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Does God directly share knowledge/information with you?

serp777

Well-Known Member
This is mostly for people of the Abrahamic faiths. I've heard many people saying that God gives them certain "feelings" or particular information, which conveys to them what morality they should subscribe to, the attributes of God, and generally how to act and behave.

I am always very skeptical of people who claim they basically have a hotline to God. For starters how do these people know that its God? They say that they know its God because they feel its correct. It sounds like circular reasoning to me because how can they assume their feelings are correct. For all these people know it could be the devil manipulating them and their feelings, or an advanced alien race messing with their heads. Or it could just be a delusion/fantasy created by their brains due to a genetic predisposition. I guess my real question is how these religious people can know that they are getting accurate information from the real God.
 

Glaurung

Denizen of Niflheim
This is mostly for people of the Abrahamic faiths. I've heard many people saying that God gives them certain "feelings" or particular information, which conveys to them what morality they should subscribe to, the attributes of God, and generally how to act and behave
As far as the moral law is prescribed the Christian already has everything they need to know available to them. The Scriptures and the teachings of the Chruch. Personal feelings are in no way a mature method of spiritual discernment. The emphasis on personal feelings seems to be largely a phenomenon of American Evangelical Protestantism. It's quite unfair to suggest that such thinking is at all representative of the Christian tradition. Especially that of Catholic and Orthodox varieties.
 

DawudTalut

Peace be upon you.
This is mostly for people of the Abrahamic faiths. I've heard many people saying that God gives them certain "feelings" or particular information, which conveys to them what morality they should subscribe to, the attributes of God, and generally how to act and behave.................. how these religious people can know that they are getting accurate information from the real God.
Peace be on you.
After humble prayers, a servant of God who seeks right path for an issue, gets mix or all of :
clear bliss, impacted feeling, chain of events in a direction, special dreams, words from God, awe etc.
1=Many people are present in Ahmadiyya Muslim Community, when they prayed to God for guidance, they were well guided by God:
https://www.alislam.org/friday-sermon/2011-04-29.html

2=My maternal grandfather prayed for 40 days and he was shown the truth about Community.

3=Times ago, door was knocked, then I was at a dorm, a fellow student came and began to talk about religion [about Ahmadiyya-Muslims], I knew he was a neutral kind of person...At that time I had some books about faith, and asked him if he like to have. He said yes. I wrapped all of them in a bag........After a while a strong impact fell on my heart and piercing thought from outside came that the visitor has plan to get these precious books to destroy them. ...So during the talk, I told him about this experience politely........ His face changed color and he left.
 

Windwalker

Veteran Member
Premium Member
This is mostly for people of the Abrahamic faiths. I've heard many people saying that God gives them certain "feelings" or particular information, which conveys to them what morality they should subscribe to, the attributes of God, and generally how to act and behave.
This is an interesting topic. I think there are degrees to which one understands what this means that has to be taken into account. In principle when someone says God speaks to them, that's not invalid. That can be as you cite a "certain feeling." That can be a certain clarity of thought, a strong intuition, a sense of "knowing" with the heart, and so forth. But when someone interprets this as a dictation of absolute authority this is where things can start becoming a little problematic, delusional thinking, as you point out.

I am always very skeptical of people who claim they basically have a hotline to God.
The way this is phrased as a "hotline to God" suggests that God is seen as a wholly external entity who sends memos down to you through a pneumatic tube like pulling up to the drive through of a bank. In how I would speak of it would be in a more valid sense that you are simply in touch with the divine in yourself, and it allows you to see things in a certain higher perspective than what you normally rely on in trying to figure crap out with the analytical mind alone. Sometimes we do better not relying on our own understanding we can grasp with the mind, but rather simply allowing insight to "come up" to us from deep within us. That phenomenon is often taken as a type of "magic" by people, or in the mythic sense, "God speaking to them".

