Does God create evil?

[URAVIP2ME]

I'm sorry but it makes no sense whatever to speak of God using evil to rid the world of evil. That simply compounds and restates the problem, which is that a supposedly good God creates, allows and uses suffering. Nonsensical!

Doesn't even the world use capital punishment for some crimes?

How does God use suffering?

Isn't Satan the 'god of this world' according to 2nd Cor 4v4, 1st John 5v19;
Rev 12v12 ?

Who dominates man to his injury? Ecc 8v9

Who is at the wrong place wrong time? Ecc 9v11; Luke 13vs4,5

Since Satan is this world's god, then wouldn't this world's system of things reflect its demon god?

In Scripture evil is not always synonymous with wrongdoing.
Evil in Scripture is used in the form of 'calamity' by God against the wicked and only the wicked. -Psalm 92v7.

 

[URAVIP2ME]

I see no problem at all with evil existing before God created the earth; but it must still be the case that God created evil. God is the omnipotent creator of everything existent, and his causal abilities are not limited to the material world.

Isaiah 45v17 says: God created evil.
But evil in Scripture is not necessarily as we define evil.
Evil in Scripture can be used as calamity against the wicked.
Such as calamity for those that Jesus executes at Armageddon.
-Rev. 19vs11,14,15; Isaiah 11v4.

 

[AntEmpire]

There is a difference between bad deeds and an execution.
[capital punishment]
When the situation was beyond reform, people left God no choice but that the wicked be a ransom for the upright ones. Otherwise, the righteous would have been ruined with the wicked. -Proverbs 21v18; 10v30

Pharaoh was warned beforehand, Pharaoh chose to disobey God and suffered the bad consequences of his actions.

Noah warned the people beforehand [2nd Peter 2v5] They chose to disobey God's warning.

That is why even today both the righteous and wicked are being warned.
[Ezekiel 3vs18-21]. Warned before Jesus takes the action described at Isaiah 11v4 and Rev. 19 vs11,14,15.

I was just told by god you need to sell everything and take your family to iles de Los off the african coast by the end of the month or the entire world will be destroyed.


I'd be willing to bet 4.5 billion dollars that i dont have that you won't do it. :L hmmm

 

[JustWondering]

There is a difference between bad deeds and an execution.
[capital punishment]
When the situation was beyond reform, people left God no choice but that the wicked be a ransom for the upright ones. Otherwise, the righteous would have been ruined with the wicked. -Proverbs 21v18; 10v30

Pharaoh was warned beforehand, Pharaoh chose to disobey God and suffered the bad consequences of his actions.

Noah warned the people beforehand [2nd Peter 2v5] They chose to disobey God's warning.

That is why even today both the righteous and wicked are being warned.
[Ezekiel 3vs18-21]. Warned before Jesus takes the action described at Isaiah 11v4 and Rev. 19 vs11,14,15.

Exactly! The god of the bible is a saddistic and violent tyrant.

 

[cottage]

Doesn't even the world use capital punishment for some crimes?

And how does that justify the existence of evil?

How does God use suffering?

So what are you saying - that evil is somehow good? That's a contradiction.

In Scripture evil is not always synonymous with wrongdoing.
Evil in Scripture is used in the form of 'calamity' by God against the wicked and only the wicked. -Psalm 92v7.

This simply re-states the problem. And it doesn't make sense to say evil is not always wrong. By defintion, if a thing is evil it is morally wrong, bad, harmful and unnecessary.

 

[cottage]

Isaiah 45v17 says: God created evil.
But evil in Scripture is not necessarily as we define evil.
Evil in Scripture can be used as calamity against the wicked.
Such as calamity for those that Jesus executes at Armageddon.
-Rev. 19vs11,14,15; Isaiah 11v4.

'Evil used against the wicked.' Can you not see the problem with that statement?

Evil is suffering, and suffering only exists because God caused it to exist (Isaiah: 'I create evil'). So God punishes the wicked when it was he himself who created wickedness! And evil cannot be redefined or interpreted differently because in all cases it means a sentient being suffers. Therefore God created suffering.

 

[URAVIP2ME]

God did not force anyone to wickedness.
James [1vs13-15] each is drawn out by 'his own' desire.
People corrupt themselves. -Deut 30v19; 32v5

Suffering according to Scripture is only temporary.
For the wicked it will be at their destruction. -Psalm 92v7
For the rest, starting with Jesus 1000-year reign over earth, it will mean:
No more sickness.-Isaiah 33v24
No more war. -Psalm 46v9; Micah 4vs3,4
No more death. -Rev 21vs4,5; 1st Cor 15v26; Isaiah 25vs6-8

Time has allowed for us to be born.
Time has allowed all in heaven and earth to see man can Not successfully direct his step,
So he needs God to step in.
-Jeremiah 10v23; 17v9
Man, not God, has dominated man to his harm and injury. -Ecc 8v9

If all on earth lived by the Golden Rule how much suffering on earth would there be?

