As is happening now.
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End times?
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As is happening now.
InvestigateTruth
Veteran Member
But christ in the Bible said, His return is like days of Noah, just as when Noah came, people were busy with their own worldy enjoyments, and then flood came, so will happen when Christ returns. We are getting closer to the new flood day by day.
Sand Dancer
Currently catless
Well said.
It all is about our frame of references.
When the Sun rises on a new day, the coldest part of the morning is just before daybreak.
The promise of the sun rising is assured, yet it still takes a while before the risen sun's penetrative powers melt away the coldness of the night.
No Message is instantaneous, it took 300 years for the Message of Jesus Christ to become the way a large amount of people embraced, but many were practising all throughout those 300 years.
Baha'u'llah offered the Old World Order is defective and a New one is rolling out in its stead. This is so, and it is based on the requirements that Baha'u'llah offered were mandatory, if we are to find unity and peace.
We are closing in fast on great change, a time Baha'u'llah offered that ".....Then, and only then, will the Divine Standard be unfurled, and the Nightingale of Paradise warble its melody."
Regards Tony
InChrist
Free4ever
Yes, Christ did say that and I believe He was referring to His coming in the clouds to call believers out of this world to Himself before the Great seven year Tribulation.
“But the first one, it says they are buying and selling and building and planting and partying and marrying and eating and drinking, and you cannot imagine that at the end of the Great Tribulation; the world is practically destroyed. Yet this is a time when the Son of Man will be revealed. Revealed how? And to whom? Obviously to His own. He said He would come and take them to His Father’s house of many mansions. So this has to be the Rapture.”
What Will The Earth Be Like At The Rapture?
The coming of Christ in the clouds for His bride (the church), when things are going along pretty normally, I believe is a distinct event from His return at the end of the Tribulation period. Tribulation conditions are are horrific; famines, pestilence and Christ must return to save Israel, the planet, and set up His kingdom where He will rule from Jerusalem for 1000 years.
nPeace
Veteran Member
I'm not sure if those considered as Christian believe, or even agree that the end times, are the same as the last days, mentioned in the Bible.
My understanding ...
The last days, as described in the Bible, refer to a period of time starting from when Christ began ruling as king and ending at Armageddon - God's war against all his enemies.
There are many event taking place during this time.
After Armageddon - the end of the last days, there is a "new beginning" - Christ millennial reign, which is judgment day, where those who survive Armageddon and those resurrected during a period referred to as "one hour", will live by "new laws", and be judged according to their response to those laws.
Then...
That's another Chapter though. Not the "end times"... or maybe it is to some, but I don't know how they apply that expression.
nPeace
Veteran Member
...but how can that be?
Notice... all these things. All what things?
Well let's read it again...
(Matthew 24:32-34) 32 “Now learn this illustration from the fig tree: Just as soon as its young branch grows tender and sprouts its leaves, you know that summer is near. 33 Likewise also you, when you see all these things, know that he is near at the doors. 34 Truly I say to you that this generation will by no means pass away until all these things happen.
All what thing? All the things Jesus was talking about.
Which includes... verses 7-31
Some things there were impossible even a generation after the last apostle John died.
Take a look for example, at Matthew 24:14
What about Matthew 24:29-31?
It's clear from Jesus words... not only here, but elsewhere, Jesus had the far future in mind.
This is seen clearly from verse 3. The question - . . .the disciples approached him privately, saying: “Tell us, when will these things be, and what will be the sign of your presence and of the conclusion of the system of things?” (Matthew 24:3)
Jesus answered...
Presence? What presence?
Some translations say coming. So Jesus' answer was two fold, and included the "end times"... and the end of this system, or world.
Absolutely it is the end times. But not the End of the World. Just the End of this Age.
Here is some info on coming of the Christ: https://www.christmaitreya.org
And info on Judgment Day: http://judgmentday.info
We are already long past the point of no return on the climate change front. Millions will die due to catastrophic effects from that, if not life as we know it becoming completely destabilized. You don't need a doomsday religion for it. Heck, doomsday religions have mostly been used as an excuse for apathy (who cares so long as I get my paradise?) Or distraction (This is the gay's fault.) Or just furthering greed. (If it isn't manifest destiny than it's prosperity gospel or good old venture capitalists, who will kill more than any communist tyrants wet dream.)
And there's no time for some Star Trek go to space utopia. We are nowhere near solving the problem of long space travel and the wheel *will* break before then. Possibly even within the next couple generations. We aren't going to be around long before this ball falls into the sun.
So yeah. I do think we're in the end times, even as an atheist. Just don't think Jesus saves is anything more than wishful thinking in the face of fatalism.
And fatalistic I may be about the ultimate end of humanity, but so far that hasn't led me to think there's no point in doing anything now, simply due to alleviating suffering is itself a worthy pursuit.