For starters how do these people know that its God?
If it is a valid internal sense, that's like asking how someone knows they are in love with somebody. "How do you really know you love her? It could just be your hormones telling you it's love because you want to get laid." That's a valid question, but it is really a matter of a one's own maturity to be able to know in themselves the difference between the two. No external authority or measuring stick or test can confirm that to the person. It has to do with their own degree of self-awareness. It has to do with their own interior confidence in knowing themselves. Like someone who is matured can more easily recognize the difference between lust and love in themselves, it's the same thing when it comes to God "speaking" to them.

To run off half-cocked claiming you got a "special message", is like the teenager who feels his hormones kicking in imaging he has been sent by destiny his future wife in the first girl he meets. It's a very black and white interpretation and understanding which understands nothing of the subtle and nuanced nature of reality.

They say that they know its God because they feel its correct. It sounds like circular reasoning to me because how can they assume their feelings are correct.
I like the analogy of relating this to love. Just exchange the word love for God, and it kind of answers itself in how it works.

For all these people know it could be the devil manipulating them and their feelings, or an advanced alien race messing with their heads.
This is where maturity, self-awareness, life experience, self confidence, and all that kicks in. It's the same thing in knowing yourself, learning how to trust how you know things in anything else you do in life. The only difference is that is an aspect of ourselves many are simply unaware of, and hence inexperienced with. How do you know? Learn to know that part of yourself and how to utilize and integrate it into how you function in life. That's how.

Or it could just be a delusion/fantasy created by their brains due to a genetic predisposition.
The delusion or fantasy part of it is not necessarily in the fact of it, but in the interpretation or translation of the experience itself. The experience can be entirely valid, but how the mind translates it could be in fact problematic, even dangerous if they have wiring-problems between their subconscious and conscious minds. It's like when you tell someone they should practice meditation. They really need to able to deal with going into those places. It's the same with the divine mind, the emergent subconscious to give it an interesting term.

I guess my real question is how these religious people can know that they are getting accurate information from the real God.
"Accurate" is an interesting criteria to impose upon it. Isn't it like asking you sister who says she's fallen in love with someone, "How can you be sure your feelings are accurate"? :)
 

Quintessence

Consults with Trees
Staff member
Premium Member
I guess my real question is how these religious people can know that they are getting accurate information from the real God.

Like Windwalker, I find the use of the word "accurate" here to be a strange choice. But setting that aside, it comes down to some pretty basic things that apply universally to every instance of a human thinking they know anything, whether it is from the gods or not:

  • Experience. The more we observe the world around us, the more data we have to sort into patterns or arrange into schemas. Once we have a set of schemas built up - which are basically mental maps constructed by personal observation and culture - new incoming data gets interpreted based on those maps and is often sorted on reflex. Put another way, the worldview one has impacts how one interprets incoming information and often taken for granted.
    • For example, when you walk into a restaurant, you take for granted that it is indeed a restaurant. "Restaurant" is a schema you've developed through personal observation and culture, and if a location you find yourself in matches that schema, you call it "restaurant" without really thinking about it. Knowing something comes from the gods works the same way at its root level.
  • Trust. In order to navigate life and the environment at all in any capacity, a creature has to trust in its own faculties. This is perhaps more fundamental than experience: trust in oneself. Trusting oneself to categorize things into schemas in a way that works for a given situation, and trusting oneself to recategorize if necessary for a particular need.
There's also this thing that humans like to call "reason," but honestly... that is always secondary to these two. "Reason" is grounded in both of the above, and emerges from trusting in one's observations and building schemas based on experience.
 

Kelly of the Phoenix

Well-Known Member
It's very rare for me to hear or see anything outside of dreams and even those are rare. For me, it's more of a "Spider-sense" type deal or feeling the Force or whatever. It works best as long as I'm not tired, sick, upset, etc. Even if someone can obtain divine knowledge, if the receptacle is busted, the message is going to get screwed over.

