Do people understand the trinity doctrine?

[Ingledsva]

Not for Moses. There is no Messiah concept in the early stories. Some later Jews had some concept of resurrection -- some did not.

You are speaking pure bull.

See my post # 200.

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[sojourner]

You are speaking pure bull.

See my post # 200.

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I did. It said nothing about a Messiah. it mentioned a prophet. But no Messiah.

 

[Ingledsva]

I did. It said nothing about a Messiah. it mentioned a prophet. But no Messiah.

Lordy - Lordy - did you miss the info - the Christian commentary - Jesus saying he is that Prophet - whom is the awaited Messiah?

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[sojourner]

Lordy - Lordy - did you miss the info - the Christian commentary - Jesus saying he is that Prophet - whom is the awaited Messiah?

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No, but that's not part of the Moses epic, now, is it?! That's a superimposition of Jesus and a later messianic idea onto those texts.

 

[Glaurung]

You're insisting on creating a straw man to knock down.

Of course, as in my discussion with her about that particular distinction, (person and being) she refuses to acknowledge it because she is so hell bent on attacking it even to the point of deliberate lying. She knows full well what it says but doesn't actually care.

 

[sojourner]

So, to really answer the OP, people don't understand the Trinity doctrine enough to respect it?

 

[paarsurrey]

Moses didn't believe in resurrection either. I suppose that makes resurrection a "false doctrine?"

You mean Jesus' resurrection from the dead immediately after deliverance from the Cross; that never happened. Moses passed centuries ago; how could he believe this fictional creed of the Christians. Moses and Jesus never believed in such resurrection.

Regards

 

[sojourner]

You mean Jesus' resurrection from the dead immediately after deliverance from the Cross; that never happened.

The biblical record and Tradition of the church disagree with you. Besides the issue of whether or not the Resurrection is an actual, historical event, at least the mythic event -- as outlined in the bible -- happened. It's there for us to see and read. And that mythic event is real in the imaginations and theology of the church.

 

[paarsurrey]

The biblical record

It was neither written by Jesus nor dictated by him.
It has only remnants of what Jesus believed and taught.
Regards

 

[sojourner]

It was neither written by Jesus nor dictated by him.
It has only remnants of what Jesus believed and taught.
Regards

And this impacts the resurrection... how, exactly?

 

[Redemptionsong]

So why have you folks been calling those of us pointing out this fact, - that here is no Trinity doctrine in the Bible, - false and liars?

Also as stated, it pops up in the 4th century after Pagan contact, - most of which have Sacred Threesomes.

So why should Jews or anyone else accept this later made up trinity idea?

Jesus never said he was God.

Ingledsva, the point I'm making is contrary to your summary. God is in Jesus, and in the born-again believer; Father - Son - Holy Spirit. Our bodies are temples for that Spirit.

In many ways it is easier to understand the trinity of Father - Word - Holy Spirit. The Word exists potentially within the Spirit until it's spoken or begotten. The Word is itself Spirit and becomes a creative force once spoken.

By saying that Christ is not God you are saying that God's Word does not belong to Him. DOES YOUR WORD NOT BELONG TO YOU?

 

[Redemptionsong]

The Word is God's Spirit and HE has power. This was clearly demonstrated by Jesus when he healed a deaf man with a speech impediment (Mark 7:31-37). The deaf man could not hear Jesus say the words, Be opened, but he was nevertheless immediately healed.

 

[Ingledsva]

So why have you folks been calling those of us pointing out this fact, - that here is no Trinity doctrine in the Bible, - false and liars?

Also as stated, it pops up in the 4th century after Pagan contact, - most of which have Sacred Threesomes.

So why should Jews or anyone else accept this later made up trinity idea?

Jesus never said he was God.

Ingledsva, the point I'm making is contrary to your summary. God is in Jesus, and in the born-again believer; Father - Son - Holy Spirit. Our bodies are temples for that Spirit.

In many ways it is easier to understand the trinity of Father - Word - Holy Spirit. The Word exists potentially within the Spirit until it's spoken or begotten. The Word is itself Spirit and becomes a creative force once spoken.

By saying that Christ is not God you are saying that God's Word does not belong to Him. DOES YOUR WORD NOT BELONG TO YOU?

You are twisting wording - which does not work.

God in everyone - does not make everyone God! Nor would it make Jesus so!

And how exactly am I saying God's word doesn't belong to him, - when neither God nor Jesus, say that Jesus is God in the Bible?


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[Ingledsva]

The Word is God's Spirit and HE has power. This was clearly demonstrated by Jesus when he healed a deaf man with a speech impediment (Mark 7:31-37). The deaf man could not hear Jesus say the words, Be opened, but he was nevertheless immediately healed.

What is your point here?

Bible says everyone can do such.

None doing so, are God.

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[Ingledsva]

The biblical record and Tradition of the church disagree with you. Besides the issue of whether or not the Resurrection is an actual, historical event, at least the mythic event -- as outlined in the bible -- happened. It's there for us to see and read. And that mythic event is real in the imaginations and theology of the church.

It is PURE MYTH that Jesus and other dead people got out of their graves and wondered around the city!

Shocked people, and real historians, would have written about it!

They didn't - because it didn't happen.

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[Ingledsva]

No, but that's not part of the Moses epic, now, is it?! That's a superimposition of Jesus and a later messianic idea onto those texts.

LOL! The Prophet like Moses is a prophecy of the awaited Jewish Messiah.

As stated over-and-over, that is what Jesus was claiming to be, - not a God, or part of any trinity.

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[Ingledsva]

Of course, as in my discussion with her about that particular distinction, (person and being) she refuses to acknowledge it because she is so hell bent on attacking it even to the point of deliberate lying. She knows full well what it says but doesn't actually care.

The next time you say something like this - YOU WILL BE REPORTED!

People having different opinions then yours - obviously does NOT mean they are lying!!!!!!!!!!!!

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[sojourner]

LOL! The Prophet like Moses is a prophecy of the awaited Jewish Messiah.

As stated over-and-over, that is what Jesus was claiming to be, - not a God, or part of any trinity.

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We really don't know what Jesus claimed to be. We only know what later authors claimed Jesus to be -- and they wrote of Jesus in a manner that strongly implies divinity.

 

[Ingledsva]

We really don't know what Jesus claimed to be. We only know what later authors claimed Jesus to be -- and they wrote of Jesus in a manner that strongly implies divinity.

However, we are discussing what the Bible actually says.

The Bible does NOT say Jesus is God, or part of any trinity.

We can go with nothing said about Jesus being true. I have no problem with this.

The Jesus story is just a myth.

So why do you believe in parts of what the Bible says about Jesus then?

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[Glaurung]

People having different opinions then yours - obviously does NOT mean they are lying!!!!!!!!!!!!

You keep misrepresenting the trinity as positing three beings.

To say God can be three beings in one, is one thing. - To say these three separate beings hang around together, at the same time, while three separate beings, - puts the FALSE to the idea.

This is a misrepresentation and you know it. That's my point. It's not your rejection of the trinity that I accuse as being a lie, it's your strawman version of it which you set up to attack that we have told you multiple times is not what we assert. It explicitly rejects what you claim it to state, yet you keep presenting that as being an accurate representation of the doctrine. Of course your rendition of it is absurd, you've set it up to be. But how is that not being dishonest? You're smarter than that to honestly think that's what the trinity really says.