Does a Soldier in War Break the 6th Commandment?

[idav]

The The Sixth Commandment is: "Thou shalt not kill."

Does a soldier in war break the 6th commandment?

What are your thoughts? Please explain your reasoning.

Yea even anyone who hunts or cuts down trees violates that rule. Seems like a bit much though. The "don't murder" makes more sense which I don't think applies to combat if it's for defense.

 

[Jeremiahcp]

Are you looking for versus of scripture where God says "if someone is about


I'm being intentionally cryptic to match your style. But that doesn't seem to be working. The commandment "Thou shalt not kill" obviously does not mean that we must never kill under any circumstances. Ex 21:12-14, Deut 21:18-21, Lev 21:9, 1 Sam 15:2-3 are a few quick examples where God expressly commanded someone to kill someone else. This proves that "Thou shalt not kill" does not mean "Thou shalt never kill under any circumstances."

Exodus 22:2-3 says "If a thief be found breaking up, and be smitten that he die, there shall no blood be shed for him." This is an example where God does not explicitly require that the property owner kill the thief, but God says that if the owner kills the thief in the act of defending property, the property owner will not be put to death by the law. If he were guily of murder, i.e., if he had broken the commandment "thou shalt not kill", he would have to be put to death. This proves that under Old Testament law, the taking of life to protect property is not a sin.

God does not spell out in the Bible every circumstance under which taking a life would be justified. There are ample examples to give us the guidelines we need to choose wisely. Thankfully, I have never had to make that choice for myself. But if someone came busting through my door and was about to kill my wife, I would not hesitate to shoot him dead with a clear conscience. Also, if the Japanese and Germans are trying to kill me and my family, and take away my freedom, I have no hesitation to kill.

Can you quote anything in the Bible that contradicts this?

"If a thief be found breaking up, and be smitten that he die, there shall no blood be shed for him."

So a five year old stealing from the cookie jar can be killed and God is OK with it.

 

[Politesse]

The The Sixth Commandment is: "Thou shalt not kill."

Does a soldier in war break the 6th commandment?

What are your thoughts? Please explain your reasoning.

Yes.

I don't believe in the concept of a "just war". Jesus calls peacemakers blessed, not the sons of violence, and so do I. It may be that war is sometimes necessary, as it is an ugly and sinful world, and your enemies will not necessarily to ask whether you wish to wage war before invading your territory. But the deaths that result will always be a sin, and I don't think much of those who try to disguise sin as virtue because they can't stand the thought of themselves as sinful. In the adult world, there isn't always a distinction between "things I am forced to do" and "things that are morally right".

 

[Scott C.]

"If a thief be found breaking up, and be smitten that he die, there shall no blood be shed for him."

So a five year old stealing from the cookie jar can be killed and God is OK with it.

No, that's not ok. Before I continue this discussion, you need to be more transparent. What do you believe and why? Are you Seventh Day Adventist? Are you a Christian? Do you believe it's ever Ok to kill? Are you trying to prove the Bible is inconsistent? Would you kill in self defense? In other words, where are you coming from?

 

[Politesse]

Are you looking for versus of scripture where God says "if someone is about


I'm being intentionally cryptic to match your style. But that doesn't seem to be working. The commandment "Thou shalt not kill" obviously does not mean that we must never kill under any circumstances. Ex 21:12-14, Deut 21:18-21, Lev 21:9, 1 Sam 15:2-3 are a few quick examples where God expressly commanded someone to kill someone else. This proves that "Thou shalt not kill" does not mean "Thou shalt never kill under any circumstances."

Exodus 22:2-3 says "If a thief be found breaking up, and be smitten that he die, there shall no blood be shed for him." This is an example where God does not explicitly require that the property owner kill the thief, but God says that if the owner kills the thief in the act of defending property, the property owner will not be put to death by the law. If he were guily of murder, i.e., if he had broken the commandment "thou shalt not kill", he would have to be put to death. This proves that under Old Testament law, the taking of life to protect property is not a sin.

God does not spell out in the Bible every circumstance under which taking a life would be justified. There are ample examples to give us the guidelines we need to choose wisely. Thankfully, I have never had to make that choice for myself. But if someone came busting through my door and was about to kill my wife, I would not hesitate to shoot him dead with a clear conscience. Also, if the Japanese and Germans are trying to kill me and my family, and take away my freedom, I have no hesitation to kill.

Can you quote anything in the Bible that contradicts this?

Do you take this same approach to all the commandments? That, for instance, it is sometimes okay to worship other gods, to commit adultery, to covet an ox, et cetera?

 

[Jeremiahcp]

No, that's not ok. Before I continue this discussion, you need to be more transparent. What do you believe and why? Are you Seventh Day Adventist? Are you a Christian? Do you believe it's ever Ok to kill? Are you trying to prove the Bible is inconsistent? Would you kill in self defense? In other words, where are you coming from?

"No, that's not ok."

Where is the scripture to support this?

 

[Scott C.]

Do you take this same approach to all the commandments? That, for instance, it is sometimes okay to worship other gods, to commit adultery, to covet an ox, et cetera?

If the Bible said that under some circumstances I should worship other gods, then I would carefully consider those circumstances and how it may apply to my worship. But I am aware of no such scriptures. I believe "thou shalt have no other gods before me, means that God is the only God and should be our only being to worship. I think I did a reasonable job to demonstrate from the Bible itself that "thou shalt not kill" means "Thou shalt not murder, and taking a life is not necessarily murder."

(Edit: I thought of an example. I believe "Keep the Sabbath day holy" is a commandment. We are not supposed to work on the Sabbath. But Jesus told his followers that if your ox falls in the mire on the Sabbath, you should pull it out. That requires work. I understand from this that we should not work on the Sabbath, but there are times when it's justified based on circumstances. But still... no examples that say we should ever worship false gods )

 

[Scott C.]