It feels like I am in an underwater room with lots of doors, with the doors being paths through destiny. I cannot see which doors are open. I can only feel the movement of the water, the reduced resistance, through the open door. Even if I try to swim for the other doors because I don't like the open one, fate will work itself out that I end up in the open door anyway because that's where the current is taking me.
 

Windwalker

Veteran Member
Premium Member
It feels like I am in an underwater room with lots of doors, with the doors being paths through destiny. I cannot see which doors are open. I can only feel the movement of the water, the reduced resistance, through the open door. Even if I try to swim for the other doors because I don't like the open one, fate will work itself out that I end up in the open door anyway because that's where the current is taking me.
I like the analogy. I was going to talk about it as a sense of "flow". That fits with your analogy well.
 

idav

Being
Premium Member
A connection to God isn't necessarily like talking to some being in the sky. Oneness involves a transformation from the inside that frees a person from the weight of the world allowing more power and freedom to choose even agaisnt the greatest of obstacles.
 

savagewind

Veteran Member
Premium Member
I guess my real question is how these religious people can know that they are getting accurate information from the real God.

The word from indicates points in space or points in time. I think God comes from neither. God IS. I agree with those others who say that to hear God a person must listen to within his self. I think that to know about what you are hearing you should listen to hear the messages, the tone of the messages and the silence.

I think a person can not hear God right without knowledge, experience and love.
 

Windwalker

Veteran Member
Premium Member
I think a person can not hear God right without knowledge, experience and love.
I like that. We cannot hear God without love. That's actually very true. I could say a lot about this. If you think about it, if we do not love, we are in a state of self-contraction. If we are in a state of self-contraction, we cannot see or participate in what is surrounding us, and flowing within us. To hear God, you simply open yourself. When you are opened, you allow love to be known. And to know Love is to know God, the heart of God, the mind of God, the will of God. All the rest is just simply religious window-dressings.
 

Acim

Revelation all the time
This is mostly for people of the Abrahamic faiths. I've heard many people saying that God gives them certain "feelings" or particular information, which conveys to them what morality they should subscribe to, the attributes of God, and generally how to act and behave.

I am always very skeptical of people who claim they basically have a hotline to God.

I used to be very skeptical of such people. I am no more. I will sometimes entertain skepticism, but not to level of inherent doubt.

For starters how do these people know that its God?

I connect with what I self identify as Spirit. I understand it as Holy Spirit. I've had it suggested to me (numerous times, from earthly beings) that I connect with specific spirits (i.e. Jesus, or passed relative). I'm not opposed to that, but not how I filter the connection at work. That conjures up too much 'ego' for me.

I'm now in a place where I'm skeptical of anyone claiming they cannot receive messages from Divine / Spirit. If I were meeting one on one with anyone reading this, I imagine whatever sort of dialogue there is to have would possibly be different than how I convey this in writing, on open forum. Here in this thread, I see the connection I am conveying as something many could be highly skeptical of. This, I think, would be first time on RF I've brought it up. I usually don't feel a need to bring it up, and most that know me are likely clueless about it. I really do generally assume everyone does have the connection in own way.

But from my theological understanding, it is not God that I have inner dialogue with. I do have inner connection with God (Creator) and for most part I see that as self evident, or plainly obvious. Yet, I don't see Creator God as relying on communication devices / language that are indirect or have questionable understandings of meaning. I also don't see Creator God as remotely considering the notion that I, at times, identify with a self that sees God as separate from me.

Also from my theological understanding, I see Holy Spirit as Voice of God, that can utilize every conceivable type of communication to share information with Creation. I could elaborate on this, but am essentially just making clear that it is not God Creator that I have inner dialogues with, while I do identify it as Holy Spirit. And again, wish to reiterate, that I'm skeptical of any claims that suggest this is not available to anyone. I truly assume everyone does have this connection in whatever way currently makes sense for them.

They say that they know its God because they feel its correct. It sounds like circular reasoning to me because how can they assume their feelings are correct. For all these people know it could be the devil manipulating them and their feelings, or an advanced alien race messing with their heads. Or it could just be a delusion/fantasy created by their brains due to a genetic predisposition. I guess my real question is how these religious people can know that they are getting accurate information from the real God.

