Aupmanyav
Be your own guru
True prophets always come holding a stone tablet.
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Altfish
Veteran Member
Is that how you spot them?
So, if I were to get myself a stone tablet....??
Tumah
Veteran Member
The stylus comes at no extra charge to save you from fingertip burn on the tablet's screen.
Beats? You mean beets? No, no, cookies are much better. Mr. falsey better get back in the kitchen if he wants to win over this crowd.
Animore,
Cogitation for a minute on this; If false teachers did not abound, would the world be in the degenerate condition that it is in today??? If religious teachers were preaching the truth of God's word this world would be getting better each day!!!
Consider the warning from the Bible, Acts 20:28,29, 2Timothy 4:2-5, 2Peter 2:1-3.
No matter how bad this world gets, there will always be that ONE religion that cannot be stopped, because they re blessed by The Almighty God, Jehovah, Ephesians 4:1-6. In he first century the true religion was called The Way, Acts 9:2, 19:9, 22:4, 24:22.
Cogitation for a minute on this; If false teachers did not abound, would the world be in the degenerate condition that it is in today??? If religious teachers were preaching the truth of God's word this world would be getting better each day!!!
Consider the warning from the Bible, Acts 20:28,29, 2Timothy 4:2-5, 2Peter 2:1-3.
No matter how bad this world gets, there will always be that ONE religion that cannot be stopped, because they re blessed by The Almighty God, Jehovah, Ephesians 4:1-6. In he first century the true religion was called The Way, Acts 9:2, 19:9, 22:4, 24:22.
Ever since the concept of a prophet was presented, we have had false prophets. By the boatload, as a matter of fact.
Many of them thrive, because it is a fairly stable career in most circunstances.
Many of them thrive, because it is a fairly stable career in most circunstances.
Rick O'Shez
Irishman bouncing off walls
jonathan180iq
Well-Known Member
What's the difference between a prophet and a lunatic?
Ok. I'll take the bait. Who, pray tell, is it?
If they make a religion, their a prophet. If they are ignored or put in an asylum, their a lunatic. If their "prophecies" come true? I think they get an editorial in the newspaper or a TV show.
jonathan180iq
Well-Known Member
So then, the line between lunatic and religious leader is just the number of followers that someone has? That says a lot about religious people, doesn't it?
Is there a difference between a prophecy and lucky guess?
Not always of course. But I would say the vast majority of the time, unfortunately.
No, I would have to disagree with that. At least in general. I consider myself religious and at least reasonably sane.
Excellent point. Prophecy tends to be read and interpreted in hindsight for the most part. A lady told me the other day that she knew Trump would win because a well known Pastor had prophesied that he would.
I replied to her that "well he had a 50/50 chance of getting it right." She was not amused and I'm pretty sure she thinks I am a heretic. So I think it goes something like this, If they are right ,it was a prophecy and if they get it wrong , it was just a guess. I really see no difference in modern so called prophets and the fortune tellers on the back page of the newspaper. And don't even get me started on televangelists.
jonathan180iq
Well-Known Member
You're about 90% sane, given your response here.
That wonderful lady kind of makes my point, doesn't she? She, and her fortune-telling pastor, were right, technically. Maybe not in detail, but at least in outcome. And that's really all that matters.Excellent point. Prophecy tends to be read and interpreted in hindsight for the most part. A lady told me the other day that she knew Trump would win because a well known Pastor had prophesied that he would.
His whole congregation, I assume, is now even more convinced than ever that he's a gifted leader of men, anointed by the power of the lord god almighty. And even as a believer yourself, you recognize the nonsense in it... It's a thin line that the pious must walk. I don't know how you do it.
The difference between people like you and people like me is that I regard your holiest figure in pretty much the same way that you regard televangelists... I don't mean that in a condescending way. As a reasonable and rational person, I know you recognize why people like me feel the way we do about people like that lady's pastor, and about similar characters throughout history.
Muffled
Jesus in me
I believe it is possible and likely. There is a messianic person in Israel but so far he has run under the radar.
Muffled
Jesus in me
I believe you shouldn't make assumptions about prophecy.
Well, that's good to know.
Fair enough. No offense taken.
As a "reasonable and rational" person myself, I'm sure I feel the same as you about this ladies Pastor. He's a joke and a charlatan, as is anyone who uses religion to control people and / or make a profit at the expense of them.
Muffled
Jesus in me
Not always of course. But I would say the vast majority of the time, unfortunately.
No, I would have to disagree with that. At least in general. I consider myself religious and at least reasonably sane.