 

[URAVIP2ME]

So what are you saying - that evil is somehow good? That's a contradiction.

I'm saying 'in Scripture' evil is not always synonymous with wrongdoing as we use the word today.

Is capital punishment always a contradiction?

Capital punishment is an evil that some call a necessary evil because some crimes are so heinous that there is no other solution.

 

[Diogenes_the_cynic]

I believe that the living universe is God. I believe that the stars all work in tandem as sort of a neurological network and that this neurological network basically amounts to what God is. I think we can reach this understanding through some sort of essence that is connected, but alienated from this network at the same time.

I think humans are likely the center of the universe that we are able to percieve and from other planets/through animals eyes, it looks completely different. I think the purpose of the evil on this earth is to highlight "God" as sort of the underlying current that allows us to see it all without being swept up in the earth's cycle of destruction and pain (animals eat other animals, the human body ages, etc).

So I think all sorts of "atmans" if you will, come here to learn this truth, then move on. Or perhaps this is the ultimate?

 

[Diogenes_the_cynic]

And by the ultimate, I mean more the pathway to the ultimate, possibly.

After all, doesn't it seem weird to you all that we can even manipulate the universe through reason? That could be because we're connected to God's power. Evil could be a temptation to misuse or abuse this power because of what the world is.

 

[Diogenes_the_cynic]

I believe this earth is a huge challenge probably, compared to other planets. That's why the population keeps growing, because some mistake has made it too easy for entities to get stuck here.

"Atmans" come here and they lose touch with themselves on purpose in order to gain insight into sort of an expanded atman. Loving with the entire universe in a sense.

Out of it completely after that.

 

[JustWondering]

God did not force anyone to wickedness.

Really? Then why doesn't god step in to set the record straight when men kill each other over religion? That would put a stop to much unnecessary suffering and evil right there.

Desperate times can lead people to do nasty things or open them to manipulation by people with evil intent. That being said, why did god stick us on a world with limited resources we end up contending over?

Reality does not support the existance of a loving and caring creator god.

 

[cottage]

I'm saying 'in Scripture' evil is not always synonymous with wrongdoing as we use the word today.

There is no distinction to be made: evil is always synomymous with suffering.

Is capital punishment always a contradiction?

Yes, of course it is - if God is the omni-benevolent Being.

Capital punishment is an evil that some call a necessary evil because some crimes are so heinous that there is no other solution.

'Some crimes are so heinous.' Again, this is simply restating the problem, which is that evil exists in the presence of a supposedly omni-benevolent and omnipotent God. Evil exists because God causes/allows its existence - to say the opposite implies a direct contradiction.

 

[atanu]

When I try to untangle the logic of the Christian God I picture a dad holding his sons fist and smacking him in the face with it whenever he does anything disobedient "why are you hitting yourself? why are you hitting yourself?"

Yes. But I think that is not the problem with scripture anywhere. The problem is with our natural inclination to apply scripture to others first. IMO, Hinduism has similar problem with the concept of varna - the colour that veils each individual soul. This concept tends to degrade into judging class of others forgetting one's own class.

Mind is the Lord that burns up the wrong doers. No one else does it from outside. Mind is the Lord. And the source of the Mind is the Lord of the Lord.

...

 

[cottage]

God did not force anyone to wickedness.
James [1vs13-15] each is drawn out by 'his own' desire.
People corrupt themselves. -Deut 30v19; 32v5

Suffering according to Scripture is only temporary.
For the wicked it will be at their destruction. -Psalm 92v7
For the rest, starting with Jesus 1000-year reign over earth, it will mean:
No more sickness.-Isaiah 33v24
No more war. -Psalm 46v9; Micah 4vs3,4
No more death. -Rev 21vs4,5; 1st Cor 15v26; Isaiah 25vs6-8

Time has allowed for us to be born.
Time has allowed all in heaven and earth to see man can Not successfully direct his step,
So he needs God to step in.
-Jeremiah 10v23; 17v9
Man, not God, has dominated man to his harm and injury. -Ecc 8v9

If all on earth lived by the Golden Rule how much suffering on earth would there be?

