Garner Incident-if you can say "I can't breathe," guess what you can breathe

[Thief]

Will? People interested in justice and accountability already were.

I prefer to think the police are willing to face whatever is in front of them.

Or perhaps you could .....cuddle the guy?

 

[JM2C]

I do not see being dead as complying...

Comply as not struggling or resisting anymore because he passed out or dead already

 

[JM2C]

After watching the video I have to disagree. It's not evident at all that the choke hold was the decisive factor in Gerard's death. In fact, because of all the other factors that may have played a part in his demise, the choke holdmay not have been a relevant factor at all.

The least you and I could get for choking someone to death is involuntary manslaughter with a very good $$ lawyer, and that is, without the video.

The city medical examiner has ruled the death of Eric Garner, the 43-year-old father whose death in police custody sparked national outrage, a homicide, saying a chokehold killed him.

The medical examiner said compression of the neck and chest, along with Garner's positioning on the ground while being restrained by police during the July 17 stop on Staten Island, caused his death.

 

[JM2C]

Pull back til he stumbles....THEN tighten what should be the vascular technique.
(I would step back as the large guy begins to drop.....I wouldn't let him fall on me)
Falling forward while applying a choke will tighten the hold.

There is the possibility of a throw and release.
A large fellow might be able to if no one in front of him stops it.
Hence the fall.

In Garner's case none of that happened

 

[Thief]

In Garner's case none of that happened

Yeah ....I know....too bad?....right?

Also too bad, the bad boy had not the sense to go quietly to jail.

 

[CMike]

Article 120 NY Penal Law | Assault Menacing Stalking |NY Law

So?

 

[Robert.Evans]

These are my thoughts after watching the video.

Garner resisted arrest. If you resist arrest you aren't going to be treated gently.

The headlock/chockehold or whatever it was didn't stop Garner from breathing.

How do we know this? Because during the hold Garner kept saying "I can't breathe, I can't breathe".

Well, guess what? If you can say repeatedly "I can't breathe", you can breathe.

He died mainly because of his health conditions; asthma, heart issues, etc.

I think the moral of the story is that if you have health problems, don't resist arrest.

Let the flames begin.

You know, that is exactly what I thought. If you can say it, you can breathe,so it was not the headlock, it was asthma. Good idea, me thinks, not to get into fights when you have asthma..... that is all.

 

[McBell]

Comply as not struggling or resisting anymore because he passed out or dead already

comply involves consent, intention.
Dead people do neither.

 

[metis]

Depends on what the charges are based on.

But if the neither the choke hold nor the heart attack can be cited as the cause then the choke hold can't be considered as decisive and deemed the basis for any charges.

Again, it does not have to be proven as being decisive in order for charges to be brought up. For example, a true case that took place decades ago in California:

A man took his young son, bashed the son's head against the wall of his garage, put the child on a hot barbeque grill, and then buried him afterword. It could not be determined exactly which of these three actions actually was the final thing that killed the child. Now, are you saying that this father should be not charged?

 

[metis]

They didn't intend to kill him. They attempted to arrest him. He resisted.

The action performed led to his death, so intent does not have to be there for any and all charges that could have possibly been put forth, such as with "negligent homicide".

 

[metis]

Who has made the claim that resisting arrest warrants killing a suspect?​

Not I.

 

[JM2C]

comply involves consent, intention.
Dead people do neither.

He complied first till he stop breathing. He was tapping out by saying “I can’t breathe” and that’s complying with their demands but they kept the pressure on till he passed out.

 

[McBell]

He complied first till he stop breathing. He was tapping out by saying “I can’t breathe” and that’s complying with their demands but they kept the pressure on till he passed out.

So what is with the whole "dead" part?
he did not die until well after the incident that caused him to pass out.

 

[Robert.Evans]

Yikes. I didn't know what it meant either and I was afraid to look it up because it basically means what I thought it would mean. I'm disappointed in Mestemia. He isn't usually that cruel. You don't deserve that.

Yes he is!

 

[JM2C]

So what is with the whole "dead" part?

he did not die until well after the incident that caused him to pass out.

The end result is death, wasn’t it? But before he died he said “I can’t breathe” like he was tapping out as a means of complying or submitting with consent to their demands till he passed out that caused brain damage or lack of oxygen to the brain and eventually death occurred. He was not like struggling to the end until he passed out. He stopped struggling because he can’t breathe, but before this he was struggling as in not complying to their demands but when he can’t or having a hard time breathing he stopped struggling or he gave up to their demands, if that is the word you are looking for, “

comply involves consent, intention. Dead people do neither.

 

[McBell]

The end result is death, wasn’t it? But before he died he said “I can’t breathe” like he was tapping out as a means of complying or submitting with consent to their demands till he passed out that caused brain damage or lack of oxygen to the brain and eventually death occurred. He was not like struggling to the end until he passed out. He stopped struggling because he can’t breathe, but before this he was struggling as in not complying to their demands but when he can’t or having a hard time breathing he stopped struggling or he gave up to their demands, if that is the word you are looking for, “

He stopped struggling cause he could not breathe?
I wonder how much truth there is to this?

I know when I cannot breathe I struggle to be able to get into a position where I can breathe.
I grant you that the struggle would have been for a different reason.

Yes the end result was death.
But AFTER the indecent was over.

which still does not show that a dead person, or one that is unconscious, can comply with wanything.

 

[JM2C]

He stopped struggling cause he could not breathe?
I wonder how much truth there is to this?

The choker went to the neck where the air pass through the lungs to breathe.

I know when I cannot breathe I struggle to be able to get into a position where I can breathe.

Not when four or five heavy guys on top of you, you can’t struggle at all.[/quote]

I grant you that the struggle would have been for a different reason.

Struggling as resisting arrest is different from struggling to breathe. When he was uttering the “I can’t breathe” he passed that resisting/struggle already and automatically switch to that human instinct, and that is, struggling for life.

If you can’t breathe and with 5-6 guys on top you, pinning you down, then your chance of survival by breathing alone is very slim until you pass out.

 

[Robert.Evans]

Racism is not two spheres of white people vs black people. It's one sphere of systemic dehumanization against people of color. It's why blacks can be racist toward each other. And it's why white people can be victimized if they fit the partial description of the profile of a common criminal.

I do need to dig up a good source, but I've read that unarmed black men are 21 times more likely to be killed by law enforcement than white men with both suspects committing the same crimes. So I'll introduce that point for refutation or as a plea to find the corroborating source.

Race is a big part if the problem of the disparate justice. It isn't the only part, since I think socio-economic classes, gender, and age plays some factors as well in regards to who fits the description of the common criminal.

''racism'', my multiarmed squishy hugger, can be anything, in one looks at enough dictionaries..... colour, skin, hair, beliefs, ideas, job, football team, etc etc. One example given was a ''race of solicitors'', what you might call lawers. It has been narrowed down over time, to manipulate a certain group of people, mostly whites.

 

[dust1n]

I have seen a report on Garner's arrest record......
He was a bad boy.

Approaching a large fellow with such background....I would expect resistance.
I would not know his medical condition....and would not care.
His demeanor and his background bring caution.....and firm action.

You should see the record of the cop who put him in a choke hold.
Using a technique banned by your own police department in entirely unnecessary circumstances resulting in the death of someone should be punishable, not rewarded with paid vacation pending investigation.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

So?

You CAN read my posts!

You ignored so many of my questions in this thread that I figured you just couldn't see them.