I'm around year 9 of having the connection in way I do. Prior to that, I had experience that was even more meaningful, to me, than the inner dialogue. I'm glad, in this lifetime, I've got to experience both. I was at one point agnostic, and have for at least 3 decades been analytical thinker that holds philosophy with high regards. I say all this because when I first experienced inner dialogue (about 9 years ago), it wasn't me naively accepting it. I had many instances of second guessing 'who' was communicating with me. What could this lead to? What might I be asked, or urged to do? How do I know this isn't just fantasy/delusion? Here on open forum, I don't believe I'm able to provide answers that would work a) for everyone and b) overcome extreme scrutiny. I personally don't see any ideology that could overcome extreme scrutiny or relentless contentiousness. My dialogues don't generally work at level of "overcoming human problems so that the world knows." I did actually have desire to go down that path at one time, to write what was being received with intention to share it. I can't say I'll never do that, but I really do see things set up now (more than say 20 years ago) where answers for overcoming all possible human problems are known to us or accessible in finding a path that would lead to that knowledge.

So, my communications are based primarily on my daily life, and what works. What today (or this moment) is in my best interest? Or what in a current situation (i.e. relationship) am I missing - i.e. experiencing anger at someone, not sure why, feel justified in it, but perhaps I'm missing a perspective that would help put not just my emotions but the situation in more reasonable perspective.

A few things that I've picked up along the way that I'm compelled to share in a post such as this is:
  • Spirit will speak with a pronoun of "we" to me. Again, in year 1, I questioned who is "we." Not just one time questioned this and accepted whatever that one time said was the answer. While the answer wasn't entirely consistent in a word for word fashion, it was consistent in principle. The "we" is Holy Spirit, as that is an "us" Spirit. What became for me a profound realization is that "we" includes me. That from Spirit's perspective, the notion of "I am talking to my Self" makes abundant sense. From the scrutinizing (ego) perspective that, I think, gets relegated to something along lines of, "see, I knew it was just a delusional thing." But as much of a criticism as that is, I find it incredibly shortsighted, and easy to pick apart for what it is attempting to convey, yet falling short on. And not really able to cease communication. Also not able to get over delusions of how all communication works that is indirect, or between selves that believe they are inherently disconnected. Kind of feel like writing walk of text on this point, but I won't. Just wish to convey that this isn't something I took with grain of salt in what was conveyed, and do still see 'me' as aspect of Holy Spirit as profound. But admittedly, over the years, I have taken that understanding for granted at times.
  • I believe all of my dialogues have been initiated by me. There are times where a natural moment of silence occurs in any given situation and I feel and urge for inner communication as if I'm not initiating a dialogue. Early on (years ago), I took that as a sign that I have to listen to something that is needing to be conveyed to me. Not so much anymore, and so I'm simply conveying that 95% of the time (possibly as much as 100%), I feel all communication I receive from Spirit is initiated by me.
  • Related to the previous point, the communication is always based on my desire. I could say "based on my needs" but I routinely use desire in place of the word need, and really try to be consistent with that, in all my communication.
  • There are moments where I initiate communication and I get silence or blank slate. It's rare, but it occurs. I don't know if there is way to explain this in way that I feel would consistently cover that type of experience. I would estimate this occurs about 2% of the time, or less.
  • I consistently have feeling that whatever I am asking about is not, even a little bit, deemed bothersome to Spirit. The amount of patience and kindness in what I may ask about is not something I'm used to from worldly communications. I could ask the same question 5 times and it not be perceived as annoying. If anything, I'm likely to filter that as me being intentionally annoying (toward Spirit) and yet, never does Spirit convey that to me. It is therefore like 'best friend' who is willing to address any conceivable concern about any conceivable topic I may have question about or seek another perspective about, leading to greater understanding.
  • Spirit suggests things to me. Never commands / demands. Some things will be communicated as "strongly suggest" and I sit up and take notice if that's being communicated. I pay a bit more attention to what's being suggested. There has never been a situation (yet) where Spirit suggested I do something that I understood would harm another person. I kind of see the scrutinizing perspective toward inner dialogue having major issues around the idea of harm, and is something I feel I could speak to for awhile, but just assume make clear that I've never received message to go do harm to a person or thing.
  • I can disagree with or disobey suggestions. I don't routinely do this, but I have and Spirit isn't slighted by that, even a little bit. I filter this as really only impacts me, and Spirit is there for best interests. I'm sometimes desiring to go with possible / better interest instead of 'best' and Spirit is what I would call 'perfectly fine' with path I choose. Though some paths I may choose would be met with "strongly suggest" otherwise, and well, you can imagine sometimes I lead my own self down roads where things don't work out, IMO, as 'perfectly fine.' Because I believe Spirit has knowledge of 'end game' or path beyond today, I think Spirit has far different perspective on things when I'm imagining myself as having chosen to go down path where I've really messed up.
  • Finally, and perhaps I ought to have started with this, I find the Guidance consistently works. I have noticed a few exceptions where what Spirt suggested is not exactly how it was stated things would go. Thus erroneous. Challenging to explain that away, but not so challenging to put that into perspective of how consistent Spirit has been with regards to Guidance compared to all other guidance I've ever received. I'd say Spirit is batting around .980, while next best form of guidance I'm familiar with would probably be, at best, batting .333. But given that I've been at this for 9 years, whatever other forms there may be are a) constantly balanced by my desire to go to Spirit and b) filtered by me as plausibly coming through (Holy) Spirit via any, or all other types of communication. That may be a bit theological in perspective, but that's how I roll.
 

