Did Kerry Make A Mistake?

[Lightkeeper]

Did he make a mistake by bringing Dick Cheney's lesbian dauther into debate #3. There is a lot of talk about it today. Mrs. Edwards made the comment today that she thinks Mrs. Cheney is embarassed that her daughter is lesbian. I would venture to guess that the Cheneys were protecting their daughter by their comments today. I don't think they are embarassed by her, I think they were embarrassed for her.

 

[Green Gaia]

That's funny, I've been thinking about this day.... and while I can see how some would see it as a political ploy, that's the game and if you can't take it, then you shouldn't be in the race. It's wasn't his comments that bothered me as much as what I heard Mrs. Cheney say in response. She said something like, "I hope everyone can see now that Senator Kerry is not a good man." And the first thing that sprung to mind was, "Mrs. Cheney, what is your definition of a good man? A man who actively pursues legislation that calls your daughter inferior?" I don't get it....

 

[Rex]

I think it's just dumb. She is a lesbian and he said she is a lesbian. What's the big deal?

I understand it may be hard for her but she needs to stand up for what she believes.

 

[Green Gaia]

She's campaigning for her father... I don't get it.

 

[Lightkeeper]

I think Kerry would have been better off if he had not mentioned Cheney's daughter. Every argument each side tries to make now about it will look bad.

 

[Green Gaia]

I don't know... I think it was talked to death today on the news shows because nothing else new was said last night. But I think it will blow over, because in the end the American people are more concerned about Iraq and the economy than Cheney's lesbian daughter.

 

[Mr Spinkles]

I understand it may be hard for her but she needs to stand up for what she believes.

Perhaps she does, but that does not mean that it is ethical to talk about your opponent's family members and bring them into the limelight during a political campaign. Cheney's daughter deserves to have her privacy respected and not have a media circus around her, but now she does, because Kerry chose to talk about her.

 

[Green Gaia]

Mr_Spinkles, it was common knowledge before last night that she is a lesbian. She is out campaining for her father who seeks to relagate gays and lesbians to second class citizens. She is an adult, not a child, and if she wanted her privacy, she wouldn't be out in the public actively trying to get her father re-elected.

 

[Mr Spinkles]

Whoah, hang on there--I've seen her out in public, but I didn't know she was 'actively' trying to get her father elected. Has she given speeches or talked to the media at all?

Do you think it would be ethical for Bush to start talking about one of Kerry's daughters during one of his speeches?

 

[Lightkeeper]

I agree with Mr. Spinkles, it was not a good move on Kerry's part to talk about Cheney's daughter. If it had been his own daughter It might not have been as bad, but still out of place.

 

[Feathers in Hair]

I don't think it was a good move of Kerry's to mention her (as Lightkeeper said, it was out of place) but I also think it's bad form for Cheney's group/family to try to raise an outcry against it. He wasn't saying anything negative about her, as far as I could tell.

 

[civilcynic]

As I watched the debate, my very first gut level response was that Kerry should not have brought up Mary Cheney's name but the more I thought about it, I changed my view.

My gut level reaction of dismay came from the knowledge that homosexuals are prejudiced against in this country which, of course, goes to the very heart of the question Kerry was responding to. The simple fact is that Kerry said nothing insulting or degrading in regards to Mary Cheney. It has been public knowledge that she is a lesbian so Kerry didn't 'out' her. Kerry simply noted that he did not believe that Mary Cheney and others like her chose to become homosexuals. Kerry then answered the question asked by clearly stating that he supported equal rights for homosexuals and opposed any anti-gay constutional amendments. In essence, he was saying that he thought that homosexuals, Mary Cheney included should not be biased against or punished simply because she is a homosexual.

The Cheney's reaction to Kerry's statements says volumes about their their true feelings regarding their daughter and her lifestyle. What exactly did Kerry say in his statements that outraged the Cheneys so much? Do the Cheneys believe that Kerry was wrong in saying that Mary Cheney did not choose to be homosexuality....do they believe Mary chose her lifestyle? Are they uncomfortable with the fact that the Bush/Cheney ticket are pushing for a constitutional amendment that is blatantly anti-gay even though their own daughter will be then discriminated against?

