Fascism - Why...

[YmirGF]

To be fair, fascism requires a charismatic dictator for a cult of personality to form around. No one on the left has that much charisma

On a serious note, who on the left that's a viable option for presidency has the highest approval rating, and is that number above 50%?

A ham sandwich? This will get real interesting if the Democratic Party bails on tired Ol' Joe. They would be, in effect, handing Trump the election. Maybe that is why they are pulling out all the stops so that he cannot even run, therefore making it safe to nuke Joe and replace him with someone with a triple digit IQ.

 

[Secret Chief]

"Amid this creeping radicalization, the white supremacism of the overtly fascist groups commingles not only with anger against the Left , but with the wider right-wing contentiousness surrounding cross-border migrancy and the refugee crisis, fear of foreigners, Sinophobia, and generalized Islamophobia. For this broader far-Right militancy, contemporary notations of ‘race’ as cultural belonging, social entitlement, angry intolerance of others, and a narrowly conceived conception of skin and birth-based citizenship supply a main mobilizing animus. These two phenomena increasingly converge: the ideologically self-conscious fascist formations and a broader-based right-wing populism centred around beliefs about race. On the shared authoritarian ground of law and order, they increasingly absorb elements of the Trumpified conservative sector too, while gathering up many petty bourgeois and working-class voters damaged by austerity and the societal dislocations from capitalist restructuring and long-run economic change. Demonstrable sympathies inside the police and security apparatuses also play a part. The ability of an ever-broadening right-wing coalescence to shift the basic terms of political discourse decisively to the right then becomes troublingly real."

- What is Fascism and Where does it Come From?
(a long read, but worthwhile)

 

[Firenze]

You can hardly expect people to know what fascism is when they don’t know what anti-fascism is. I remind these people daily that a very American group of antifa consisted of my father and his 82nd Airborne buddies along with the rest of the US military. You’d think conservatives that fawn over our soldiers would understand this, but…. no.

 

[Twilight Hue]

Probably because capitalism has not worked well for most people under the age of 45. More than actual socialism I see a rise in syndicalism sentiments. I wouldn't argue for a perfect socialist economy but I for sure would argue for certain socialist policies that have worked elsewhere in the world. Some of the problems we face in America are not unique unsolvable problems. Though I think each policy could be argued individually since each has its own merit.

The problem is runaway unchecked capitalism, not that capitalism is a bad of and in itself, but left unchecked , it turns into an oligarchy. That's what needs checking.

Same for socialism. Left unchecked, it's hideously destructive and leads to collectivism.

Unchecked democracy will lead to anarchy because of a lack of structure.

I think what is needed is equilibrium where the result is a fair and functional society.

The way to that is compromise imv.

 

[Twilight Hue]

To be fair, fascism requires a charismatic dictator for a cult of personality to form around. No one on the left has that much charisma

On a serious note, who on the left that's a viable option for presidency has the highest approval rating, and is that number above 50%?

I don't think charisma doesn't always apply to an individual. It can be a group like the Communist party where nationalism itself takes center stage, instead of an individual as its figurehead.

 

[Secret Chief]

"a convergence of far-Right militias and paramilitary groups (Proud Boys, Three-Percenters, Boogaloo, Oath Keepers, neo-Confederates, miscellaneous white nationalists) spawned a significant counter-mobilization, whether in principal sites of BLM protests and smaller towns or across the web-based political landscape. Under the plebiscitary aegis of Trump’s press audiences, Fox News interviews, and inflammatory tweets, the nascent coalescence of White House Trumpians, Congressional Republicans, and far-Right networks came palpably closer."

- What is Fascism and Where does it Come From?

 

[Secret Chief]

My statement is there are no Americans openly supporting fascism.

Based on what?

 

[Kfox]

And yet they’re willing to vote for a bully and a braggart, who has repeatedly shown he has no respect for his country’s laws or institutions?

That's different. That's not fascism.

 

[Kfox]

And yet they’re willing to vote for a bully and a braggart, who has repeatedly shown he has no respect for his country’s laws or institutions?

That's different. That's not fascism.

Then they are mugs, because that’s quite likely what they would get, in a suitably modern and disguised form.......

Watching the antics of Trump, our own Bozo, Erdogan, Bolsonaro etc, I‘ve come to the conclusion that many people may not realise how much in democracies depends on decent behaviour and respect for the integrity of systems. When you get someone who doesn’t give a **** a lot of damage can be done that will take years to repair.