Muffled

Jesus in me
This is mostly for people of the Abrahamic faiths. I've heard many people saying that God gives them certain "feelings" or particular information, which conveys to them what morality they should subscribe to, the attributes of God, and generally how to act and behave.

I am always very skeptical of people who claim they basically have a hotline to God. For starters how do these people know that its God? They say that they know its God because they feel its correct. It sounds like circular reasoning to me because how can they assume their feelings are correct. For all these people know it could be the devil manipulating them and their feelings, or an advanced alien race messing with their heads. Or it could just be a delusion/fantasy created by their brains due to a genetic predisposition. I guess my real question is how these religious people can know that they are getting accurate information from the real God.

I believe I know because God gave me a prophecy that came true.
 

Skwim

Veteran Member
This is mostly for people of the Abrahamic faiths. I've heard many people saying that God gives them certain "feelings" or particular information, which conveys to them what morality they should subscribe to, the attributes of God, and generally how to act and behave.

I am always very skeptical of people who claim they basically have a hotline to God. For starters how do these people know that its God? They say that they know its God because they feel its correct. It sounds like circular reasoning to me because how can they assume their feelings are correct. For all these people know it could be the devil manipulating them and their feelings, or an advanced alien race messing with their heads. Or it could just be a delusion/fantasy created by their brains due to a genetic predisposition. I guess my real question is how these religious people can know that they are getting accurate information from the real God.
If I recall correctly there's a term in psychology for this sort of identification (on the order of a hallucination), but darn if I can think of it---if I could I'd be able to look it up and lend some insight. But . . . . . . . . .

Maybe someone else with better knowledge can help out here. :shrug:


.
 
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serp777

Well-Known Member
This is an interesting topic. I think there are degrees to which one understands what this means that has to be taken into account. In principle when someone says God speaks to them, that's not invalid. That can be as you cite a "certain feeling." That can be a certain clarity of thought, a strong intuition, a sense of "knowing" with the heart, and so forth. But when someone interprets this as a dictation of absolute authority this is where things can start becoming a little problematic, delusional thinking, as you point out.