Excellent point. Prophecy tends to be read and interpreted in hindsight for the most part. A lady told me the other day that she knew Trump would win because a well known Pastor had prophesied that he would.
I agree that a 50/50 chance does not provide enough specificity to assure that it is a prophecy and not just an educated guess. I believe it doesn't hurt to be skeptical but that doesn't mean there isn't any valid prophecy.
jonathan180iq
Well-Known Member
Sure. My question to those who believe in such things is, "What's the metric?"
How do you know the difference? How can you tell?
Oh, I agree. And I didn't mean to imply that there was never any valid prophecy. But if a person is not skeptical they will surely fall for some pretty wacky stuff, and sometimes with deadly results. Examples such as David Koresh and Jim Jones are two that come to mind.
kaoticprofit
Active Member
Here are the problems with identifying the 'false prophet'. The church is very good at self-demonization. So many 'false teachers' have labelled the whore of Babylon "the apostate church," giving Christians the false assumption he will emerge from WITHIN the church. However, NOT ONE verse of end-time prophecy implies that. Obviously, the false prophet does come from within a religion. So what religion will the false prophet come from????
Another problem the church has made for itself is that so many of them teach that the false prophet would be a religious leader of a "UNITED ONE WORLD RELIGION," and 'the anti-Christ' THE LEADER OF A UNITED ONE WORLD GOVERNMENT. None of that is supported by any prophecy in the bible.
So the single most relevant issue to address is, "what religion will the false prophet come from?" The biblical evidence all points to Islam. Here's a little evidence for you to consider about Islam.
""Captive silly women," have ISLAM written all over it.
2 Timothy 3:6 For of this sort are they which creep into houses, and lead captive silly women laden with sins, led away with divers lusts,...
The word 'silly' is better interpreted 'little.' Little in the sense of being insignificant. After all, Mid-East Muslims value their cattle more than their women and consider them as 'farmland'. Muslim women have been held captive to the oppressive religion of Islam since its inception.
Sura 33:50-51 "O prophet! We have made lawful to thee thy wives to whom thou hast paid their dowers; and those whom thy right hand possesses out of the prisoners of war whom Allah has assigned to thee ... this only for thee, and not for believers [at large]; we know what we have appointed for them as to their wives and the captives whom their right hand possess; - in order that there should be no difficulty for thee. And God is oft-forgiving, most merciful.
The rest of 2 Tim. 3 has Islam written all over it, not to mention ISIS runs the largest prostitution ring in the world.
The number of the verses in the Koran according to the scholars:
Ibn-i Abbas (ra): 6616,
Nafi (ra): 6217,
Shayba (ra): 6214,
Scholars of Egypt (ra): 6226,
Zamahshari (ra)
(the genius Eloquence Scholar of the Arabic language and literature);
6666.
Bediuzzaman, mujaddid (the reformer) of the13.century, also has the opinion of
6666 verses.
Isn't that a pretty good indication Islam is evil!
The right hand and forehead happen to have religious significance in Islam. But most people wouldn't know that, they're too busy looking at the popes funny hat.
A Muslim's method of worship and goal of world domination through jihad and demographics is also perfectly describe in ONE VERSE in Habakkuk.
Habakkuk says God would raise up the Babylonians in the last days. Not the Romans.
"They shall come all for violence: their faces shall sup up as the east wind, and they shall gather the captivity as the sand."
They shall come all for violence: (Islamic terrorism)
...their faces shall sup up as the east wind, (Muslim method of worship)
"The east wind is always associated with evil destructive wind." E. Swedenborg (1688-1772) said, "That wind, and especially the east wind, signifies nothing else than the dispersion of falsities and evils....
...and they shall gather the captivity as the sand. (World domination)
There's an anti-Christ monument that 'sits upon' God's Holy Place called the Dome of the Rock. Around the octagonal structure of the Dome of the Rock is a long classical Arabic inscription that says that God has no begotten son, thus denying that Jesus is the Son of God.
Around the octagonal structure of the Dome of the Rock is a long classical Arabic inscription that says that God has no begotten son, thus denying that Jesus is the Son of God.
Inscriptions on the octagonal structure of the Dome are anti-Christ. They say...
- There is no God but Allah.
- God has no son; He begetteth not.
- God taketh not unto Himself a son.
- God has no associate.
- Muhammad is the messenger of God.
- Allah will preside on Judgment Day.
"Who is a liar but he that denieth that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist, that denieth the Father and the Son."
Ever see the images that developed over time in the marble of the entrance to the Dome?
