Fascism - Why...

[Estro Felino]

It's "fascist" to support universal healthcare?!

That's a new one...

Fascism is a term invented by Italians between the beginning of the 20th century and WW1 to designate the farmers' unions, especially in Southern Italy. Then it started to be used by nationalists and former socialists (like Mussolini) to create a new party, the National Fascist Party.
The origin is proletarian, not elitist.

Mussolini used these militias to intimidate and punish the financial élites.

That's what fascism is. It has nothing to do with the Republican party.

 

[Stevicus]

I should have thought Biden's famous "Inflation Reduction" Act was an attempt at the sort of Roosevelt-style domestic pump-priming that would help. But he doesn't seem to be getting much credit for that.

I wouldn't go so far as to compare it to the New Deal or anything like that. But it's still largely within the framework of maintaining the status quo. I supported it and I recognize there were good things about it, but it was also limited in its scope. It wasn't really any real solution to the overall problems we're facing over the long term. More like a band-aid than a cure.

 

[wellwisher]

... do so many Americans desperately want it?

("inspired" by the thread regarding Trump at the next election)

Fascism is about having the Government control culture and business with an iron fist. The type of person who would want this is someone who does not feel self reliant, but is more comfortable being a cog in a machine.

The opposite would be an open Democratic society of freedoms, where each person carves out their own piece of the pie. With the break up of the family, the self reliance of the family unit was lost by many, being taking over by the Welfare state. This is the half way house toward Fascism.

When the family was strong, there was a team affect, based on intimate blood connections. With the breakup of the intimate family team, this was replaced by strangers, who help you for their job. These is less security, unless Government controls the entire process.

Trump was not a good Fascist, since he worked toward jobs, self reliance and smaller government, which made the real Fascist panic and project. Fascism and limited Government do not go together. Limited Government does not have the power to control all that a Fascist wants to control. I suppose the Fascist can twist the law.

 

[Arthur Brain]

Fascism is a term invented by Italians between the beginning of the 20th century and WW1 to designate the farmers' unions, especially in Southern Italy. Then it started to be used by nationalists and former socialists (like Mussolini) to create a new party, the National Fascist Party.
The origin is proletariat, not elitist.

Mussolini used these militias to intimidate and punish the financial élites.

That's what fascism is. It has nothing to do with the Republican party.

What's that got to do with universal healthcare?

 

[PureX]

Fascism is a term invented by Italians between the beginning of the 20th century and WW1 to designate the farmers' unions, especially in Southern Italy. Then it started to be used by nationalists and former socialists (like Mussolini) to create a new party, the National Fascist Party.
The origin is proletariat, not elitist.

Mussolini used these militias to intimidate and punish the financial élites.

That's what fascism is. It has nothing to do with the Republican party.

Fascists seek out the largest most disgruntled groups of people within the general population and proclaim themselves to be the champions and benefactors of those people so long as they will support them. At the same time, they identify and target some smaller, relatively defenseless group or groups within the population to take the blame for, and to be the focus of the larger group's anger and frustration. But they are lying on both counts, as they have no intention of being anyone's benefactors, and they coudn't care less who takes the blame for other people's frustrations as long as it's not them.

 

[exchemist]

I wouldn't go so far as to compare it to the New Deal or anything like that. But it's still largely within the framework of maintaining the status quo. I supported it and I recognize there were good things about it, but it was also limited in its scope. It wasn't really any real solution to the overall problems we're facing over the long term. More like a band-aid than a cure.

Hmm. I suspect the real cure is something to bring the country together. There's a lot of alienation - in the UK too. I'm afraid I think that's what you get by promoting the idea of individualism as strongly as we have done for the last 30 years.

What was striking to me in the covid pandemic was this fund of goodwill and yearning to pull together. It was as if we needed an excuse to say just hello to one another and help. But modern politics does not encourage that - and both our countries had at the time leaders that blew it completely.

 

[Estro Felino]

Fascists seek out the largest most disgruntled groups of people within the general population and proclaim themselves to be the champions and benefactors of those people so long as they will support them. At the same time, they identify and target some smaller, relatively defenseless group or groups within the population to take the blame for, and to be the focus of the larger group's anger and frustration. But they are lying on both counts, as they have no intention of being anyone's benefactors, and they coudn't care less who takes the blame for other people's frustrations as long as it's not them.

A hundred times better than American leftists who claim to be fighting for the commoners, while they roll red carpets at bankers, at financial élites and speculators who are the responsible for the commoners' troubles and misfortunes, in the first place.

They claim to be for peace, while they want Ukrainians to keep fighting in that war, so Putin can be defeated: and they die, die, die.

The most incoherent, contradictory party in world history.

Wait, wait, how did Gabbard call them? A party driven by an elitist cabal of warmongers.

Best definition ever.

 

[Sand Dancer]

... do so many Americans desperately want it?

("inspired" by the thread regarding Trump at the next election)

Because many want America for Christian whites, where men are in charge of everything and everyone else does what they are told. Rules are never made to be broken.

 

[Secret Chief]

Because many want America for Christian whites, where men are in charge of everything and everyone else does what they are told. Rules are never made to be broken.

That pretty much sums up the impression I get.