The way this is phrased as a "hotline to God" suggests that God is seen as a wholly external entity who sends memos down to you through a pneumatic tube like pulling up to the drive through of a bank. In how I would speak of it would be in a more valid sense that you are simply in touch with the divine in yourself, and it allows you to see things in a certain higher perspective than what you normally rely on in trying to figure crap out with the analytical mind alone. Sometimes we do better not relying on our own understanding we can grasp with the mind, but rather simply allowing insight to "come up" to us from deep within us. That phenomenon is often taken as a type of "magic" by people, or in the mythic sense, "God speaking to them".


If it is a valid internal sense, that's like asking how someone knows they are in love with somebody. "How do you really know you love her? It could just be your hormones telling you it's love because you want to get laid." That's a valid question, but it is really a matter of a one's own maturity to be able to know in themselves the difference between the two. No external authority or measuring stick or test can confirm that to the person. It has to do with their own degree of self-awareness. It has to do with their own interior confidence in knowing themselves. Like someone who is matured can more easily recognize the difference between lust and love in themselves, it's the same thing when it comes to God "speaking" to them.

To run off half-cocked claiming you got a "special message", is like the teenager who feels his hormones kicking in imaging he has been sent by destiny his future wife in the first girl he meets. It's a very black and white interpretation and understanding which understands nothing of the subtle and nuanced nature of reality.


I like the analogy of relating this to love. Just exchange the word love for God, and it kind of answers itself in how it works.


This is where maturity, self-awareness, life experience, self confidence, and all that kicks in. It's the same thing in knowing yourself, learning how to trust how you know things in anything else you do in life. The only difference is that is an aspect of ourselves many are simply unaware of, and hence inexperienced with. How do you know? Learn to know that part of yourself and how to utilize and integrate it into how you function in life. That's how.


The delusion or fantasy part of it is not necessarily in the fact of it, but in the interpretation or translation of the experience itself. The experience can be entirely valid, but how the mind translates it could be in fact problematic, even dangerous if they have wiring-problems between their subconscious and conscious minds. It's like when you tell someone they should practice meditation. They really need to able to deal with going into those places. It's the same with the divine mind, the emergent subconscious to give it an interesting term.


"Accurate" is an interesting criteria to impose upon it. Isn't it like asking you sister who says she's fallen in love with someone, "How can you be sure your feelings are accurate"? :)

The way this is phrased as a "hotline to God" suggests that God is seen as a wholly external entity who sends memos down to you through a pneumatic tube like pulling up to the drive through of a bank. In how I would speak of it would be in a more valid sense that you are simply in touch with the divine in yourself, and it allows you to see things in a certain higher perspective than what you normally rely on in trying to figure crap out with the analytical mind alone. Sometimes we do better not relying on our own understanding we can grasp with the mind, but rather simply allowing insight to "come up" to us from deep within us. That phenomenon is often taken as a type of "magic" by people, or in the mythic sense, "God speaking to them".

Its basically a hotline though. God is an external entity and he's conveying feelings to you through some method. THe idea with the hotline analogy is that there is an exchange of some kind of information between you and an external entity.

Moreover, this "insight" that comes up from the deep within us cannot be inferred to be from a supreme being. There seems to be no way you can differentiate between your brain or Satan or an alien tricking you and God. How could you possibly tell the difference? It appears to be completely circular--you know your feelings and insight are accurate because they're true.

If it is a valid internal sense, that's like asking how someone knows they are in love with somebody. "How do you really know you love her? It could just be your hormones telling you it's love because you want to get laid." That's a valid question, but it is really a matter of a one's own maturity to be able to know in themselves the difference between the two. No external authority or measuring stick or test can confirm that to the person. It has to do with their own degree of self-awareness. It has to do with their own interior confidence in knowing themselves. Like someone who is matured can more easily recognize the difference between lust and love in themselves, it's the same thing when it comes to God "speaking" to them.