We believe that Jesus Christ takes away our sins and is the Rock of Ages and the chief cornerstone of the Churches foundation. Did you know that Muslim's bow toward a black rock in Mecca 5 times a day and believe it takes away their sins. This black rock is the 'cornerstone' of the Kaaba, and notice the two horns symbolic of the Sunni and Shia sects of Islam.
We put crosses on top of Churches. Islam has a star and crescent moon that looks like two horns. Allah is also known as a moon god in Arabic mythology.
Revelation 13:11 And I beheld another beast coming up out of the earth; and he had two horns like a lamb, (Shia and Sunni sects of Islam) and he spake as a dragon. (Morning star crescent moon) The two horned beast is symbolic of Islam and called Babylon the Great.
We believe Jesus is the "prophet lie unto Moses." Muslims believe that would be the false prophet Muhammad.
The name Lucifer in Hebrew is Heylel. It comes from the word 'halal' and it means, "The Morning Star."
1966 heylel hay-lale' from 1984 (in the sense of brightness); the morning-star:--Lucifer.
Hilal in Arabis means....
Web definition
Hilāl (هلال) is an Arabic word that means "crescent" or "new moon." It's an Islamic symbol!
Heylal, Halal ,and Hilal means... Lucifer... aka Satan... aka the devil... and in Christian literature actually means... The Morning Star and Crescent Moon.
The locust of Rev. 9 has long been associated with Muslims. That's where suicide bombers are found.
Revelation 9:16-17 And the number of the army of the horsemen were two hundred thousand thousand: and I heard the number of them. And thus I saw the horses in the vision, and them that sat on them, having breastplates of fire, and of jacinth, and brimstone: and the heads of the horses were as the heads of lions; and out of their mouths issued fire and smoke and brimstone.
Revelation 9 has long been associated with the Arabs and Muslims for several reasons. Locust are figurative of the Arabs in the Old Testament. Both the scorpions and locust have the Mid-East as their natural habitat, especially in Arabia. In Arabic the word "Arab" and "locust" sound similar.
"That Great City" of Revelation 17 is East Jerusalem. The harlot, whose cup is filled with the Islamic abominations of the earth, and bent on "domination by abomination," sits upon or "OCCUPIES" the Temple Mount. This 7 headed ten horned beast represents the Dome area being occupied by Islam and the Headquarters of an Islamic Caliphate, turning East Jerusalem into a figurative harlot. That area will authenticate the man of sin and false prophet.
"That Great City" of Revelation 18 is Mecca and the oil rich Arab world, it's palaces and Shrines/ mosque. etc.. If you read Revelation 18, you'll see that Islam and the Arab world is written all over it. Verse 13 may even imply Islam will be banned by countries who previously traded with the region. Mecca may be prophesied for destruction.
Revelation 10 all about the Koran.
Revelation 11 all about the Temple Mount area which is occupied by Islam, and the two witnesses preaching to Muslim's to "get out of Islam."
Revelation 15 is about people, esp. Muslims, who got out of Islam, and the seven last plagues. The sea of glass is figurative of Muslim's who have seen the light who now see and understood the truth. The vials are God's vengeance upon Islam and His last attempt to get Muslims out of Islam.
And I saw as it were a sea of glass mingled with fire: and them that had gotten the victory over the beast, and over his image, and over his mark, and over the number of his name, stand on the sea of glass, having the harps of God.
Beheading is an Islamic tradition and an atrocity committed by the beast mentioned in Revelation 20:4.
ISIS/ISIL is the Leviathan of Isaiah 24 and Job 41. This is what it says about ISIL, and this is what we know about ISIL.
Job 41:25 says about Leviathan...
"When he raiseth up himself, the mighty are afraid: by reason of breakings they purify themselves".
Why are the mighty afraid?
The mighty are afraid because jihadist hide among the general population. They aren't coming at you with brigades of people and equipment. They are spread across the earth and mixed in the general population. Jihadist of all kinds believe it's God's will for them to participate in jihad. Islam teaches that if a man does not participate in jihad, he is liable to lose his reward in paradise and is a hypocrite.
Job 41:25 says about Leviathan...
"When he raiseth up himself, the mighty are afraid: by reason of breakings they purify themselves".
...."by reason of breakings they purify themselves."
The second part of verse 25 is really strange and perfectly describes a Muslim's 'struggle' in jihad ...
The word ‘breakings’ no doubt implies terrorism. It means to break and ruin, and comes from a word meaning "to break, wreck, and to rend violence."
