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God does not care if I go to hell

FunctionalAtheist

Hammer of Reason
My previous topics were just way too long for anyone to bother reading and replying to. Therefore, I will make this topic which summarizes my point I wish to discuss. I am not lying when I said that I have looked into everything I possibly could with an honest open mind and heart. I am still undecided on the existence of God and the afterlife. So why wouldn't God reveal himself to me and his truth for someone like me who does indeed have an honest open mind and heart? It makes no sense to me unless God is uncaring, unloving, etc. and he doesn't really care that I go to hell for not believing and not serving him.
a) He doesn't want to reveal himself to you! (Note that evidently he has revealed himself to countless of others, if you are to believe them.)
b) He is not capable of revealing himself to you! Maybe he's not aware of your existence. Maybe there is something about you that blocks his ability. E.g. maybe you are required to accept him completely and fully without any evidence whatsoever before he is capable of revealing himself (lol), meaning he is not a very rational individual.
c) Maybe, like Ramses, he has chosen to harden your heart so he can at some point use you to glorify himself.
d) All of the above.
e) He doesn't exist.

After a very long, open, and honest search, the question you are now asking came to my mind in a strong way. As you say, I can be very wordy, so I'll try to boil it down, as this is one of a few very solid reassurances to me that either their is no god, or that he doesn't care (not about us) about our beliefs. In fact, if there is a benevelent god, and his primary concern is how we behave here-and-now, on this earth, when we treat our fellow man, then he would do everything in his power to ensure there were absolutely no disagreements about his nature or what he wanted. I'll try to expand.

So many religions that I'm aware of, from my background, insist that it is the after-life, the hereafter, that we must prepare for. At the same time they insist that it is our deeds/works here-and-now which earn these hereafter rewards. They also insist that one must believe, have faith, in the metaphysical mumbo jumbo of the day. They try to personalize god, relate to god, speak for what they believe is god's will, commands, requirements. Try to force, or preach, or judge the lack of, these beliefs.

There are literally 1000s of different iterations, and there is little in the world today that causes more conflict, from all out war, beheading, bombings, to just the better than though judgmental attitudes that many have towards others of differing opinions.

All because (assuming there is a god) god has chosen to reveal some things to some people, but most are left to GUESS which one of god's prophets are right, and GUESS which one of the 1000s of preachers interpretations are right. Not only that, but how many of these have actually read any of the books for themselves.

90% of the turmoil in the wolds today, is a direct result of god being an incredibly poor communicator!

I don't believe that, I reject that. It is people's failure to communicate and or accept others rights.

So, if there is a god, and god's will is that people should do the most good HERE AND NOW....And let's face it, if the goal is get to the hereafter, then doeSn't that require, or should, doing the most good here and now?...then god HAS THE RESPONSIBILITY, as easy as it should be, to clearly communicate to every single person exactly what his goal or plan is.

How would that interfere with freewill? It wouldn't any more than making people guess what he wants. A) I've heard god want's...but I still do.... of B) I know for a fact what god wants...but I still do....

Now, god was one other option to be legitimate. He could ensure that no one has any knowledge of him, no one understands his will, no one anywhere can speak for him, no one can judge others based on their beliefs. Why is this an option?

Like I said, 90% of the world's problems stem from conflicting religious beliefs. These beliefs focus on the hereafter. When someone believes they must harm others, or judge others, or stop someone else from living a life of their choosing here and now, so that they can gain a reward hereafter, then they are not doing the most good here and now.

If the goal is the most good here and now, then ANY reference to god, or the hereafter (short of universal perfect revelation) DISTRACTS from HERE AND NOW.

To wit, I am 100% atheist, not because I am 100% there is no such thing as supernatural. I am 100% atheist because I believe, 100% ((1) that if there is such a thing as supernatural, it is irrelevant to nature, as by definition I see light, a physical substance, I hear sound waves, a physical energy, I smell and taste chemicals, I have no ability to sense in anyway any sort of supernature.) And 2) Even if there is a god, he obviously has chosen not to reveal himself universally, and as such any reference to him distracts from the most good here and now.

I can't help a transient on the street (or many would not) if they hold up a sign saying "Ala Bless!" if I'm concerned about what god thinks. I can't help a young woman in need if she had an abortion. I witnessed a 11 year old girls struck by lightning. I gave her CPR, luckily there were EMS there as I was sponsering a Kid Fish event with 100s of people. The girl died 3 times, there on the ground, in the ambulance, and in the life flight. She lived. We had a benefit to help pay her 1/4 million $ bills.