I don’t think anybody denies Donald Trump has his share of flaws, there are plenty of negative adjectives that can be used to describe him. The way a Trump supporter described it to me was;

"when your house is on fire, the moral integrity of the firefighter though important; is secondary to his ability to do the job at hand; putting out the fire."

These people see the economy of this country as akin to a house on fire, and though trump may be a bully, a bragger, with countless other flaws, he governed in a way that brought the economy up to record levels, and this is what they liked about him.

 

[Evangelicalhumanist]

They don't know what it is and won't bother to look it up.

FASCISM
"a political philosophy, movement, or regime that exalts nation and often race above the individual and that stands for a centralized autocratic government headed by a dictatorial leader, severe economic and social regimentation, and forcible suppression of opposition"

Sound familiar?

It very well might sound familiar -- soon.

 

[Kfox]

I don't know any.

There are plenty of Americans out there however who openly love Socialism and Marxism now.

True! But those people are the enemies of Trump.

 

[Evangelicalhumanist]

Honestly I would like to know why a term that belongs to the political history of an European country is misused, today, in the United States to portray a Conservative politician who just wants to make America great again, by the means of protectionism, tax reductions and less war campaigns.

There are no fascist leaders in the US, and there will never be.

You seem woefully unable to read the players. Something I thought would be detrimental to a jurist.

How much time have you actually spent truly listening to Donald Trump. Really listening?

 

[Firenze]

That's different. That's not fascism.

I don’t think anybody denies Donald Trump has his share of flaws, there are plenty of negative adjectives that can be used to describe him. The way a Trump supporter described it to me was;

"when your house is on fire, the moral integrity of the firefighter though important; is secondary to his ability to do the job at hand; putting out the fire."

These people see the economy of this country as akin to a house on fire, and though trump may be a bully, a bragger, with countless other flaws, he governed in a way that brought the economy up to record levels, and this is what they liked about him.

The economy up to record levels?? Trumps 3rd quarter of 2020 saw the economy grow by 33%. Wow. Impressive, right? Do these people with their houses burning realize that only came after Trump destroyed the economy by over 30% because of his failed and ignorant covid policies that killed Americans? "Never fear! I'm a firefighter here to save your house! Never mind that I'm the one that set your stupid house on fire...."

Ay caramba....

 

[Kfox]

Probably because capitalism has not worked well for most people under the age of 45. More than actual socialism I see a rise in syndicalism sentiments. I wouldn't argue for a perfect socialist economy but I for sure would argue for certain socialist policies that have worked elsewhere in the world. Some of the problems we face in America are not unique unsolvable problems. Though I think each policy could be argued individually since each has its own merit.

The US has never been a Capitalist nor Socialist country, it is a "Market Economy". It has free enterprise as well as socialist programs and policies.

 

[Kfox]

You can hardly expect people to know what fascism is when they don’t know what anti-fascism is. I remind these people daily that a very American group of antifa consisted of my father and his 82nd Airborne buddies along with the rest of the US military. You’d think conservatives that fawn over our soldiers would understand this, but…. no.

Don't confuse the Antifa Thugs of today with what your father was.

 

[Kfox]

I don't know any.

There are plenty of Americans out there however who openly love Socialism and Marxism now.

Yeah; but those people are enemies of Trump supporters

 

[Kfox]

Based on what?

Do you know of any youtube videos of politicians openly supporting facism?

 

[Firenze]

Don't confuse the Antifa Thugs of today with what your father was.

I'm not. My father fought against religious bigotry and the demonization of blacks, gays, history deniers and intellectuals. Same thing Antifa does today.

 

[Kfox]

The economy up to record levels?? Trumps 3rd quarter of 2020 saw the economy grow by 33%. Wow. Impressive, right? Do these people with their houses burning realize that only came after Trump destroyed the economy by over 30% because of his failed and ignorant covid policies that killed Americans? "Never fear! I'm a firefighter here to save your house! Never mind that I'm the one that set your stupid house on fire...."

Ay caramba....

When Trump entered office, the economy grew by leaps and bounds. After Covid hit, we purposely destroyed the economy because we thought it would help end covid (wrong) But destroying the economy was not a part of his policies, his governing policies was what built it up in the beginning of his presidency. People who like Trump like his governing policies, not the way we destroyed the economy due to Covid

 

[Shadow Wolf]

Call me cynical but I think most people in most places would be all for fascism as long as the fascists were on their side.

Although very few of the people benefiting from it would call it that.

That sounds like the excessively pessimistic views that it's Lord of Flies and everyone suddenly loses thousands and thousands of years of evolution that shapped us into who we are as a species, and centuries of political developments that aren't going to be erased from existence or forgotten.