"Jihad is the Arabic word for "struggle" or "effort." In the context of the Holy Qur'an, jihad is a struggle or effort to strive "in the path of God" (22:78). Scholar James Turner Johnson says it this way: "the concept of jihad…fundamentally denotes striving or effort expended by the individual Muslim to walk in the path of God" (Johnson 19; Feldman 232-233). Jihad is the effort to purify oneself from within, to purify oneself of selfish appetites--the intention behind the action is important to the action itself. If this is the root meaning of jihad, when and how did it come to mean "holy war" or a "war to kill the infidels"? To answer that, we need to look at jihad in the Qur'an and the term's historical development."
Show me your evidence???
Another problem the church has made for itself is that so many of them teach that the false prophet would be a religious leader of a "UNITED ONE WORLD RELIGION," and 'the anti-Christ' THE LEADER OF A UNITED ONE WORLD GOVERNMENT. None of that is supported by any prophecy in the bible.
So the single most relevant issue to address is, "what religion will the false prophet come from?" The biblical evidence all points to Islam. Here's a little evidence for you to consider about Islam.
""Captive silly women," have ISLAM written all over it.
2 Timothy 3:6 For of this sort are they which creep into houses, and lead captive silly women laden with sins, led away with divers lusts,...
The word 'silly' is better interpreted 'little.' Little in the sense of being insignificant. After all, Mid-East Muslims value their cattle more than their women and consider them as 'farmland'. Muslim women have been held captive to the oppressive religion of Islam since its inception.
Sura 33:50-51 "O prophet! We have made lawful to thee thy wives to whom thou hast paid their dowers; and those whom thy right hand possesses out of the prisoners of war whom Allah has assigned to thee ... this only for thee, and not for believers [at large]; we know what we have appointed for them as to their wives and the captives whom their right hand possess; - in order that there should be no difficulty for thee. And God is oft-forgiving, most merciful.
The rest of 2 Tim. 3 has Islam written all over it, not to mention ISIS runs the largest prostitution ring in the world.
The number of the verses in the Koran according to the scholars:
Ibn-i Abbas (ra): 6616,
Nafi (ra): 6217,
Shayba (ra): 6214,
Scholars of Egypt (ra): 6226,
Zamahshari (ra)
(the genius Eloquence Scholar of the Arabic language and literature);
6666.
Bediuzzaman, mujaddid (the reformer) of the13.century, also has the opinion of
6666 verses.
Isn't that a pretty good indication Islam is evil!
The right hand and forehead happen to have religious significance in Islam. But most people wouldn't know that, they're too busy looking at the popes funny hat.
A Muslim's method of worship and goal of world domination through jihad and demographics is also perfectly describe in ONE VERSE in Habakkuk.
Habakkuk says God would raise up the Babylonians in the last days. Not the Romans.
"They shall come all for violence: their faces shall sup up as the east wind, and they shall gather the captivity as the sand."
They shall come all for violence: (Islamic terrorism)
...their faces shall sup up as the east wind, (Muslim method of worship)
"The east wind is always associated with evil destructive wind." E. Swedenborg (1688-1772) said, "That wind, and especially the east wind, signifies nothing else than the dispersion of falsities and evils....
...and they shall gather the captivity as the sand. (World domination)
There's an anti-Christ monument that 'sits upon' God's Holy Place called the Dome of the Rock. Around the octagonal structure of the Dome of the Rock is a long classical Arabic inscription that says that God has no begotten son, thus denying that Jesus is the Son of God.
Around the octagonal structure of the Dome of the Rock is a long classical Arabic inscription that says that God has no begotten son, thus denying that Jesus is the Son of God.
Inscriptions on the octagonal structure of the Dome are anti-Christ. They say...
- There is no God but Allah.
- God has no son; He begetteth not.
- God taketh not unto Himself a son.
- God has no associate.
- Muhammad is the messenger of God.
- Allah will preside on Judgment Day.
"Who is a liar but he that denieth that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist, that denieth the Father and the Son."
Ever see the images that developed over time in the marble of the entrance to the Dome?
We believe that Jesus Christ takes away our sins and is the Rock of Ages and the chief cornerstone of the Churches foundation. Did you know that Muslim's bow toward a black rock in Mecca 5 times a day and believe it takes away their sins. This black rock is the 'cornerstone' of the Kaaba, and notice the two horns symbolic of the Sunni and Shia sects of Islam.
We put crosses on top of Churches. Islam has a star and crescent moon that looks like two horns. Allah is also known as a moon god in Arabic mythology.
