Do you as a Muslim believe in women's equality?

[Draka]

@Robert.Evans
Yeppers, because obviously single parent families are all women's fault. Men have nothing to do with break-ups. Men are innocent trodden on little creatures at the whim of the big bad women. It's all feminism because it all obviously has to be women's fault. Kudos to you sir, excellent point. I bow to your utmost wisdom about all things to do with gender. I have to, of course, for I am but a mere weak woman who knows nothing about her own gender. Thank you good sir, for being such an informative man.

 

[Robert.Evans]

1. Single-Parent Families Cause Juvenile Crime (From ...
   NCJRS Abstract - National Criminal Justice Reference Service
   by RL Maginnis - ‎1997
   Title: Single-Parent Families Cause Juvenile Crime (From Juvenile Crime: Opposing ... Index Term(s): Juvenile delinquency factors ; Parent-Child Relations ...

We might also add this:

Feminism is partly to blame for the breakdown of the family, one of Labour’s most senior female politicians has said.

Diane Abbott, the party’s public health spokesman, said that major issues facing society ‘stem from family breakdown’.

And in a surprise admission from one of the Left’s most outspoken feminists, she conceded that women’s rights campaigners have neglected the family.

Miss Abbott, a divorced mother with one son, also highlighted the harmful impact on society of internet pornography and fast food.

Perhaps most surprising, however, is her argument that Left-wingers and feminists should make family breakdown a key battleground rather than leave the issue to Conservatives.

In an interview with The Guardian, she said: ‘Those of us who came of age at th...
How feminism is to blame for the breakdown of the family, by Left-winger Diane Abbott | Daily Mail Online

 

[Draka]

I see where you're coming from, ma'am, and I agree with you in that special case scenario. This life is not always regular and exceptions are always there. What I believe, and addressed, is that men by nature are much more accepting to physical abuse than women. I think science proves that. It is the norm I'm talking about and I believe the norm is what to follow as a main rule. I think average men are generally more physically fit/capable than average women. That of course also gives some negative attributes to men, not that I'm trying to belittle women here.

I think Beth Phoenix is cool btw (and hot ), and I respect her. But how many male wrestlers can she really go toe to toe with? Even the Entertainment put her against men like about a couple times and they know her better.

She actually could go toe to toe with several men. Not the point though. The point is that everyone is different, men and women. And though you speak of a "norm", since there are differences, both genders should have the freedom to do such as their differences allow. If both I and a man are needing a job, and the one available required some physical component that I was actually better at than the man I should hope that I would be granted the job because of my ability and him not just be given the job solely because he is a man. Especially if I would be better at it. That makes no sense. Judging both of us upon stereotypical ideas of what a man and woman "should" be. See what I mean?

 

[Robert.Evans]

@Robert.Evans
Yeppers, because obviously single parent families are all women's fault. Men have nothing to do with break-ups. Men are innocent trodden on little creatures at the whim of the big bad women. It's all feminism because it all obviously has to be women's fault. Kudos to you sir, excellent point. I bow to your utmost wisdom about all things to do with gender. I have to, of course, for I am but a mere weak woman who knows nothing about her own gender. Thank you good sir, for being such an informative man.

You love to exaggerate don't you and of course not discuss. Is that trolling???
I said that feminism (and its consequences) is the main reason for the break up of the family etc. It is the biggest change in soceity of the last few decades. You seem to care little about the whole and just about you, and that is the problem.

 

[Smart_Guy]

So what is it like where you are with women? I forget now where you are, Saudi is it? People in the west like to make out it is bad, but I don't see it. Customs are different. Want to share some?

Yes, I'm from Saudi Arabia

It is unfortunate that women are denied some rights here. They are not allowed to drive, they are forced to wear the hijab (for some reasons it is less restrictive to forengners), men are allowed to have another wife without giving any thought to the current ( I heard the law is studying restrictions for that, now that we have female senators)... these are what come to my mind for now. But things are improving. Now I see more women work, family divisions allow single women to get in but not single men, women have more choices to travel alone, hitting the wife is a crime... with luck, one day women will be allowed to drive too.

The above are not really customs, they are mostly results of misusing customs and lack of awareness.

 

[Smart_Guy]

She actually could go toe to toe with several men. Not the point though. The point is that everyone is different, men and women. And though you speak of a "norm", since there are differences, both genders should have the freedom to do such as their differences allow. If both I and a man are needing a job, and the one available required some physical component that I was actually better at than the man I should hope that I would be granted the job because of my ability and him not just be given the job solely because he is a man. Especially if I would be better at it. That makes no sense. Judging both of us upon stereotypical ideas of what a man and woman "should" be. See what I mean?