Anyway. Ramble done.
It's 100 degrees here.
And there's no time for some Star Trek go to space utopia. We are nowhere near solving the problem of long space travel and the wheel *will* break before then. Possibly even within the next couple generations. We aren't going to be around long before this ball falls into the sun.
So yeah. I do think we're in the end times, even as an atheist. Just don't think Jesus saves is anything more than wishful thinking in the face of fatalism.
And fatalistic I may be about the ultimate end of humanity, but so far that hasn't led me to think there's no point in doing anything now, simply due to alleviating suffering is itself a worthy pursuit.
Anyway. Ramble done.
It's 100 degrees here.
rational experiences
Veteran Member
NASA via collider said I want what Rome had.
After Moses wandering asteroid saviour Jesus first position. Thesis of science mind only.
To choose old but for my new science.
To copy Rome. Richest human control of past. I now ordain it for myself.
So he doesn't own Jewish temple pyramid science. As Rome.
First lie.
He's doing Romes theme. I updated the pyramid science model. Nuclear power plant model.
Is doing it already.
Then said Rome was mother's abominator. Stating it's your fault. Coding...man's science says so.
Earths heavens space change. Taught.
Says I want my first direct advice. Mass of a wandering holy star. Cold sun mass.
The exact answer I want. I want to copy. Ownership.
I want to change.
Is Exact.
What you believe you should own.
After Moses wandering asteroid saviour Jesus first position. Thesis of science mind only.
To choose old but for my new science.
To copy Rome. Richest human control of past. I now ordain it for myself.
So he doesn't own Jewish temple pyramid science. As Rome.
First lie.
He's doing Romes theme. I updated the pyramid science model. Nuclear power plant model.
Is doing it already.
Then said Rome was mother's abominator. Stating it's your fault. Coding...man's science says so.
Earths heavens space change. Taught.
Says I want my first direct advice. Mass of a wandering holy star. Cold sun mass.
The exact answer I want. I want to copy. Ownership.
I want to change.
Is Exact.
What you believe you should own.
Aupmanyav
Be your own guru
Yeah, I am a strong atheist, but all parties end. The human story will certainly end by a billion years, when sun makes the earth so hot that all water evaporates and it is unable to support life as it (the sun) turns into a red dwarf. Life could end earlier than that by many causes - asteroid hit, gigantic volcanic eruption, virus, climate changes, etc.
Kalki is superstition, and (please note) end of this Kaliyuga (age, in some 425,000 years from now) is not the end of the world according to Hindus. It will be followed by another 'Satyayuga'. This is the seventh cycle of yugas (Manvantara - Manvantara - Wikipedia), there will be seven more. According to Hindu belief the eighth Manvantara will be presided by Savarni Manu (the current one is by Vaivasvata Manu); it will have MahaBali as Indra, Galava and Parashurama will be among the seven sages, and the Godhead will appear as Shraddhādeva (Rama and Krishna will be history). No ifs and buts in theist Hinduism, all things clearly laid out. End of the universe is 156 trillion years away, we are only about half way through.
Savarni Manu - Wikipedia
Kalki is superstition, and (please note) end of this Kaliyuga (age, in some 425,000 years from now) is not the end of the world according to Hindus. It will be followed by another 'Satyayuga'. This is the seventh cycle of yugas (Manvantara - Manvantara - Wikipedia), there will be seven more. According to Hindu belief the eighth Manvantara will be presided by Savarni Manu (the current one is by Vaivasvata Manu); it will have MahaBali as Indra, Galava and Parashurama will be among the seven sages, and the Godhead will appear as Shraddhādeva (Rama and Krishna will be history). No ifs and buts in theist Hinduism, all things clearly laid out. End of the universe is 156 trillion years away, we are only about half way through.
Savarni Manu - Wikipedia
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At the end of the Ice Age we had Noah talking about climate change. Now we have NOAA. Go figure.
Well, given that those who created any particular religion knew very little about the actual universe (other than whatever came into their heads), I suspect that most of us non-believers thought this might be the case. Given that most of us (NB) no doubt don't think such religions came from any divine source.
nPeace
Veteran Member
Why do you say that "those who created any particular religion knew very little about the actual universe (other than whatever came into their heads)"?
You think people were clueless about things around them, up till the time of the Greeks? Why?
Well they didn't have telescopes for a start, and very few galaxies are visible to the naked eye so they would have had no comprehension of the actual universe - all 13.8 billion years of its existence. Given that galaxies, and the stars that are in such, are seemingly as common as mere stars in our own galaxy, let alone all the planets we now know exist. So, whatever appears in religious texts has to necessarily be rather imaginative even if it might correspond in some way to the actual universe.