I would submit that's a poor analogy. However, first of all, let me mention that many people don't really even know what love is because they would need a reference point of a true love feeling. Realistically speaking, you can't know if you've actually been in love because you haven't tried to experience it with all possible people. For example, after thousands of tries you might find you have even stronger feelings for someone compared to the previous person that you thought you loved. At best you can say that its likely that been in love. Obviously i recognize that people can probably recognize ( they have the proper self awareness) they're in love, but if we're being honest you have to accept a certain level of doubt since you haven't tried to fall in love with all possible people.

Anyways, the main problem with your analogy is that you can see people and communicate, and interact with them verbally, emotionally, and physically. A better analogy is that its like falling in love with the invisible ghost of a dead person. The problem is, like the Ghost, you haven't established God's existence in the first place to know if your feelings about the reality of God are accurate or just a fabrication. Even worse, you have no idea if its an evil demon spirit messing with you as opposed to the Ghost of the dead person. Similarly, with feelings from God you don't know if its an alien doing an experiment on you, or satan is messing with you, or your brain is just plain malfunctioning.

The delusion or fantasy part of it is not necessarily in the fact of it, but in the interpretation or translation of the experience itself. The experience can be entirely valid, but how the mind translates it could be in fact problematic, even dangerous if they have wiring-problems between their subconscious and conscious minds. It's like when you tell someone they should practice meditation. They really need to able to deal with going into those places. It's the same with the divine mind, the emergent subconscious to give it an interesting term.

Here you rightfully admit another significant problem with feelings from God. Even if you are getting feeling messages from God, you can't know if you're interpreting them correctly. God hasn't given you the "feelings" Rosetta stone so there doesn't seem to be a reliable way to convert these feelings into any useful information. I would also bet that these feelings depend on your mood, or even on what foods you've eaten. It seems to me that its more likely to be a neurological epiphenomena than God sending you particular feelings.

"Accurate" is an interesting criteria to impose upon it. Isn't it like asking you sister who says she's fallen in love with someone, "How can you be sure your feelings are accurate"?

I'm told that people use these feelings from God to know the correct morality, to know of his existence and to know God's attributes. This is what accurate is referring to--for example, how can you be sure your feelings from God to "know the correct morality" are in fact valid?

Also, its more like asking your sister if she's fallen in love with an invisible Ghost. In this case, the feelings of the sister would supposedly prove the existence of the Ghost. Herein lies the problem--people's feelings from God are proving the existence of God.
 

serp777

Well-Known Member
Peace be on you.
After humble prayers, a servant of God who seeks right path for an issue, gets mix or all of :
clear bliss, impacted feeling, chain of events in a direction, special dreams, words from God, awe etc.
1=Many people are present in Ahmadiyya Muslim Community, when they prayed to God for guidance, they were well guided by God:
https://www.alislam.org/friday-sermon/2011-04-29.html

2=My maternal grandfather prayed for 40 days and he was shown the truth about Community.

3=Times ago, door was knocked, then I was at a dorm, a fellow student came and began to talk about religion [about Ahmadiyya-Muslims], I knew he was a neutral kind of person...At that time I had some books about faith, and asked him if he like to have. He said yes. I wrapped all of them in a bag........After a while a strong impact fell on my heart and piercing thought from outside came that the visitor has plan to get these precious books to destroy them. ...So during the talk, I told him about this experience politely........ His face changed color and he left.

1. Coincidence and confirmation bias. I'm sure many were not well guided by God.

2. I don't even know what the "truth about Community" even means.

3. What on earth does that prove?
 

serp777

Well-Known Member
It's very rare for me to hear or see anything outside of dreams and even those are rare. For me, it's more of a "Spider-sense" type deal or feeling the Force or whatever. It works best as long as I'm not tired, sick, upset, etc. Even if someone can obtain divine knowledge, if the receptacle is busted, the message is going to get screwed over.

It feels like I am in an underwater room with lots of doors, with the doors being paths through destiny. I cannot see which doors are open. I can only feel the movement of the water, the reduced resistance, through the open door. Even if I try to swim for the other doors because I don't like the open one, fate will work itself out that I end up in the open door anyway because that's where the current is taking me.