Her pastor campaigned against the benefit, told his congregation they would go to hell if they helped, and said that god struck the little girl down because her mother didn't come to church and tithe every sunday and dated more than one man. Now, I know that's extreme.

My point is....If you focus on HERE AND NOW then god couldn't care less what you 'believe' or 'preach' or 'have faith in.' You do the most good you can here and now and you'll do fine. But as soon as you focus on HEREAFTER you will enter a maze of confusion, 1000s of conflicting prophets, and yes even murder in the name of god.

I'm an atheist, even if god exists, because it is the ONLY ethical choice. Even if god exists, I'm perfectly sure he would want me to live as if he didn't. There is not an ethical or moral decision to be made that ignoring god and thinking here and now doesn't clarify; while pondering god's many conflicting revelations and thinking hereafter doesn't muddle.

There may be a god, if there is, he loves the one's that ignore him.
 

FunctionalAtheist

Hammer of Reason
Forget all those other topics I have made. What I want to discuss here is that it is not my choice in going to hell. How can it be my choice if my disbelief in God was out of a genuine and honest mindset? My disbelief is through an honest open mind and heart and I wish to know how I can possibly be held accountable for something like that.
You can't be held accountable, not in any fair or just system. Only ignorant fools who focus on the hereafter could possibly pretend to speak for god and tell you you'll be held accountable.
 

cataway

Well-Known Member
if there is no God, how can there be a hell ? that is were you get your silly ideas from ,right ?
 

cataway

Well-Known Member
if there is no God, how can there be a hell ? that is were you get your silly ideas from ,right ?
 

cataway

Well-Known Member
if there is no God, how can th
God doesn't care if you go to hell because god is a manmade concept and not a thing which exists in reality.

ere be a hell ? that is were you get your silly ideas from ,right ?
 

FunctionalAtheist

Hammer of Reason
Well, if your disbelief is sincere and you could not find God no matter how hard you tried, I'm sure He will take that into consideration, as His mercy is far more than His wrath.
If his mercy were so great, don't you think he'd let everyone know exactly where he stood so ISIS would stop beheading, xtians would stop bombing mosques and temples, women would stop having abortions
 

cataway

Well-Known Member
God doesn't care if you go to hell because god is a manmade concept and not a thing which exists in reality.[QUOTQ] if there is no God, how can there be a hell ? that is were you get your silly ideas from ,right ?
 

Thief

Rogue Theologian
My previous topics were just way too long for anyone to bother reading and replying to. Therefore, I will make this topic which summarizes my point I wish to discuss. I am not lying when I said that I have looked into everything I possibly could with an honest open mind and heart. I am still undecided on the existence of God and the afterlife. So why wouldn't God reveal himself to me and his truth for someone like me who does indeed have an honest open mind and heart? It makes no sense to me unless God is uncaring, unloving, etc. and he doesn't really care that I go to hell for not believing and not serving him.
it's like the Prime Directive in Star Trek fame.....

it's hands off
revelation could be disruptive to the natural development
(of course, some tweaking must occur)

you're here to learn all that you can before you die.....
a simple plan

then you get to make presentation....
just like the preamble in the book of Job
 

FunctionalAtheist

Hammer of Reason
I thought John was pretty clear on this.

John 3:
16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

17 For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved.

18 He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.​


.
Oh, well, if you are going to quote scripture you'll most likely upset more theists than atheists. :) Both those that cotton not to the NT, and those that do but don't really believe it!
 

FunctionalAtheist

Hammer of Reason
Doesn't this depend on which specific flavour of God you're talking about?
Perhaps in some sects of Christianity disbelief is enough to warrant hell, most seem to favour the idea that God takes into account sincerety and effort.
Yes! You might go to hell, you might not! It all depends on which FLAVOR you choose. Choose wisely my son!
 

FunctionalAtheist

Hammer of Reason
But what else is there to convince me? I have already looked and researched into all the claimed evidence out there regarding both God/afterlife as well as the skeptics with an honest open mind and heart. That is all anyone could ever do. There is nothing more that can be done. If I remain undecided after all that, then that is the way it is and nothing more can be done.
If you are open minded, if you are rational, if you need convincing, then there may be times in life when you find comfort and even believe in divinity, but you will never ever be convinced. Unless you stop being open-minded and rational.