Lastly, lets take another apporach...What if the topic was slightly different and Kerry noted that Mary Cheney was a tireless campaign manager for Cheney......would we have this outcry from the Cheneys because kerry mentioned her name. What if Mary Cheney was in the military and Kerry suggested that Mary Cheney might have to serve double duty in the army...would there have been an outcry of dirty politicking.....I doubt it.

As far as insulting remarks overall, I found Mr. Bush's broad comments about liberals much more offensive and devisive.

 

[Lightkeeper]

What do you think Kerry's reason was for talking about Mary Cheney? He could have made his point without mentioning her.

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

I think Mrs. Cheney's reaction was both accurate and appropriate. I'll be voting for Kerry, but not because I think him to be a good man.

 

[Michelle]

Mike Signorile: “So Mary Cheney is a selfish hedonist, is that it?”
Alan Keyes: “Of course she is. That goes by definition. Of course she is.”
Mike Signorile: “I don’t think Dick Cheney would like to hear that about his daughter.”
Alan Keyes: “He may or may not like to hear the truth, but it can be spoken.”
Do you really believe that, that Mary Cheney .
Alan Keyes: “By definition, a homosexual engages in the exchange of mutual pleasure. I actually object to the notion that we call it sexual relations because it’s nothing of the kind.
An interview at the Republican National Convention .

There wasn't a public outcry over this? Which was more insulting to the Cheney's, Kerry's or Keye's remarks. I think it supports what civilcynic expressed earlier. By the way, well said Civil.

 

[civilcynic]

What do you think Kerry's reason was for talking about Mary Cheney? He could have made his point without mentioning her.

Mr. Bush threw out some names of indviduals to make his points during some of the debates and no one cried foul. Why do you think the Cheneys found Kerry's remarks so offensive? Mary Cheney is in the public eye and she is a lesbian and she would be directly affected by any anti-gay legislation.

Mr. Cheney and his wife support a constitutional ban on gay unions .....They are willing to deny the basic privilege to their own daughter to have a legal, loving relationship with another consenting adult....yes, I think it is totally relevant to make the point to the American people.

 

[Mr Spinkles]

Mr. Bush threw out some names of indviduals to make his points during some of the debates and no one cried foul.

First of all, I would respect your argument much more if you would focus on what Kerry said, and why or why not it was appropriate, rather than spin the issue by attacking "the other side". Secondly, how many of those individuals Bush spoke of were family members of his opponent or his opponent's running mate?

Why do you think the Cheneys found Kerry's remarks so offensive?

I think the outrage is purposefully exaggerated to take advantage of a slip-up by Kerry in bringing up an opponent's family member, which is generally believed to be unethical in a political campaign. And yes, I do think there would be outrage if Kerry talked about her in any context--in fact, if she was in the military, and Kerry used her as an example to argue against the Iraq war, there would probably be an even bigger outcry.

Mary Cheney is in the public eye and she is a lesbian and she would be directly affected by any anti-gay legislation.

If by "in the public eye" you mean she stands next to her father at conventions and smiles, then I agree with you. Lots of gays will be affected by anti-gay legislation....Kerry could use a million other examples without committing the political faux pas of talking about his opponent's family members.

 

[Rudyabdul]

Kerry said:
Quote:"We're all God's children, Bob. And I think if you were to talk to Dick Cheney's daughter, who is a lesbian, she would tell you that she's being who she was, she's being who she was born as. I think if you talked to anybody, it's not choice.''

John Kerry tried put a human face on what it means for someone to be gay, I believe he did so with great sensitivity and humanity in talking about gay Americans having the same rights, responsibilities and protections as every other American. I think people have enough common sense to understand what he means. However, he could have made his point about gay and lesbian Americans without mentioning the Vice President's daughter.

 

[DrM]

That's funny, I've been thinking about this day.... and while I can see how some would see it as a political ploy, that's the game and if you can't take it, then you shouldn't be in the race. It's wasn't his comments that bothered me as much as what I heard Mrs. Cheney say in response. She said something like, "I hope everyone can see now that Senator Kerry is not a good man." And the first thing that sprung to mind was, "Mrs. Cheney, what is your definition of a good man? A man who actively pursues legislation that calls your daughter inferior?" I don't get it....

Great point! Guess she married the wrong guy?