"No, that's not ok."

Where is the scripture to support this?

Sorry, but if no transparency, no more discussion.

 

[Jeremiahcp]

Sorry, but if no transparency, no more discussion.

Is your faith in God really that weak?

 

[shunyadragon]

Murder is illegal killing.

I would not consider it illegal killing, because of the variation in the laws of different countries and interpretations of laws. I consider it morally wrongful death, and laws are understood based on this.

 

[Jeremiahcp]

I would not consider it illegal killing, because of the variation in the laws of different countries and interpretations of laws. I consider it morally wrongful death, and laws are understood based on this.

That is also another human interpretation.

 

[shunyadragon]

Yes.

He took another persons life (killed)

with intent (murdered)

In both cases, the soldier took a life. By strict sola-scriptura definition, he broke a commandment.

I do not believe this is correct. I do not know any Christian church or group that supports a version o sola scriptora that believes this. There are many many references in the Bible that justify war and killing the enemies of God.

 

[shunyadragon]

That is also another human interpretation.

That is pretty much all your going to get. Though a form of moral wrongful death' is pretty much universal with all cultures in the history of humanity.

 

[Scott C.]

I'd say if it's a war to right wrongs, yes. But only to right wrongs. Wars of conquest, aggression, greed are not, imo.

I agree with you. Those who start "unjust" wars may be guilty of murder IMO. But I believe God will have much more tolerance, and even hold guiltless, the individual soldier who is sent into battle and who willingly defends his country in a war that his country started for unjust reasons. Now if that soldier commits atrocities, that's another story.

 

[Grandliseur]

The The Sixth Commandment is: "Thou shalt not kill."

Does a soldier in war break the 6th commandment?

What are your thoughts? Please explain your reasoning.

Since you are asking about commandments, you are asking for Bible reasons.

There is an OT scripture that shows that killing in war, combatants killing other combatants trying to kill each other, does not incur the sin of murder.
As to Christians, the NT shows Jesus telling us 2 or 3 times, that those who kill in war shall themselves be killed this way. He doesn't say it damns, but kind of dampens the desire to be a soldier.

Then we have the example, which is really 'up in your face', that the first gentile convert was a soldier still doing his soldiering, a commander of some sort in the Roman army. Others might here give you his title.

 

[Skwim]

That is just one translation.
Another is "Thou shall not murder.".

Of the 50 Bibles I checked 26% used the word "kill" and 74% used "murder."

And this is what's neat about the Bible, in some cases it gives you a choice as what to believe. Depending on the Bible one uses, a person is justified in believing that in Isaiah 45:7 god creates one of the following.

Evil
Disaster
Bad times
Calamity
Trouble
Doom
Woe
Sorrow
Discords​

And even within the same Bible one may have a choice:

For by grace are ye saved through faith…not of works. —Ephesians 2:8,9

Ye see then how that by works a man is justified, and not by faith only. —James 2:24


No man hath seen God at any time. —John 1:18

For I have seen God face to face. —Genesis 32:30


And [Judas] cast down the pieces of silver in the temple, and departed, and went and hanged himself. —Matthew 27:5

Now [Judas] purchased a field with the reward of iniquity; and falling headlong, he burst asunder in the midst, and all his bowels gushed out. —Acts 1:18


Therefore Michal the daughter of Saul had no child unto the day of her death. —II Samuel 6:23

But the king took the two sons of Rizpah…and the five sons of Michal the daughter of Saul. —II Samuel 21:8

.​

​

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[columbus]

Is your faith in God really that weak?

It seems pretty clear to me that what you are attacking is the concept of objective, Scriptural, morality.
I, too, often get annoyed by religionists(usually Christians or Muslims) insisting that their moral opinions are those of God and don't need any further justifications or adjustments. Then they will point to a Scriptural verse that isn't really clear and insist that their interpretation is the only possible interpretation.

The decalogue falls into that category. What the ancients would have considered murder doesn't always match what modern people consider murder.
And what people nearly always mean by murder is "killing which I disapprove of strongly". Which is quite subjective. Which abortions? Which executions? Which wars? Does marketing cigarettes to young people count? Loaning a car with poor safety equipment? Feeding your husband all the bacon he wants?

Murder is a very complicated concept.

But you are being quite a jerk in this thread.
Tom

 

[Jeremiahcp]

It seems pretty clear to me that what you are attacking is the concept of objective, Scriptural, morality.
I, too, often get annoyed by religionists(usually Christians or Muslims) insisting that their moral opinions are those of God and don't need any further justifications or adjustments. Then they will point to a Scriptural verse that isn't really clear and insist that their interpretation is the only possible interpretation.

The decalogue falls into that category. What the ancients would have considered murder doesn't always match what modern people consider murder.
And what people nearly always mean by murder is "killing which I disapprove of strongly". Which is quite subjective. Which abortions? Which executions? Which wars? Does marketing cigarettes to young people count? Loaning a car with poor safety equipment? Feeding your husband all the bacon he wants?

Murder is a very complicated concept.

But you are being quite a jerk in this thread.
Tom

If you ask me the people who dictate who lives and dies by their interpretation of their chosen holy scripture are the jerks.

 

[Jeremiahcp]

When you step back and take a look, what is going on here in this thread, is that a number of people are trying to justify the killing of another human with their scripture. Making claims of when they have God's approval to take another life. I find that very disturbing.

 

[Nakosis]

If you ask me the people who dictate who lives and dies by their interpretation of their chosen holy scripture are the jerks.

What should they dictate their lives by?
And don't say science...