Yes ma'am, I see your point. Thank you for sharing your views with me

 

[Draka]

Yes ma'am, I see your point. Thank you for sharing your views with me

Likewise, if a man and a woman both applied to work at a daycare center and he happens to have more experience and is better with the children than the woman, then he should get the job rather than the woman, even though some seem to feel that women are automatically better care givers. We simply aren't all the same and fit stereotypical molds. All that is asked is that we are judged on an individual basis, upon our unique skills and knowledge, rather than what some think we all should be based merely upon our gender. We are diverse and should be treated as such.

 

[Parsimony]

No reason why the mother can't raise the children either... lest of course they want money and power and freedom from men perhaps, and they judge themselves that way.

Of course. Either father or mother can raise them if the circumstances will permit it.

 

[Robert.Evans]

Of course. Either father or mother can raise them if the circumstances will permit it.

I don't think we will agree on this. I say the mother brings then up. You could just as equally say leave them in the shed with some food and let them bring themselves up. Whatever you think is right. I don't think it is right for a woman with a God given right to bring up the human race, should throw that away just because at the end of it she has no power and money.

 

[Robert.Evans]

Likewise, if a man and a woman both applied to work at a daycare center and he happens to have more experience and is better with the children than the woman, then he should get the job rather than the woman, even though some seem to feel that women are automatically better care givers. We simply aren't all the same and fit stereotypical molds. All that is asked is that we are judged on an individual basis, upon our unique skills and knowledge, rather than what some think we all should be based merely upon our gender. We are diverse and should be treated as such.

We should be a collective not a singularity. You have to look at the greater society and not just your own personal wants in life.

 

[MysticSang'ha]

So...we have gone from discussing gender equality and women's rights according to Islam...to discussing how good or bad feminism is?

It would be nice to stay on topic.

 

[Robert.Evans]

So...we have gone from discussing gender equality and women's rights according to Islam...to discussing how good or bad feminism is?

It would be nice to stay on topic.

It would be nice not to have trolling and name calling, but hey, it happens.

 

[Smart_Guy]

Likewise, if a man and a woman both applied to work at a daycare center and he happens to have more experience and is better with the children than the woman, then he should get the job rather than the woman, even though some seem to feel that women are automatically better care givers. We simply aren't all the same and fit stereotypical molds. All that is asked is that we are judged on an individual basis, upon our unique skills and knowledge, rather than what some think we all should be based merely upon our gender. We are diverse and should be treated as such.

I agree to this and the previous one.

What do you think of jobs that have on-call and unpredictable urgent requirements, and women having the special natural cases that men don't have? Do you think it is okay to give such positions to women risking they could get a special case happening at the time they are called for urgent matters suddenly? Like an urgent surgery that could make a life and death difference?

I'm not an expert in this, and please forgive me for this question, but does the monthly period happen at fixed times so such a risk in the above scenario can be avoided?

Are there many female surgeons in the west?

I'm quiet oblivious in things because of my reserved culture. Please forgive me if my questions sounded stupid.

 

[illykitty]

I agree to this and the previous one.

What do you think of jobs that have on-call and unpredictable urgent requirements, and women having the special natural cases that men don't have? Do you think it is okay to give such positions to women risking they could get a special case happening at the time they are called for urgent matters suddenly? Like an urgent surgery that could make a life and death difference?

I'm not an expert in this, and please forgive me for this question, but does the monthly period happen at fixed times so such a risk in the above scenario can be avoided?

Are there many female surgeons in the west?

I'm quiet oblivious in things because of my reserved culture. Please forgive me if my questions sounded stupid.

I know the question wasn't aimed at me but I have some insights from knowing a bit about Islam.

Periods vary from woman to woman. Some are regular and some are irregular. Regular women have their periods at fixed intervals and for the same amount of time. Those vary with each woman but the important part is that they can predict when it happens. An irregular woman is the contrary, they can't predict when it will happen. But if a woman takes birth control, it's not just good for preventing unwanted pregnancies but also controls periods to become predictable.

When I was studying Islam, I always wondered about the rules around periods. On one hand, it was nice, especially for someone who has very painful ones but on the other hand, not all women do and plenty manage to work and do things when they have them.

For your last question, there are female surgeons... According to a quick Google search, they are in the minority though at 9.2% of surgeons in the UK, hopefully that data is accurate.

And better to ask questions than to assume.

 

[Draka]

I agree to this and the previous one.

What do you think of jobs that have on-call and unpredictable urgent requirements, and women having the special natural cases that men don't have? Do you think it is okay to give such positions to women risking they could get a special case happening at the time they are called for urgent matters suddenly? Like an urgent surgery that could make a life and death difference?