How do you know this spider sense is from God as opposed to Satan tricking you, or an alien experimenting on your brain, or your brain malfunctioning?
 

serp777

Well-Known Member
Like Windwalker, I find the use of the word "accurate" here to be a strange choice. But setting that aside, it comes down to some pretty basic things that apply universally to every instance of a human thinking they know anything, whether it is from the gods or not:
  • Experience. The more we observe the world around us, the more data we have to sort into patterns or arrange into schemas. Once we have a set of schemas built up - which are basically mental maps constructed by personal observation and culture - new incoming data gets interpreted based on those maps and is often sorted on reflex. Put another way, the worldview one has impacts how one interprets incoming information and often taken for granted.
    • For example, when you walk into a restaurant, you take for granted that it is indeed a restaurant. "Restaurant" is a schema you've developed through personal observation and culture, and if a location you find yourself in matches that schema, you call it "restaurant" without really thinking about it. Knowing something comes from the gods works the same way at its root level.
  • Trust. In order to navigate life and the environment at all in any capacity, a creature has to trust in its own faculties. This is perhaps more fundamental than experience: trust in oneself. Trusting oneself to categorize things into schemas in a way that works for a given situation, and trusting oneself to recategorize if necessary for a particular need.
There's also this thing that humans like to call "reason," but honestly... that is always secondary to these two. "Reason" is grounded in both of the above, and emerges from trusting in one's observations and building schemas based on experience.

Its actually a solid choice, albeit an unusual choice, because accurate refers to the information people interpret from the feelings they supposedly receive from God. For example, people have often told me that these feelings from God guide them to pick the correct objective morals and to know various attributes of God. Accurate refers to knowing how your interpretation of these feelings remains valid and precise. The use of the word accurate implies other things as well in this case like interference, which can be caused your brain imposing its own morals on these feelings and your current mental state due to mood and other environmental factors.

I'm using accurate in the same way a networks engineer would use accurate--for instance how can you be sure that the packets being sent over a fiber optic cable to another router or computer is accurate?

For example, when you walk into a restaurant, you take for granted that it is indeed a restaurant. "Restaurant" is a schema you've developed through personal observation and culture, and if a location you find yourself in matches that schema, you call it "restaurant" without really thinking about it. Knowing something comes from the gods works the same way at its root level.

The problem with this example is that the schema you call a "restaurant" is based on physical, empirical data, observations, and predictions that are confirmed with successive observations and evidence. A better example, in my opinion, would be developing a schema about invisible restaurants on mars. Just like God, you have a kind of schema you've developed, but there is no physical evidence or any observations of the restaurant. Furthermore, the restaurant is inaccessible and you've never eaten any food from the restaurant. However, the invisible restaurant owner occasionally sends you a vague and ambiguous advertisement packet about the restaurant. SO you have a schema about this restaurant, but you have no way of knowing whether your schema is accurate or correct. There's no way to know if the advertisement packet is actually from the restaurant or if your interpretation of the advertisement packet is correct. You can't trust this advertisement packet, and rightly so, because there's nothing to demonstrate this is from the real invisible restaurant on mars. You have no way of telling if you've been lied to or tricked.
 

serp777

Well-Known Member
If I recall correctly there's a term in psychology for this sort of identification (on the order of a hallucination), but darn if I can think of it---if I could I'd be able to look it up and lend some insight. But . . . . . . . . .

Maybe someone else with better knowledge can help out here. :shrug:


.

Well i couldn't find the term, but I did find evidence of psychologists telling people not to trust their feelings. It would be nice to know thought its on the tip of my tongue

https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/evolution-the-self/200808/trust-your-feelings-maybe-not
 

serp777

Well-Known Member
A connection to God isn't necessarily like talking to some being in the sky. Oneness involves a transformation from the inside that frees a person from the weight of the world allowing more power and freedom to choose even agaisnt the greatest of obstacles.

And how would this show that God is connecting to you?
 
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