Does pirating movies harm those in the industry?

[nutshell]

Does pirating movies harm those in the industry?

Well, does it? Please answer the poll and explain here.

 

[Don Penguinoini]

Well, i can't pick either of the options, i think it affects some, but not most.

 

[Kungfuzed]

Only if you consider a download to be a lost sale. I don't.

 

[Aasimar]

I'm really not sure, I don't really pirate so I'm not that familiar, but I suppose I could take a few peeks.

 

[Terrywoodenpic]

Pirating removes the option of a sale...
This hurts the industry in general, though not necessarily all the employees directly.

 

[Don Penguinoini]

I agree with Kungfuzed. I wouldn't buy it in the first place.

 

[nutshell]

Kungfuzed, Penguino:

You both put forth the notion that because it's not a lost sale there is no harm. Please explain your opinion further. From my point of view, downloading the song allows the user to enjoy the product without the sale. I think there is a harm because you're not paying for this enjoyment. If you want something you pay for it. If you don't want to pay for it, you don't get to take it. I really don't think it's any harder than that.

 

[Don Penguinoini]

Well, if i did not have teh service of pirating (which i think is too harsh for what i am doing) I would have never watched that film in the first place. So, they would not have got a sale in tthe first place. If anythnig i publicise their film, i tell y freinds to watch it(all rich) they go straight to the cinema, they pay for me.

 

[nutshell]

Well, if i did not have teh service of pirating (which i think is too harsh for what i am doing) I would have never watched that film in the first place. So, they would not have got a sale in tthe first place. If anythnig i publicise their film, i tell y freinds to watch it(all rich) they go straight to the cinema, they pay for me.

Online publicizing is a valuable tool, but if the distributor chooses not to use such a tool then you are still getting a benefit for free, whether you give good reviews or not.

 

[Fluffy]

If any harm is caused to the sales then I reckon we should be able to quantify it. Is there any evidence of this?

 

[Buttercup]

If you consider losing money as "hurting the industry" then, yes, pirating does hurt the movie industry.....same as pirating songs.

 

[Don Penguinoini]

I dont make a differece. I am making use of a free service. If it wasnt there, they wouldn't get my hard earned money in the first place.

 

[Fluffy]

If you consider losing money as "hurting the industry" then, yes, pirating does hurt the movie industry.....same as pirating songs.

If that is true then there should be research that evidences this.

 

[nutshell]

If any harm is caused to the sales then I reckon we should be able to quantify it. Is there any evidence of this?

I suspect you're looking for something more complicated, but at the most basic level one illegal download of a movie should equal the price of a movie ticket. I don't buy the "i'm helping the movie through word of mouth" argument because negative word of mouth can also take viewers away from the movie. Further, even if a movie benefitted through an illegal download, it is still harmed in that the downloader did not at least pay for his experience.

Lets say a store has an endless supply of M&M's. I steal the Dark Choco M&M's, love them, and tell all my friends about it. All my friends go to the store and buy the M&M's. I even go back too and buy a package this time. Even though the store and the makers of M&M's may have benefitted overall, it doesn't change the fact that the original experience was harmful because it wasn't paid for.

 

[nutshell]

I dont make a differece. I am making use of a free service. If it wasnt there, they wouldn't get my hard earned money in the first place.

Then you shouldn't get the experience of the movie, music, art, etc. in the first place.

 

[Don Penguinoini]

Then, my friend, you will have to destroy EVERY single site which streams em, then i will stop.

 

[nutshell]

Then, my friend, you will have to destroy EVERY single site which streams em, then i will stop.

You enable them.

 

[Buttercup]

If that is true then there should be research that evidences this.

haha. There is no need for research...it's rather obvious. If everyone started downloading music and movies without paying would that be more convincing? It's much different to borrow a cd or movie from a friend.

 

[nutshell]

Indie films are likely to be pirated, too. Not just blockbusters. When you pirate movies, you are most definitely hurting the "little" people in the business like myself, my two brothers (who are filmmakers), and many of my friends who are in filmmaking. Film is an art, and art deserves to be copyrighted for it's protection if it is to be sold to the general public.

Please stop focusing on this as a noble act of civil disobedience/revolt against the film bourgeoisie and look at the entire picture (no pun intended). The more money funneled out from the film industry from pirating and stealing the less work there is for people like us.




Peace,
Mystic

Mytic, if you're out there, please visit our humble thread. I'd love to hear more details as to how pirating harms you and other artists in the industry.

 

[Fluffy]

I suspect you're looking for something more complicated, but at the most basic level one illegal download of a movie should equal the price of a movie ticket. I don't buy the "i'm helping the movie through word of mouth" argument because negative word of mouth can also take viewers away from the movie. Further, even if a movie benefitted through an illegal download, it is still harmed in that the downloader did not at least pay for his experience.

Okay so if this is the case then if we were to measure the total number of times a song has been illegally downloaded and add that to the number of times it has been purchased then multiply that by the amount which the song is being sold for, we would have an exact amount of money that should have been made by that song. If we then look at how much was made we can calculate exactly how much damage has been done to the relevant parties, right?

However, I think that this model suffers. For starters, many people download more copyrighted files than they would ever be able to afford. Clearly in this case some of that material would never have been purchased legitimately and, consequently, no sale could ever have been made. When you then take into account that people are not reasonably going to spend every penny that isn't keeping them alive on music and movies then the amount of downloads that don't equate lost sales increases dramatically. If you then were to consider the scenario in which downloading didn't happen at all and construct a model that predicted the number of sales, you would then have an accurate estimation of how many were lost/gained through the addition of downloading.

I argue that it is not at all obvious that this model will predict an increase in sales and, furthermore, this model needs to be constructed before such a "fact" can be asserted.

Lets say a store has an endless supply of M&M's. I steal the Dark Choco M&M's, love them, and tell all my friends about it. All my friends go to the store and buy the M&M's. I even go back too and buy a package this time. Even though the store and the makers of M&M's may have benefitted overall, it doesn't change the fact that the original experience was harmful because it wasn't paid for.

I agree. However, if I steal M&Ms then I prevent any other person from purchasing those M&Ms and so I am causing harm to those I have stolen from. In this case, I am copying a file and not destroying the original and so it is not obvious that a sale has been denied.

haha. There is no need for research...it's rather obvious. If everyone started downloading music and movies without paying would that be more convincing?

No it would not. If nobody had any intention to buy any movies or music but they were prepared to get them for free then if you managed to immediatly stop all downloading then no sales would be made still.

Do you not find it obvious that a person will acquire more stuff for themselves when it is free than when they have to pay? What reason do you have, therefore, to assume that every download is a lost sale?

It's much different to borrow a cd or movie from a friend.

Yet those things are illegal. You cannot borrow a cd or movie from your friend. If you do then you are breaking copyright.