Many believe that the religious texts are the exact truth from God, but for many of us this can't possibly be the case, given the general knowledge around at the time when such texts were written. It is your right to believe in the literal truth of these writings or any interpretation you choose to believe, but such doesn't make more sense, to me, than these being written by mortals.
Aupmanyav
Be your own guru
But, InvestigateTruth, return of Jesus has already happened in your religion. Was not your Iranian preacher the returning Christ, the all rolled into one Messiah, Sayoshant, Kalki, Metreya, as prophesied in earlier scriptures? You also have had the Mahdi who was put to death. Now, who remains to come?
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Colt
Well-Known Member
* The coming od a deliverer had been known for ages. In Judaism they developed rigid ideas about the form and function of an exclusively Jewish Messiah. Jesus did NOT live up to their expectations. The problem wasn't Jesus.
* Failing to do what was expected new theories developed about what he would do during his return visit. (This world was never intended to be the permanent home a the Son. He has a much better place on high.)
* The original, pre-cross Gospel of the Kingdom of Heaven will eventually subdue the world, not Jesus' smashing everything up!
* What time will it be the day after the end of time? It's really a dumb idea. Different ages will progress towards an age of light and life, peace on earth and good will among men. But there will still be time.
nPeace
Veteran Member
So you are saying someone imagined these?
(Job 9:8-9) 8 Stretching out the heavens by himself And treading upon the high waves of the sea; 9 Making the Ash constellation, the Keʹsil constellation, And the Kiʹmah constellation and the interior rooms of the South;
(Job 38:31-33) 31 Can you tie the ropes of the Kiʹmah constellation Or untie the cords of the Keʹsil constellation? 32 Can you lead out a constellation in its season Or guide the Ash constellation along with its sons? 33 Do you know the laws governing the heavens, Or can you impose their authority on the earth?
“The Ash constellation.” Heb., ʽAsh. Thought by some to be the constellation Ursa Major (Great Bear).
“The Kesil constellation.” Heb., Kesilʹ. Thought by some to be the constellation Orion.
“And the Kimah constellation.” Heb., weKhi·mahʹ. Thought by some to be the Pleiades stars in the Taurus constellation.
“The One making the Pleiades and Hesperus and Arcturus and the storerooms of the South,” LXX; Vg, “who makes Arcturus and Orion and the Hyades and the interior rooms of the South.” The interior rooms of the South are understood to be the constellations below the equator, in the southern hemisphere.
“The Mazzaroth constellation.” Heb., Maz·za·rohthʹ; Gr., Ma·zou·rothʹ (as in 2 Kings 23:5 where it is translated “constellations of the zodiac”); Sy, “the Wagon constellation”; Lat., lu·ciʹfe·rum, “the light bearer.”
(Amos 5:8) 8 The Maker of the Kiʹmah constellation and the Keʹsil constellation, and the One turning deep shadow into the morning itself, and the One who has made day itself dark as night, the One calling for the waters of the sea, that he may pour them out upon the surface of the earth. . .“The Kesil constellation.” Heb., Kesilʹ. Thought by some to be the constellation Orion.
“And the Kimah constellation.” Heb., weKhi·mahʹ. Thought by some to be the Pleiades stars in the Taurus constellation.
“The One making the Pleiades and Hesperus and Arcturus and the storerooms of the South,” LXX; Vg, “who makes Arcturus and Orion and the Hyades and the interior rooms of the South.” The interior rooms of the South are understood to be the constellations below the equator, in the southern hemisphere.
“The Mazzaroth constellation.” Heb., Maz·za·rohthʹ; Gr., Ma·zou·rothʹ (as in 2 Kings 23:5 where it is translated “constellations of the zodiac”); Sy, “the Wagon constellation”; Lat., lu·ciʹfe·rum, “the light bearer.”
(Job 26:7-8) 7 He is stretching out the north over the empty place, Hanging the earth upon nothing; 8 Wrapping up the waters in his clouds, So that the cloud mass is not split under them;
This, at a time when the belief was that the earth must have been supported by some physical object(s).
(Ecclesiastes 1:7) 7 All the streams flow into the sea, yet the sea is not full. To the place from which the streams flow, there they return so as to flow again.
It was not until the 1800’s that the earth’s water cycle was well understood. Yet, thousands of years ago, religious people wrote this...
(Job 36:27-28) 27 He draws up the drops of water; They condense into rain from his mist; 28 Then the clouds pour it down; They shower down upon mankind.
(Isaiah 55:10) 10 For just as the rain and the snow pour down from heaven And do not return there until they saturate the earth, making it produce and sprout, Giving seed to the sower and bread to the eater,
That's quite an imagination, don't you think? ...and that's only a fraction of what they knew, before they were discovered, only recently.