Do Muslims want to Assimilate?

[icehorse]

Some factual claims from the article linked to below:

- About 44 million Muslims live in Europe
- Europe has been encouraging Muslim immigration for 70 years
- A significant percentage of the Muslims living in Europe disagree with secularism.

Of course I understand that NOT ALL MUSLIMS living in Europe fall into this category. On the other hand, we often use statistics to draw general conclusions; e.g. "cancer is dangerous", "green vegetables are nutritious", "seat belts save lives", "Ethiopians have shorter life spans", and so on.

So, is it fair to conclude that: "Muslim immigrants do not want to assimilate into their host countries." ?

http://www.investors.com/politics/editorials/why-do-europes-muslims-hate-the-west/

 

[Kirran]

While troubling, it's still minorities who hold the ideas condemned in the article.

Also, that 44 million figure includes Turkey, Azerbaijan, Albania, Kosovo and Bosnia and Herzegovina.

 

[Useless2015]

Some factual claims from the article linked to below:

- About 44 million Muslims live in Europe
- Europe has been encouraging Muslim immigration for 70 years
- A significant percentage of the Muslims living in Europe disagree with secularism.

Of course I understand that NOT ALL MUSLIMS living in Europe fall into this category. On the other hand, we often use statistics to draw general conclusions; e.g. "cancer is dangerous", "green vegetables are nutritious", "seat belts save lives", "Ethiopians have shorter life spans", and so on.

So, is it fair to conclude that: "Muslim immigrants do not want to assimilate into their host countries." ?

http://www.investors.com/politics/editorials/why-do-europes-muslims-hate-the-west/

 

[Servant_of_the_One1]

No thanks, i dont like assimilation.

Integration by learning the language of the land and working is however good.

 

[LuisDantas]

What do you see as downsides of assimilation? What do you understand assimilation to be?

 

[Servant_of_the_One1]

What do you see as downsides of assimilation? What do you understand assimilation to be?

Being like Non-muslim, forsaking ur religion and traditions


However i urge strongly that muslims learn the language of the land and participate in the society by working. Working is regarded as good deed in our religion.
Prophet PBUH said it is better for someone to collect stuff from mountains and put it on his back then to sell that , instead of begging.

 

[Useless2015]

What did ‘we’ do to ‘them’?” de Winter asks. “We opened up our cities, our houses, our wallets. And in our secular temples of progress — our metro stations and airports and theaters — their sons are killing themselves and taking our sons and daughters with them.”

Tough question..I mean killing muslims in a mindblowing rate and numbers might be a reason. That might actually be the main reason..but i'm not an expert.

 

[Rival]

Tough question..I mean killing muslims in a mindblowing rate and numbers might be a reason. That might actually be the main reason..but i'm not an expert.

You can use this argument when Muslims stop insisting on killing each other, for a start.

 

[LuisDantas]

Being like Non-muslim, forsaking ur religion and traditions

So you do see a conflict between cultural assimilation and being a good, practicing Muslim?

Doesn't that strike you as somewhat at odds with the expectation that all people should be assumed to be born Muslims and to eventually revert to Islam if they have enough of a moral character and an opportunity to learn of Islam?

Or maybe you don't agree with that expectation?

 

[Father Heathen]

No thanks, i dont like assimilation.

Integration by learning the language of the land and working is however good.

Even if someone doesn't assimilate, do you agree that they should at least respect the local culture and laws? Meaning don't harass local women for not wearing hijabs or try to poison dogs in their neighborhood, as examples.

When cultures fail to adapt or progress, they stagnate and inevitably disappear into the dustbin of history.

 

[Servant_of_the_One1]

Even if someone doesn't assimilate, do you agree that they should at least respect the local culture and laws? Meaning don't harass local women for not wearing hijabs or try to poison dogs in their neighborhood, as examples.

Ofcourse i respect the culture of the land. Iam not unthankful person.

Didnt come here to disrespect them, i just have my own religion and tradition.

 

[Servant_of_the_One1]

Tough question..I mean killing muslims in a mindblowing rate and numbers might be a reason. That might actually be the main reason..but i'm not an expert.

Lol

 

[Useless2015]

You can use this argument when Muslims stop insisting on killing each other, for a start.

Muslims have to stop killing each other so your government can stop killing thousands of muslims? Is this what you are saying here?


I find it very gruesome to see 2 people liked your post...

 

[Quintessence]

When I hear a word like "assimilation" I hear "you must abandon your culture and heritage to become one of us; you must convert to our ways." Assimilation doesn't value pluralism, and it doesn't value cultural diversity. It demands that the newcomer destroy something of themselves to fit in, and it's a form of oppression that leads to cultural genocide. I have a hard time blaming any group of people for refusing such an offer. When the hand extended to you wants to steal things from you, why would you take it? Why is it so hard for us to extend hands of cultural exchange and value each others' differences?

 

[LuisDantas]

@Quintessence : fair point, although I am not quite sure it is all that different from what happens with the natives of the land as a matter of course.

 

[Kirran]

There's a difference between becoming culturally Westernised and adopting the secular democratic values found commonly in the West.

I'm not cool accepting homophobia for the sake of pluralism. But I'm fine with you having your own language, religion, character, whatever else you've got in your culture that doesn't conflict.

 

[LuisDantas]

Cultures are ever somewhat at odds with themselves. If they are worth anything at all, that is.

 

[Quintessence]

@Quintessence : fair point, although I am not quite sure it is all that different from what happens with the natives of the land as a matter of course.

It happens there, too. Interpersonal group dynamics are complicated, and seem necessarily tribal and riddled with things like social norms and pressure to conform to those norms. There is a particular "us vs. them" dynamic that happens between natives and immigrants of a land - I don't think it would be a stretch to characterize the reaction against Muslims in particular as downright xenophobic.

 

[LuisDantas]

It happens there, too. Interpersonal group dynamics are complicated, and seem necessarily tribal and riddled with things like social norms and pressure to conform to those norms. There is a particular "us vs. them" dynamic that happens between natives and immigrants of a land - I don't think it would be a stretch to characterize the reaction against Muslims in particular as downright xenophobic.

I don't particularly disagree, but I also think it is somewhat justified given current circunstances.

 

[Quintessence]

I don't particularly disagree, but I also think it is somewhat justified given current circunstances.

I find that any and all behaviors are justified and/or can be rationalized in some fashion. Regardless of justification, I can't help that my stomach churns in response to any and all witch hunts.