 

[PureX]

A hundred times better than American leftists who claim to be fighting for the commoners, while they roll red carpets at bankers, at financial élites and speculators who are the responsible for the commoners' troubles and misfortunes, in the first place.

They claim to be for peace, while they want Ukrainians to keep fighting in that war and to die, die, die.

The most incoherent, contradictory party in world history.

Wait, wait, how did Gabbard call them? An elitist cabal of warmongers.

Best definition ever.

Turns out the Ukrainians are kicking Putin's a$$. I watched a video just yesterday of them sinking three Russian navy ships that were guarding Putin's supply bridge, and then systematically destroying the defenses on the bridge, and the bridge, itself. All in the span of about 40 minutes.

I also saw a video of the Ukrainian soldiers trapping and destroying a whole convoy of Russian tanks without the Russian tanks even being able to figure out how to fight back. The Russian tanks were literally running into each other in panicked confusion. The Russians are now pulling 50 year old tanks out of mothballs and putting untrained conscripted soldiers in them because they have nothing left to fight with.

Putin decided to play the imperialist conqueror and the rest of the world said "no". And now sadly the Russian people are paying a very dear price for his arrogance. Their army has been decimated and humiliated before the world, and Putin has achieved the exact opposite of what he intended.

This is why we humans should never allow ourselves to fall for these fascist's promises of power, and control, and revenge. All they ever beget is destruction.

 

[Kfox]

As for the economy, where's the "fire", if Trump did such a great job in his last term? Has the US economy tanked disastrously under Biden? We see little evidence of that over here in Europe.

I wouldn’t say the economy has tanked, but it is not as robust as it was under Trump. Biden has undone many of the things Trump did, so gas prices are much higher (gas prices help the poor more than just about anything else) and jobs are not as plentiful as they were before; likely due to increased regulations and higher taxes on big business

 

[Kfox]

Trump and his team tried to overturn the election by a variety of means, not only by encouraging the insurrection at the Capitol - though Trump's performance on that alone would put him beyond the pale in the eyes of anyone that cares about the democratic process. There was also the mafioso-style phone call to Georgia to "find" 11,000 votes, the business with fake electors, the vexatious lawsuits all over the country (more than 60 of them, all thrown out by the judges), the lies about alleged flaws in the Dominion voting machines, and so on. All of which is unprecedented, quite disgusting and evidence of a determined attempt to subvert the democratic process.

Yeah that's stuff Trump did. I'm not talking about Trump, I'm talking about his "fan club". The people who voted for him didn't do any of that stuff.

 

[Evangelicalhumanist]

Yeah that's stuff Trump did. I'm not talking about Trump, I'm talking about his "fan club". The people who voted for him didn't do any of that stuff.

And if they vote for him again?

 

[Estro Felino]

Turns out the Ukrainians are kicking Putin's a$$. I watched a video just yesterday of them sinking three Russian navy ships that were guarding Putin's supply bridge, and then systematically destroying the defenses on the bridge, and the bridge, itself. All in the span of about 40 minutes.

I also saw a video of the Ukrainian soldiers trapping and destroying a whole convoy of Russian tanks without the Russian tanks even being able to figure out how to fight back. The Russian tanks were literally running into each other in panicked confusion. The Russians are now pulling 50 year old tanks out of mothballs and putting untrained conscripted soldiers in them because they have nothing left to fight with.

Putin decided to play the imperialist conqueror and the rest of the world said "no". And now sadly the Russian people are paying a very dear price for his arrogance. Their army has been decimated and humiliated before the world, and Putin has achieved the exact opposite of what he intended.

This is why we humans should never allow ourselves to fall for these fascist's promises of power, and control, and revenge. All they ever beget is destruction.

But the part about the speculators, the bankers and the financial élites...you omitted that part, right?

 

[anna.]

They claim to be for peace, while they want Ukrainians to keep fighting in that war and to die, die, die.

Are you just trolling now. Because that's a flat out lie.

 

[Soandso]

But the part about the speculators, the bankers and the financial élites...you omitted that part, right?

You do realize Trump's tax break benefited the most filthy rich people and corporations in the USA, right? We are talking tens of billions of dollars on that one tax break alone. I'd be curious to see what the liberals have done to touch that

 

[Secret Chief]

That's what fascism is. It has nothing to do with the Republican party.

Once again....fascism is not a historical Italian thing. It's a political ideology. Something that political parties have. Any time, any place.

 

[Estro Felino]

Are you just trolling now. Because that's a flat out lie.

No...it's my personal opinion.
First Amendment, you know: they haven't abolished it yet.
As the OP is free to say that the GOP has some fascists among them, I have the right to say that some leftists are people who send Ukrainians to die, while staying safe and warm at home.
No double standards.

 

[Estro Felino]

You do realize Trump's tax break benefited the most filthy rich people and corporations in the USA, right? We are talking tens of billions of dollars on that one tax break alone. I'd be curious to see what the liberals have done to touch that

Yes.
At least the republicans don't pretend they don't side with those rich people.
The democrats...are more incoherent.

 

[Secret Chief]

send Ukrainians to die,

Nobody is sending anybody. Ukrainians have had their country invaded so they are fighting back. Jeez.