Of course it's obvious.
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Free will and self awareness
- Thread starter 1137
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Of course it's obvious.
PolyHedral
Superabacus Mystic
QM is obvious?
QM? As in quantum mysticism?
Skwim
Veteran Member
So what kind of machinery runs this "self acting agent"? Why does it do X when it acts instead of doing Y?
PolyHedral
Superabacus Mystic
Quantum mechanics is also quasi-deterministic.
Even if something seemed non-deterministic, it could be accounted for with lapses in human knowledge.
That's god of the gaps.
Kilgore Trout
Misanthropic Humanist
I didn't want to make this post, but I couldn't help it. I'd say don't get annoyed at me for posting it, but you can't help it either.
Or logical inference.
PolyHedral
Superabacus Mystic
Quantum mechanics cannot be made deterministic in that way - Bell's Theorem forbids it.
Perhaps you should elaborate, because I don't know how the theorem supports non-determinism.
Lifeforms. Delayed cause or contradictory cause of equal probablilty.
Yerda
Veteran Member
It's obvious it's obvious?
Help me out, man. Can you demonstrate this obviousness?
Yerda
Veteran Member
Aye so, the actual topic.
I found the discussion on avoidance quite interesting, but I have seen it harshly criticised.
What you wrote in the OP reminds me of Dan Dennett's use of the term evitability. Have you read Freedom Evolves?
I found the discussion on avoidance quite interesting, but I have seen it harshly criticised.
I would like to hear more about this. It's intriguing.Self-awareness is not a veto over determinism, only a high-order effect of it. You were destined to question your own motivations.
The equal probability only gets us away from Hard determinism. So long as X and Y are of equal probability then neither can be part of hard determinism because there is room for choice even if something is needed to "tip the scale" as you put it. Our freedom to make a choice outside of hard determinism is what tips the scale. Hard determinism would have it that Y is inevitable where as soft determinism gives us the ability to choose otherwise. There is nothing to tip the scale except our agency. Other life forms are likely stuck with hard determinism but we can see in evolution, organisms begin to have the ability to guide themselves to some extent and it most obvious with sentient beings.
Skwim
Veteran Member
There is no "outside of hard determinism." The problem goes right back to the critical question: What determines your "choice": causality or utter randomness? Ya only got two possibilities, neither of which leads to freewill, or your "freedom to make a choice outside of hard determinism."
How about, as the opposition, you show me an uncaused event. I wish you luck.