I'm not an expert in this, and please forgive me for this question, but does the monthly period happen at fixed times so such a risk in the above scenario can be avoided?

Are there many female surgeons in the west?

I'm quiet oblivious in things because of my reserved culture. Please forgive me if my questions sounded stupid.

Most women work just fine during their period. If cramps are there, pop an Aleve or Tylenol and keep going for the most part. Most women also work while pregnant, often up until delivery. We are quite resilient, whether some guys believe it or not. Oh, and nor is there anything wrong with a woman in either condition. Regardless some religious beliefs. It's just our natural body and the natural cycles it goes through.

 

[Draka]

We should be a collective not a singularity. You have to look at the greater society and not just your own personal wants in life.

I am speaking of society. If we are all judged upon what we can best individually contribute rather than have assumptions forced upon us by those expecting everyone to fit into stereotypes, we can be more efficient as a whole. With everyone doing the job they are best suited for and helping society run smoother.

 

[Smart_Guy]

I know the question wasn't aimed at me but I have some insights from knowing a bit about Islam.

Periods vary from woman to woman. Some are regular and some are irregular. Regular women have their periods at fixed intervals and for the same amount of time. Those vary with each woman but the important part is that they can predict when it happens. An irregular woman is the contrary, they can't predict when it will happen. But if a woman takes birth control, it's not just good for preventing unwanted pregnancies but also controls periods to become predictable.

When I was studying Islam, I always wondered about the rules around periods. On one hand, it was nice, especially for someone who has very painful ones but on the other hand, not all women do and plenty manage to work and do things when they have them.

For your last question, there are female surgeons... According to a quick Google search, they are in the minority though at 9.2% of surgeons in the UK, hopefully that data is accurate.

And better to ask questions than to assume.

Most women work just fine during their period. If cramps are there, pop an Aleve or Tylenol and keep going for the most part. Most women also work while pregnant, often up until delivery. We are quite resilient, whether some guys believe it or not. Oh, and nor is there anything wrong with a woman in either condition. Regardless some religious beliefs. It's just our natural body and the natural cycles it goes through.

Ladies, thank you very much for your responses

 

[SomeRandom]

How delightful!
Bu t who is saying that a woman should not learn nor work? No one as far as I know. I am saying there is a difference in roles, and that women do not have to be men to be of value.

You did, when you flat out said that a mother is not a mother if she dares to hold a job. (Perish the thought! A woman providing her kid with a life!) I mean, a mother, nay a woman is no more than a baby making machine stuck at home 24/7 after the kid is born (never mind that the kids don't stay at home) and if she dares to hold down a job and provide money for her family to survive, according to you, she is not a "real" mother. Which in itself is right ****ing insulting. I would regale you with some of the language my fellow Aussies might use towards you, in response to such a callous statement, but such language is not allowed on the forums.
And you did imply that women's pursuits were pretty useless or at least not as worthy in comparison when you said that men have to pretend that women can do the same as they can. Which must be a surprise to people like Madam Curie, the first person to win 2 Nobel Prizes in two different Scientific Disciplines no less, whilst supporting a family mind you. During the 1800s. Or more recently all the women I know who can drive mining trucks or just "regular" trucks better than most blokes.Christ some of the female truckies I know I sure as hell wouldn't want to bloody mess with, mate. Or say anything that you have espoused in this thread to their face. They and their fellow truckies (both males and females mind) would probably pummel you!

But regardless. When you say or imply that the "proper" place for women is in the home, why would a woman in such a position even try to learn, try to better themselves, try out work? I mean, the working world is for men, right? So why should a woman even bother, if she is stuck at home all the freaking time? What has she to gain from bettering herself if she is stuck at home?

 

[SomeRandom]

Not relevant whether you are clever than me or not. Perhaps you should read the last few pages again.

I did. I called you out for being deliberately obtuse towards Mystic for no real reason.So I ask again. Are you suggesting, because you said you did not understand Mystic's question, that you do not understand basic English? Or are you just being a *EDIT* for no reason? That in plain enough English for you, mate?

 

[Draka]

I don't think we will agree on this. I say the mother brings then up. You could just as equally say leave them in the shed with some food and let them bring themselves up. Whatever you think is right. I don't think it is right for a woman with a God given right to bring up the human race, should throw that away just because at the end of it she has no power and money.

Are you equating the care a father gives to throwing children in a shed and neglecting them? Because that's what you just did there. Insult all fathers. Are you a father? Do you actually think that lowly of your parenting skills and your ability to love, care for, and guide your children?