Exidus and hitory

[Iti oj]

is their any good historic and anthropological evidence for the enslavement of the jews or of their exodus from Egypt? or of the founding of Israel or of Jericho?

 

[Pineblossom]

is their any good historic and anthropological evidence for the enslavement of the jews or of their exodus from Egypt? or of the founding of Israel or of Jericho?

Yes - but much depends on what you call 'good'.

1 The label 'Jews' happened a long time later - if they did exist as slaves they would possible be known as Hebrews because of their language.

2 Slaves were part of life. Many people sold themselves into slavery and many slaves rose to prominent positions in society.

3 There is no evidence of as mass migration of some 2 million people out of Egypt.

4 Jericho was not inhabited at the time of the so-called invasion of Cannaan by Joshua.

5 Despite the historical record, Jews, as they are known today, do exist.

 

[JacobEzra.]

Yes - but much depends on what you call 'good'.

1 The label 'Jews' happened a long time later -

5 Despite the historical record, Jews, as they are known today, do exist.

1-The hebrew word for "Jew", is not that young. It was used for Judeans and for folk who were a part of Judah and Northern kingdom.

5- How so?

 

[Iti oj]

sooo is that a no i did not historicaly happen but the ancestors of Hebrews may have been slaves?

the last special i saw on pyrimads said that current evidence suggest that their were no slaves but peasent workers who were well treated built the pyriamdis

 

[Desert Snake]

1-The hebrew word for "Jew", is not that young. It was used for Judeans and for folk who were a part of Judah and Northern kingdom.

5- How so?

I think He was making a distinction between which terms are most advantageous when discussing Hebrew and Jewish history.
"Jewish", especially on RF, is not synonymous with "Hebrew".

I'm not arguing with your statement, btw.

 

[JacobEzra.]

sooo is that a no i did not historicaly happen but the ancestors of Hebrews may have been slaves?

the last special i saw on pyrimads said that current evidence suggest that their were no slaves but peasent workers who were well treated built the pyriamdis

Pyrimads were not built by Hebrews, correct. I'm not sure many even try to cllaim that

 

[Pineblossom]

1-The hebrew word for "Jew", is not that young. It was used for Judeans and for folk who were a part of Judah and Northern kingdom.

But it was not used during the so-called Exodus.

5- How so?

Have a look around.

 

[Pineblossom]

sooo is that a no i did not historicaly happen but the ancestors of Hebrews may have been slaves?

the last special i saw on pyrimads said that current evidence suggest that their were no slaves but peasent workers who were well treated built the pyriamdis

Don't believe pop docos masquerading as history.

 

[Iti oj]

Don't believe pop docos masquerading as history.

the history channel lied? i mean i now know they thinks aleins did it.......but they use to be a serious channel.

 

[Caladan]

is their any good historic and anthropological evidence for the enslavement of the jews or of their exodus from Egypt? or of the founding of Israel or of Jericho?

I think it may prove more constructive to look at these narratives in context. these may very well be narratives that represent realities and places in the near east during the Bronze Age and Iron Age, but the narrative themselves are ideological.
for example the conquest of Joshua could have been considered technically as fiction even during the time of its writing, but it has an ideological importance in a rapidly changing near east, this was during a time that the Assyrian empire was collapsing, and the kingdom of Judah sought to establish a national identity. the narrative of the conquest of Joshua promotes a distinct identity in a Canaanite landscape.

likewise, the exodus may be a narrative with a context of fiction, but it does represent realities in ancient periods, such as the movements of semi nomadic Semitic people between the Levant and Egypt. some of this movement is documented by the Egyptians.

 

[Caladan]

Also, for what its worth, the Bible never claims that the Hebrews built the pyramids.

 

[Rakhel]

silly caladan. everyone knows the bible lies

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

I think He was making a distinction between which terms are most advantageous when discussing Hebrew and Jewish history.
"Jewish", especially on RF, is not synonymous with "Hebrew".

Nor, by the way, is Hebrew necessarily synonymous with Israelite.

 

[Caladan]

silly caladan. everyone knows the bible lies

Sometimes I wonder why not reading the Bible in a broader context. it doesn't have to be 'all or nothing'. literalists treat the Bible as all facts, but then other people come and take the same stories at complete face value just the same, but only to refute them.
personally I don't see much difference.
I think the best way, is to study the scripture in the context of the Near East. it represents realities in the near east, as it was written in the near east.

if we take the New Testament for example. we may divide it into different layers, we don't have to accept the miracles parts, and other similar layers, but other layers clearly show an accurate capacity to describe the Judean province, the Romans, etc.

 

[Iti oj]

My question has nothing to do with argueing against religon. It came about because a coworker of mine is a history major and said the exidus is historic fact with evidence...

 

[Rakhel]

There may be some evident. Only a few would dispute that there is any evidence. As to where you can find it, outside the bible, I am not too sure.

 

[Caladan]

My question has nothing to do with argueing against religon. It came about because a coworker of mine is a history major and said the exidus is historic fact with evidence...

I'm not sure anyone is saying that this thread 'is against religion'.

 

[Iti oj]

I'm not sure anyone is saying that this thread 'is against religion'.

I think i may have misread something

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

• Precisely what is meant by claiming the Exodus as "historic fact"?
• Precisely what is meant by denying the Exodus as "historic fact"?

 

[Desert Snake]

My question has nothing to do with argueing against religon. It came about because a coworker of mine is a history major and said the exidus is historic fact with evidence...

Update? Idon't think you're going to convince him otherwise, anyway, if he's taking the Bible as fact.