"Time has allowed all in heaven and earth to see man can Not successfully direct his step,
So he needs God to step in.
-Jeremiah 10v23; 17v9"

That contradicts just about everything else that you've quoted above! It informs us very clearly that man is imperfect and error-prone.



'Man, not God, has dominated man to his harm and injury'. -Ecc 8v9

So why didn't God step in?



'For the wicked it will be at their destruction. -Psalm 92v7'

God failed in what he created and speaks of destroying his own handiwork



'People corrupt themselves. -Deut 30v19; 32v5'

And self-evidently it occurs by God's will, since the contrary is impossible.



'Suffering according to Scripture is only temporary.'

That doesn't excuse or justify the suffering. And even God cannot undo what is done or re-write history.



'If all on earth lived by the Golden Rule how much suffering on earth would there be?'

If there was a morally good God how much suffering on earth could there logically be?

 

[URAVIP2ME]

Really? Then why doesn't god step in to set the record straight when men kill each other over religion? That would put a stop to much unnecessary suffering and evil right there.
Desperate times can lead people to do nasty things or open them to manipulation by people with evil intent. That being said, why did god stick us on a world with limited resources we end up contending over?
Reality does not support the existance of a loving and caring creator god.

Many people want to know why God doesn't step in......

First, if 'imperfect' Adam and Eve would have never had children we simply would not be here.

God's purpose for the earth was for mankind to multiply and fill the earth.
Not overpopulate but 'fill' the earth.

Since Adam and Eve had all of their children after becoming humanly imperfect because of sin [disobedience], then all they could pass down to us is human imperfection.

This does not mean God has abandoned his purpose for the earth.
Rather it means we all have choices of heart and mind.
We can all decide if we would like to live under the Golden Rule or not.

If we could stop sinning we would not die.
Since we can not stop we die.
God made provision though Jesus that one's death could only be temporary and suffering would also be temporary.

Secondly, Satan challenged that touch our bone and flesh [health]
and we would not be faithful, keep integrity to God. -Job 2vs4,5.
Jesus and Job proved Satan a liar and so can we.

So what we see is temporary.
What is in store will be permanent.
Meaning God will have Jesus step in, so to speak,
and reverse this temporary badness.
-Rev 21vs3,4

We are in a time for spiritual happenings.
During Jesus coming 1000-year reign over earth,
will be the time for physical happenings.
-Rev 22v2

 

[URAVIP2ME]

'If all on earth lived by the Golden Rule how much suffering on earth would there be?'
If there was a morally good God how much suffering on earth could there logically be?

God forces no one to listen and obey him.
Where does God say to break the Golden Rule ? Lev. 19 vs18,32,33
Where in Scripture does it say to break Jesus new commandment of Christ-like love ? -John 13vs34,35

 

[Flankerl]

God did not create evil because evil does not exist. It has to be made as man misuses his freewill and behaves in a non-good way, which would be his natural. Everything God has created, behold, it was good. The expression is mentioned seven times only in the first chapter of Genesis. Even man himself, God created him straight, but he got bored of doing good and evil was the result. Therefore, evil is only the absence of good. (Eccl. 7:29)

Did you forget about Yeshayahu 45:7?
7 I form the light, and create darkness; I make peace, and create evil; I am the LORD, that doeth all these things.
ז יוֹצֵר אוֹר וּבוֹרֵא חֹשֶׁךְ, עֹשֶׂה שָׁלוֹם וּבוֹרֵא רָע; אֲנִי יְהוָה, עֹשֶׂה כָל-אֵלֶּה.

 

[Harmonious]

Did you forget about Yeshayahu 45:7?
7 I form the light, and create darkness; I make peace, and create evil; I am the LORD, that doeth all these things.
ז יוֹצֵר אוֹר וּבוֹרֵא חֹשֶׁךְ, עֹשֶׂה שָׁלוֹם וּבוֹרֵא רָע; אֲנִי יְהוָה, עֹשֶׂה כָל-אֵלֶּה.

Nicely said.

 

[URAVIP2ME]

Did you forget about Yeshayahu 45:7?
7 I form the light, and create darkness; I make peace, and create evil; I am the LORD, that doeth all these things.
ז יוֹצֵר אוֹר וּבוֹרֵא חֹשֶׁךְ, עֹשֶׂה שָׁלוֹם וּבוֹרֵא רָע; אֲנִי יְהוָה, עֹשֶׂה כָל-אֵלֶּה.

....and evil in Scripture is not always synonymous with wrongdoing.

The Flood was a calamity for justice sake.
Yeshayahu 11v4 shows a future evil befalling the wicked in the form of calamity.