Revelation 13:11 And I beheld another beast coming up out of the earth; and he had two horns like a lamb, (Shia and Sunni sects of Islam) and he spake as a dragon. (Morning star crescent moon) The two horned beast is symbolic of Islam and called Babylon the Great.
We believe Jesus is the "prophet lie unto Moses." Muslims believe that would be the false prophet Muhammad.
The name Lucifer in Hebrew is Heylel. It comes from the word 'halal' and it means, "The Morning Star."
1966 heylel hay-lale' from 1984 (in the sense of brightness); the morning-star:--Lucifer.
Hilal in Arabis means....
Web definition
Hilāl (هلال) is an Arabic word that means "crescent" or "new moon." It's an Islamic symbol!
Heylal, Halal ,and Hilal means... Lucifer... aka Satan... aka the devil... and in Christian literature actually means... The Morning Star and Crescent Moon.
The locust of Rev. 9 has long been associated with Muslims. That's where suicide bombers are found.
Revelation 9:16-17 And the number of the army of the horsemen were two hundred thousand thousand: and I heard the number of them. And thus I saw the horses in the vision, and them that sat on them, having breastplates of fire, and of jacinth, and brimstone: and the heads of the horses were as the heads of lions; and out of their mouths issued fire and smoke and brimstone.
Revelation 9 has long been associated with the Arabs and Muslims for several reasons. Locust are figurative of the Arabs in the Old Testament. Both the scorpions and locust have the Mid-East as their natural habitat, especially in Arabia. In Arabic the word "Arab" and "locust" sound similar.
"That Great City" of Revelation 17 is East Jerusalem. The harlot, whose cup is filled with the Islamic abominations of the earth, and bent on "domination by abomination," sits upon or "OCCUPIES" the Temple Mount. This 7 headed ten horned beast represents the Dome area being occupied by Islam and the Headquarters of an Islamic Caliphate, turning East Jerusalem into a figurative harlot. That area will authenticate the man of sin and false prophet.
"That Great City" of Revelation 18 is Mecca and the oil rich Arab world, it's palaces and Shrines/ mosque. etc.. If you read Revelation 18, you'll see that Islam and the Arab world is written all over it. Verse 13 may even imply Islam will be banned by countries who previously traded with the region. Mecca may be prophesied for destruction.
Revelation 10 all about the Koran.
Revelation 11 all about the Temple Mount area which is occupied by Islam, and the two witnesses preaching to Muslim's to "get out of Islam."
Revelation 15 is about people, esp. Muslims, who got out of Islam, and the seven last plagues. The sea of glass is figurative of Muslim's who have seen the light who now see and understood the truth. The vials are God's vengeance upon Islam and His last attempt to get Muslims out of Islam.
And I saw as it were a sea of glass mingled with fire: and them that had gotten the victory over the beast, and over his image, and over his mark, and over the number of his name, stand on the sea of glass, having the harps of God.
Beheading is an Islamic tradition and an atrocity committed by the beast mentioned in Revelation 20:4.
ISIS/ISIL is the Leviathan of Isaiah 24 and Job 41. This is what it says about ISIL, and this is what we know about ISIL.
Job 41:25 says about Leviathan...
"When he raiseth up himself, the mighty are afraid: by reason of breakings they purify themselves".
Why are the mighty afraid?
The mighty are afraid because jihadist hide among the general population. They aren't coming at you with brigades of people and equipment. They are spread across the earth and mixed in the general population. Jihadist of all kinds believe it's God's will for them to participate in jihad. Islam teaches that if a man does not participate in jihad, he is liable to lose his reward in paradise and is a hypocrite.
Job 41:25 says about Leviathan...
"When he raiseth up himself, the mighty are afraid: by reason of breakings they purify themselves".
...."by reason of breakings they purify themselves."
The second part of verse 25 is really strange and perfectly describes a Muslim's 'struggle' in jihad ...
The word ‘breakings’ no doubt implies terrorism. It means to break and ruin, and comes from a word meaning "to break, wreck, and to rend violence."
"Jihad is the Arabic word for "struggle" or "effort." In the context of the Holy Qur'an, jihad is a struggle or effort to strive "in the path of God" (22:78). Scholar James Turner Johnson says it this way: "the concept of jihad…fundamentally denotes striving or effort expended by the individual Muslim to walk in the path of God" (Johnson 19; Feldman 232-233). Jihad is the effort to purify oneself from within, to purify oneself of selfish appetites--the intention behind the action is important to the action itself. If this is the root meaning of jihad, when and how did it come to mean "holy war" or a "war to kill the infidels"? To answer that, we need to look at jihad in the Qur'an and the term's historical development."
Show me your evidence???
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