all they had to the poor as jesus commanded, then i will have nothing to say to question their faith. is faith supposed to be easy and convenient? no, however, from what i see all that is required to gain faith is to listen and use these teachings to gain "righteous judgement" of others....

remember miracle workers were a dime a dozen. that is why it was hard for many people to take him seriously because it was nothing new... simple illusions/magic tricks.



so explain how satan's talk differs from god's talk.
if you mean the thoughts that go through your mind
the right thing to do or the thing you want to do...
the way i see it it is your conscience speaking to your ego...
have you heard of the amygdala? it exists in you left and right brain

"the right amygdala is more responsive to existing environmental threats, and the left amygdala to verbal fear conditioning and anticipated threats.

this is what you consider to be the devil. your own mind.
when we are conditioned into thinking about how we protect ourselves it is the amygdala that tells us how to do it.

"The amygdala in the right hemisphere functions differently than its leftward twin, and this difference coincides with the general differences in hemispheric processing. The left amygdala is entrenched in the language-based world of the left brain, and can be taught to fear something based solely on verbal clues, without having any direct contact. If someone tells you there is a shark in the ocean, your left amygdala will activate when you think about going swimming. However, if you see a shark swimming in the ocean, your right amygdala will activate as you watch it."

my source
Conservative Left Brain, Liberal Right Brain

there is also a book called "my stroke of insight" is about the left and right brain functions by a brain scientist that experienced a stroke in her left brain and was a wake for it...if you are interested.

I was there but I don't remember much. We have the words of Jesus written in the Bible.

My previous post of course.

Name me one who cast out demons or that had demons acknowledge his authority.

Satan speaks as a temptor, God speaks as a commander. Satan tries to get me to do the wrong thing, God commands me to do the right thing.

The way you see it is in error. There is a spiritual communication that takes place. Granted one's mind can hear from one's own spirit (conscience) but I know the difference between my voice and other voices.

The scientific community admits that they don't know much about the brain. However I do not see their finding as indicative of how morality is perceived.

 

[Dirty Penguin]

Joh 5:30 I can of myself do nothing: as I hear, I judge: and my judgment is righteous; because I seek not mine own will, but the will of him that sent me.

Joh 6:38 For I am come down from heaven, not to do mine own will, but the will of him that sent me.

"mine own will" is not a statement that Jesus had a will of His own since it is a negation ie it is not His own will.
He states what it is "the will of Him that sent me."

Also Jesus never says that He had a will to do something different than being sent. This is an assumption on your part that a sending ought to involve two different wills but in this case it does not.

It is a separate (will).

John 8:28
......I do nothing of myself; but as my Father hath taught me, I speak these things.

It is a seperate (will)

Luke 22:42
Father, if thou be willing, remove this cup from me: nevertheless not my will, but thine, be done

In order to be taught there must be a teacher. The biblical Yeshua had his own (will) as he explicitly says....

 

[georgekk]

Jesus clearly states many times that he is NOT God.

"Why callest me good?"
"Is it not written that ye are gods.....children of the most high"

(In other words he is saying that just like himself...we are all gods)

He clearly refers to earth man as being "the daughters of men"

As he also refers to ET as being the sons of god who met the daughters of men.

He also claims that he is reincarnated by references of Malachi Ch1 V4 (i think)

"Surely Elijah must come first...as verily they knew that Jesus was Elijah?

Jesus simply states many times that we are all sons of god...as he is the son of god.

 

[fatima_bintu_islam]

Jesus clearly states many times that he is NOT God.

and

Jesus simply states many times that we are all sons of god...as he is the son of god.

It might be because its 2:52 am here , but I think this is something like a huge contradiction?
Ill look at it again tomorrow lol

 

[Muffled]

Jesus clearly states many times that he is NOT God.

"Why callest me good?"
"Is it not written that ye are gods.....children of the most high"

(In other words he is saying that just like himself...we are all gods)

He clearly refers to earth man as being "the daughters of men"

As he also refers to ET as being the sons of god who met the daughters of men.

He also claims that he is reincarnated by references of Malachi Ch1 V4 (i think)

"Surely Elijah must come first...as verily they knew that Jesus was Elijah?

Jesus simply states many times that we are all sons of god...as he is the son of god.

Your evidence for this is so shaky it is hard to construe how you could make this statement.

The obvious answer to this is because He is good and only God is good. There is no other man without sin.

This falls under proof that He is calling Himself God and not obversely as you are suggesting. Your other words are a misinterpretation.

Jesus refers to the Elijah that has come as "him" not "me." Mark 9: 13 But I say unto you, that Elijah is come, and they have also done unto him whatsoever they would, even as it is written of him.

I find no such references.

 

[AntEmpire]

If he did, did he say that he was more god than anyone elese or did Jesus just know that every man is god/god's son?

 

[Dirty Penguin]

i would like to see those videos debtes here to undertsand if jesus is god
www at hagda at com

Yep...seen those before. They are great. The late Ahmed Deedat was the best when it came to that subject. Shabir is good too.

 

[St Giordano Bruno]

I doubt if he could have made such a suicidal statement.

 

[horiturk]

no but that hasn't stopped people from believing it

 

[Christian Gnosis]

Did Jesus say he was God?

Depends how you read the Bible. One can read it to say yes or no. Such is often the case with the Bible.

Namaste