Frank Goad
Well-Known Member
Do you think 2 Peter 1:10-11 and 2 Peter 1:13-15.Imply you go right to heaven at death?I do.
-
Welcome to Religious Forums, a friendly forum to discuss all religions in a friendly surrounding.
Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to the following site features:- Reply to discussions and create your own threads.
- Our modern chat room. No add-ons or extensions required, just login and start chatting!
- Access to private conversations with other members.
We hope to see you as a part of our community soon!
Do you think 2 Peter 1:10-11 and 2 Peter 1:13-15.Imply you go right to heaven at death?I do.
- Thread starter Frank Goad
- Start date
paarsurrey
Veteran Member
The verses of 2 Peter is neither printed in red in the KJV Red Letter Bible of the Protestantism people nor in the "THE DOUAY-RHEIMS" of the Catholicism people, please. Right?Do you think 2 Peter 1:10-11 and 2 Peter 1:13-15.Imply you go right to heaven at death?I do.
It means, one gathers, it was never written or spoken by Jesus, so it should never have been in the Bible. Right?
Kindly quote from Jesus in this connection, please. Right?
Regards
Frank Goad
Well-Known Member
paarsurrey
Veteran Member
Isn't it a good reason that Jesus did not die on the Cross, as Jesus remained in the hell of the heart of the Earth, as one understand, please? Right?In 2 Peter 1:13-14.He says Jesus told him he was going to die soon.
Regards
Do you think 2 Peter 1:10-11 and 2 Peter 1:13-15.Imply you go right to heaven at death?I do.
Strange, is it not? that of the myriads who
Before us pass'd the door of Darkness through,
Before us pass'd the door of Darkness through,
Not one returns to tell us of the Road,
Which to discover we must travel too.Edward FitzGerald, The Rubáiyát of Omar Khayyám 4th edn v. 64.
Wildswanderer
Veteran Member
If that's your standard you have to throw out most of the Bible.
Wildswanderer
Veteran Member
Me too.Do you think 2 Peter 1:10-11 and 2 Peter 1:13-15.Imply you go right to heaven at death?I do.
Brian2
Veteran Member
Do you think 2 Peter 1:10-11 and 2 Peter 1:13-15.Imply you go right to heaven at death?I do.
No, but I think some things that Paul wrote do imply that for a Christian.
Brian2
Veteran Member
Do you think 2 Peter 1:10-11 and 2 Peter 1:13-15.Imply you go right to heaven at death?I do.
When I read 2 Pet 1:10-11 again I do see this implication.
And when I read the passage below it seems to imply that many in hades also (who were not Christians) have been taken with Jesus to heaven.
…Ephesians 4:7Now to each one of us grace has been given according to the measure of the gift of Christ. 8This is why it says: “When He ascended on high, He led captives away, and gave gifts to men.” 9What does “He ascended” mean, except that He also descended to the lower parts of the earth?…
Aupmanyav
Be your own guru
One cannot go directly to heaven, unless the judgment has been made, and that will be done only at the end of days. At the moment, heavenly mansions are ready but empty, may be crumbling because of non use, and the souls are in hibernation. God will raise them when the time comes.
Sgt. Pepper
All you need is love.
Do you think 2 Peter 1:10-11 and 2 Peter 1:13-15.Imply you go right to heaven at death?I do.
No, I don't believe that's true, Frank, and it's not just because the Bible seems to imply that it is. My personal interactions with the spiritual realm during my life prove to me otherwise, as well as the Bible contradicting itself in its teachings about the afterlife.
While it's true that the verses in 2 Peter that you mentioned, as well as Hebrews 9:27 and 2 Corinthians 5:8, seem to indicate that a person's spirit faces judgment immediately following death, other scriptures in the Bible clearly contradict these verses. For example, Revelation 20:13 says, "The sea gave up the dead that were in it, and death and Hades gave up the dead that were in them, and each person was judged according to what they had done." And Daniel 12:2 seems to imply soul sleep: "And many of those who sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt." 2 Chronicles 32:33 also implies soul sleep: "And Hezekiah slept with his fathers; and they buried him in the upper part of the tombs of the sons of David; and all Judah and the inhabitants of Jerusalem did him honor at his death. And Manasseh, his son, reigned in his place." In fact, there are other verses that also imply soul sleep, such as 2 Chronicles 33:20; 1 Kings 15:8; 1 Kings 16:28; 2 Kings 13:13; and 2 Kings 14:29.
In addition to all these multiple verses implying soul sleep, Matthew 27:51-53 says, "Then, behold, the veil of the temple was torn in two from top to bottom; and the earth quaked, and the rocks were split, and the graves were opened; and many bodies of the saints who had fallen asleep were raised; and coming out of the graves after His resurrection, they went into the holy city and appeared to many." John 11:11-15 also implies soul sleep, "After saying these things, he said to them, 'Our friend Lazarus has fallen asleep, but I go to awaken him.' The disciples said to him, 'Lord, if he has fallen asleep, he will recover.' Now Jesus had spoken of his death, but they thought that he meant taking rest in sleep. Then Jesus told them plainly, 'Lazarus has died, and for your sake I am glad that I was not there, so that you may believe. But let us go to him.'” Notice that Jesus didn't say that Lazarus' spirit went straight to heaven and faced judgment. He said that Lazarus had fallen asleep and that he would go wake up Lazarus, but Lazarus was dead.
The Bible has proven itself to be full of contradictions, not only about what will happen in the afterlife, but it has other contradictions too: 30 Pairs Of Bible Verses That Contradict One Another; and 101 Clear Contradictions In The Bible. After I read and examined these contradictions and learned about how many of the stories in the Bible parallel with a few stories from pagan religions that predate it and Christianity, I'm now of the opinion that the Bible is plagiarized (as I detailed in this post here) and therefore, it can't be trusted.
Last edited:
Brian2
Veteran Member
If understood correctly the scriptures you cite do not contradict each other.
If you have had interactions with the spirit realm then you have probably had interactions with demons.
The links you give to other gods with similarities to Jesus are rubbish.
Do you think 2 Peter 1:10-11 and 2 Peter 1:13-15.Imply you go right to heaven at death?I do.
I think it depends on is person righteous, because:
These will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous into eternal life.
Mat. 25:46
For the wages of sin is death, but the free gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.
Romans 6:23
paarsurrey
Veteran Member
Is it wrong to prefer Jesus over the superfluous stuff that sprang up later, please? Right?
Regards
Wildswanderer
Veteran Member
Sprang up later? It's all God's Word. Jesus is ultimately the author of it all.
paarsurrey
Veteran Member
That is a myth created by Hellenist Paul and the Pauline-Church to convert the simple minded followers of Jesus to Hellenism. please. Right?
Regards
Wildswanderer
Veteran Member
Wrong.
joelr
Well-Known Member
I know there is a lot of mis-information on the pre-Jesus demigod saviors. It's important to stick to the field of peer-reviewed historical information.
This is a good explanation of some of the earlier saviors:
Virgin Birth: It's Pagan, Guys. Get Over It. • Richard Carrier
Brian2
Veteran Member
Richard Carrier relies on the pre conception that the Bible is not true and evolved from other religions it seems.
Sgt. Pepper
All you need is love.
The more I read information like what you posted, the more I'm convinced that there are stories in the Bible that are plagiarized from pagan religions that predate it. And as I explained in my post here, I'm also convinced that the Bible has many contradictions too.