I would recommend, instead of convincing that god exists, you think about your questions and search for answers that bring you peace. Until you have that keep asking questions. Every answer you find should bring more questions. Answers do not increase understanding and knowledge. It is the questions we continually ask that do that.
 

Etritonakin

Well-Known Member
My previous topics were just way too long for anyone to bother reading and replying to. Therefore, I will make this topic which summarizes my point I wish to discuss. I am not lying when I said that I have looked into everything I possibly could with an honest open mind and heart. I am still undecided on the existence of God and the afterlife. So why wouldn't God reveal himself to me and his truth for someone like me who does indeed have an honest open mind and heart? It makes no sense to me unless God is uncaring, unloving, etc. and he doesn't really care that I go to hell for not believing and not serving him.

Hell isn't what you probably think. God is said to be like a refiner's fire -and "hell" is the last part of the refinement process -for those who need it.
It is written that God is ABLE to destroy both body and spirit in Gehenna -but that is not to say that is what he WILL do.
One verse speaks of unbelievers having their PART in the lake of fire.
That unbelief is not simply innocently not knowing -but even those will be SAVED -"yet so as by fire".

God reveals things as he sees fit -but has also said he will satisfy those who thirst for righteousness and understanding. The bible is also written in a way which requires an in-depth study. It takes time. Praying for understanding also helps.
God says if you draw near to him in righteousness and prayer, he will draw near to you
The most important thing is to do what you know to be right -and even knowledge of that increases over time.

1 Cor 3:15
If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire.
 

FunctionalAtheist

Hammer of Reason
it's like the Prime Directive in Star Trek fame.....

it's hands off
revelation could be disruptive to the natural development
(of course, some tweaking must occur)

you're here to learn all that you can before you die.....
a simple plan

then you get to make presentation....
just like the preamble in the book of Job
I like the prime directive analogy, and the revelation could be disruptive is excellent. But then why are there so many conflicting revelations? Aren't 100s of conflicting revelations magnitudes of order more disruptive than either NO knowledge of god, or universal revelation?
 

Rapha

Active Member
This is yet another one of those wild claims out there. Also, I have looked and researched into all the claimed evidence out there regarding Christianity as well as the skeptics with an honest open mind and heart and I have to remain undecided
Well, I posted a vision some years ago and got contacted by 2 angels. So why would God bother with a skeptic who will scoff at everything God shows them ?

What is the point ? Anyway, according to the pope (Sept 23 2015) and UN (Dec 23 2016), the antichrist will be in place on 23rd Sept 2017.

So if none of Christianity is true, then why are the globalists obeying their Book of Lies, and going to ram the Mark of the Beast down everyone's throat before the end of this year ?

They have already successfully reduced Damascus to a 'ruinous heap' as stated in the Bible and turned a third of world water bitter (radioactiive via Fukushima).
 

George-ananda

Advaita Vedanta, Theosophy, Spiritualism
Premium Member
My previous topics were just way too long for anyone to bother reading and replying to. Therefore, I will make this topic which summarizes my point I wish to discuss. I am not lying when I said that I have looked into everything I possibly could with an honest open mind and heart. I am still undecided on the existence of God and the afterlife. So why wouldn't God reveal himself to me and his truth for someone like me who does indeed have an honest open mind and heart? It makes no sense to me unless God is uncaring, unloving, etc. and he doesn't really care that I go to hell for not believing and not serving him.
My thought is many of us need to modernize our thinking about God from the old school Abrahamic religions. You are thinking of God in the old school way as an external being that needs to come to you in something akin to a booming voice to give you direction.

I personally see God as not some external being separate from us but as the core mysterious consciousness within all living things. To hear from God then becomes the task of clearing our minds from the noise and desires produced by the external world and experiencing more of the peace, love and bliss that is our core.
 

ronandcarol

Member
Premium Member
I am still undecided on the existence of God and the afterlife. So why wouldn't God reveal himself to me.
I found your answer within your own post. You don't believe what the Bible is telling you!
Read 1 John 1:9, and than believe it.
The more you read and study, the more you will grow. His word says that if you ask for faith He will give it. His Word also says that He is not wanting any to perish but for all to come to the knowledge of His Son, the Savior of the world.

ronandcarol
 
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