Ecclesiastes 7:28

[marybeth]

I am a liberal Christian, who was raised by very extreme parents, especially my father. I disagree with them on a lot of points, but especially this one. Ecclesiastes 7:28 says "while I was still searching but not finding-- I found one upright man among a thousand, but not one upright woman among them all."
My parents believe that this means that only one out of a thousand people you see everyday are saved, the rest are going to hell, and you can "assume that most people that you see are going to hell.(My father's words.)
I do not believe that this is true, I think it was speaking of the specific time, not in general, and besides, it says "righteous", not whether they will be saved. If my parents reasoning is true, then how could this verse be consistent with the words of Jesus, ""Do not judge, or you too will be judged."?
My parents use this reasoning as an excuse to say all kinds of things about people, even people that they pass on the street, and according to them, it's okay, because "the Bible says that one out of a thousand is saved" (that's not what it says anyway).
Can anyone shed a little light on what they think that this verse means, so I'll be prepared to debate it with my parents the next time it comes up? Thank you.

 

[Pegg]

I am a liberal Christian, who was raised by very extreme parents, especially my father. I disagree with them on a lot of points, but especially this one. Ecclesiastes 7:28 says "while I was still searching but not finding-- I found one upright man among a thousand, but not one upright woman among them all."
My parents believe that this means that only one out of a thousand people you see everyday are saved, the rest are going to hell, and you can "assume that most people that you see are going to hell.(My father's words.)
I do not believe that this is true, I think it was speaking of the specific time, not in general, and besides, it says "righteous", not whether they will be saved. If my parents reasoning is true, then how could this verse be consistent with the words of Jesus, ""Do not judge, or you too will be judged."?
My parents use this reasoning as an excuse to say all kinds of things about people, even people that they pass on the street, and according to them, it's okay, because "the Bible says that one out of a thousand is saved" (that's not what it says anyway).
Can anyone shed a little light on what they think that this verse means, so I'll be prepared to debate it with my parents the next time it comes up? Thank you.

Hi, i just want to say that i think its very significant that you are questioning your parents views...that is very commendable and good on you.

I agree with you that the verse does not mention 'salvation'...it is about 'righteousness'. It would appear that in Solomons day, people (men and women) were not living righteously. The righteous were far and few between....similarly like today.

If someone does view this verse as specifically refering to the difference between men and women, then here is a good explanation of this particular verse from the

In what sense did the congregator find only “one man out of a thousand” but not “a woman among all these”?—Ecclesiastes 7:28.
To understand these inspired words correctly, we must first appreciate how God views women. The Bible refers to the widow Naomi’s daughter-in-law Ruth as “an excellent woman.” (Ruth 3:11) According to Proverbs 31:10, a good wife “is worth far more than corals.” (An American Translation)
What, then, did King Solomon of ancient Israel mean when he said: “I have found . . . one true man in a thousand, but never a true woman”?—Moffatt.

The context shows that low moral standards must have prevailed among women in Solomon’s day. (Ecclesiastes 7:26) This may have been largely a result of the influence of foreign women who practiced Baal worship. Even King Solomon succumbed to pressure from his many foreign wives. “He came to have seven hundred wives, princesses, and three hundred concubines,” says the Bible, “and his wives gradually inclined his heart” to worship false gods. (1 Kings 11:1-4) The moral standards of men too were not good—one righteous man in a thousand was a rarity, almost negligible. “This only I have found,” concludes Solomon, “that the true God made mankind upright, but they themselves have sought out many plans.” (Ecclesiastes 7:29) This is a conclusion about mankind—man as the human race, not man as compared with woman.
Hence, the words found at Ecclesiastes 7:28 should be viewed as a comment on the general moral condition of the people of Solomon’s day.

However, there is another possible meaning to this verse. It may also be prophetic, for never has a woman given Jehovah perfect obedience. But there has been one such man—Jesus Christ.—Romans 5:15-17.

 

[Green Kepi]

Marybeth...the one "upright" man was Noah he's talking about. Solomon wasn't saying that women were not capable of being wise and good. The point of his statement is not that women are unwise, but that no one - man or woman is upright before God in his search. He found that goodness and wisdom were almost as scarce among men as among women. Even though, at that time, men were given a religious education and women were not. He's actually saying, I have found only one in a 1,000 who is wise in God's eyes...(thinks about it and goes on to say)...no I have found even fewer than that....

 

[JayJayDee]

I am a liberal Christian, who was raised by very extreme parents, especially my father. I disagree with them on a lot of points, but especially this one. Ecclesiastes 7:28 says "while I was still searching but not finding-- I found one upright man among a thousand, but not one upright woman among them all."
My parents believe that this means that only one out of a thousand people you see everyday are saved, the rest are going to hell, and you can "assume that most people that you see are going to hell.(My father's words.)
I do not believe that this is true, I think it was speaking of the specific time, not in general, and besides, it says "righteous", not whether they will be saved. If my parents reasoning is true, then how could this verse be consistent with the words of Jesus, ""Do not judge, or you too will be judged."?

You have raised a very important point here. Yes! Jesus said that we are to be judged the same way that we judge others. (Luke 6:37)

When Jesus sent his disciples out to preach, he told them to "search out deserving ones" in order to offer them the good news. (Matt 10:11-15) They were not to judge people as unworthy of the message but to offer it to all without prejudice. If people refused to listen, they were to "shake the dust off their feet" and move on in their search. The peace that they wished for these people was to return to them.

Jesus sought out sinners because he knew that a person's life course was not always an indication of what was in their heart. Look how many responded and changed their ways to become acceptable worshippers of God as disciples of his son....it's still happening today.

The judging is Jesus' job. Our job is to offer everyone the hope of the kingdom and to introduce them to non judgmental Christianity.
When Jesus comes again, it will be to judge the world with the same judgment for all. Those who display an unchristian attitude, no matter how 'righteous' they may be in their own eyes, will be in for a shock. (Matt 7:21-23)

My parents use this reasoning as an excuse to say all kinds of things about people, even people that they pass on the street, and according to them, it's okay, because "the Bible says that one out of a thousand is saved" (that's not what it says anyway).
Can anyone shed a little light on what they think that this verse means, so I'll be prepared to debate it with my parents the next time it comes up? Thank you.

By passing judgment on others, they are actually judging themselves.

I am also pleased to see that you recognise that your parents attitude is not Christ-like. Self righteousness is the opposite of humility. God hates it. (James 4:6,10; Matt 23:12)

Pegg has provided a good scriptural explanation of the scripture that the issue is based on, so that would be a good place to start.

Love was supposed to be the identifying mark of Christians (John 13:34,35) even loving our enemies. (Matt 5:43-48) That leaves no room to judge. We must offer the good news to all and let God do the rest.

I hope you can get your parents to see that being "extreme" in either direction is not what being a Christian is all about. :sad:

All the best.

 

[savagewind]

I think the scriptures has nothing to do with uprightness. It refers to "finding one's soul" as Yehoshua warns about scribed at Matthew 10:30. Whoever finds their life will lose it, and whoever loses their life for my sake will find it.

I think what he is saying is that even though he searches for what he is, he has not found what he is. He observes that a few seem to have found who they are (one in a thousand) but even these one in a thousand have not found what women are. Not one.

http://biblehub.com/text/ecclesiastes/7-28.htm

 

[savagewind]

SIGH It's funny and true.