God said it, not me...

[rusra02]

The Bible is untrue though, this is easily proven to the point where I feel overwhelmed on where to even start.

The Bible has survived centuries of attacks, both physical and intellectual. I am convinced it is God's Word, and as Jesus said; "Sanctify them by means of the truth; your word is truth." (John 17:17)

 

[McBell]

The Bible has survived centuries of attacks, both physical and intellectual. I am convinced it is God's Word, and as Jesus said; "Sanctify them by means of the truth; your word is truth." (John 17:17)

Ignoring the truth does not make it false.

 

[Sonny]

1. You are going to hell because that is what God says happens to people like you.

2. Should Christians bear no responsibility for the awful things they say in the name of their vengeful God?

1. The only people who go to hell are those who reject God (refuse to accept His payment for our sins, the shed blood of Jesus Christ). No one has to go to hell.
2. No. Why would they? Since the earth is God's property He, alone, gets to set the rules- just as you do for your possessions and property.

 

[McBell]

1. The only people who go to hell are those who reject God (refuse to accept His payment for our sins, the shed blood of Jesus Christ). No one has to go to hell.
2. No. Why would they? Since the earth is God's property He, alone, gets to set the rules- just as you do for your possessions and property.

And yet I am still responsible for the things I say, regardless of whose property it is.
Why do you give your god a free pass?

 

[savagewind]

The Bible has survived centuries of attacks, both physical and intellectual. I am convinced it is God's Word, and as Jesus said; "Sanctify them by means of the truth; your word is truth." (John 17:17)

Jesus is the word. John 1:1 Jesus is the truth. John 14:6

I think that it is amazing that for your many, many hours of Bible study, you do not know that yet.

 

[Kapalika]

The Bible has survived centuries of attacks, both physical and intellectual. I am convinced it is God's Word, and as Jesus said; "Sanctify them by means of the truth; your word is truth." (John 17:17)

A short study of the history of religious interpretation and scientific discovery would debunk that. Look at biology, geology, astronomy, or chemistry for example.

Jesus is the word. John 1:1 Jesus is the truth. John 14:6

I think that it is amazing that for your many, many hours of Bible study, you do not know that yet.

Just because something says it's telling the truth doesn't mean it is.

 

[savagewind]

A short study of the history of religious interpretation and scientific discovery would debunk that. Look at biology, geology, astronomy, or chemistry for example.



Just because something says it's telling the truth doesn't mean it is.

I think you might mean that anyone who says he or she is telling the truth doesn't mean he or she is. It is my opinion that things can not tell the truth because they can't tell anything at all.

 

[rusra02]

A short study of the history of religious interpretation and scientific discovery would debunk that. Look at biology, geology, astronomy, or chemistry for example.



Just because something says it's telling the truth doesn't mean it is.

I find nothing in the Bible debunked by science.

 

[McBell]

I find nothing in the Bible debunked by science.

That only means honest discussion you on the topic will not be possible.

 

[Muffled]

If any sin leads to hell, we are all going there.

I believe you would be correct if there had not been an intervention.

 

[Muffled]

I was raised believing that my suffering could atone for sin and save souls from hell. So I inflicted suffering on myself

I was foolish for believing such nonsense! I don't wish hell on Christians who are preaching this foolishness because I was one of them, but they also shouldn't be without consequence for it either.

They should wake up, be enlightened, and recognize the damage their toxic Dogmas are doing to people. They should suffer some consequence for the psychological damage they do and the lives they ruin. I've known monks that live lives of self-denial and penance, chronically inflicting suffering on themselves thinking it is saving souls, atoning for sin, and appeasing the angry God.

Their lives are ruined!

If they were talking about anyone suffering other than Jesus I believe they were in error. The truth is that Jesus reduces suffering through His saving grace.

I believe sometimes that works but there are no guarantees.

I believe I would consider that antithetical.

I believe you should not be so hard on yourself. I have taken decades to overcome some aspects of parental teaching.

I believe that is not for you to say anymore than one can say a person dying in military action wasted his life. I believe each life has its purpose and nothing is ever wasted.

 

[Muffled]

I disagree if I take it in the Christian perspective. Sin was paid for on the Cross. If any sin leads to Hell, and we all sin every day, then there is no salvation because no one is perfect.

I believe you need to read what I said in post#90.

I believe God has always forgiven sins but never had to pay such a high price to convince people that He meant it.

 

[allfoak]

I believe that a belief is nothing but a thought that we keep thinking.

be·lief
bəˈlēf/
noun

1. an acceptance that a statement is true or that something exists.
   "his belief in the value of hard work"
2. 
   trust, faith, or confidence in someone or something.
   "a belief in democratic politics"
   synonyms: faith, trust, reliance, confidence, credence
   

 

[Muffled]

That only means honest discussion you on the topic will not be possible.

I believe what that means is that you can't back up your beliefs and your only way to keep your cherished false beliefs is to flee discussion.

 

[Nakosis]

That only means honest discussion you on the topic will not be possible.

I think an honest discussion is still possible. A person can still be honest about their beliefs/position. However a scientific discussion, probably not so much.

 

[Kenny]

I believe you need to read what I said in post#90.

I believe God has always forgiven sins but never had to pay such a high price to convince people that He meant it.

Could you rephrase? Or tell me how "but never had to pay such a high price to convince people that He meant it." is relevant?

He did have to pay a high price, but not to convince people that He meant it. It was just the payment. (In Christian terms) But, yes, without intervention we would be in deep trouble.

 

[McBell]

I believe what that means is that you can't back up your beliefs and your only way to keep your cherished false beliefs is to flee discussion.

you are free to believe whatever you like.
But just to prove a point, what beliefs, exactly, do you claim I cannot "back up"?

And then please show that said beliefs are in fact false and not just a bold empty claim by you.

since we both know you cannot, seems you are the one guilty of that which you claim of me.

 

[Muffled]

Could you rephrase? Or tell me how "but never had to pay such a high price to convince people that He meant it." is relevant?

He did have to pay a high price, but not to convince people that He meant it. It was just the payment. (In Christian terms) But, yes, without intervention we would be in deep trouble.

I once asked a Jewish person I worked with if he were celebrating the Day of Atonement. He said yes but he didn't believe he was forgiven. I heard a story of a tenant telling his landlord that he washes so much because he is trying to get rid of his sin. When asked if he believed he was forgiven , he said no. Without the cross even though the scriptures say God will forgive no-one is really sure. I am sure because Jesus died for my sins.

 

[Muffled]

you are free to believe whatever you like.
But just to prove a point, what beliefs, exactly, do you claim I cannot "back up"?

And then please show that said beliefs are in fact false and not just a bold empty claim by you.

since we both know you cannot, seems you are the one guilty of that which you claim of me.

rusra02 said: I find nothing in the Bible debunked by science.
Mestemia, That only means honest discussion you on the topic will not be possible.

The belief that the Bible is debunked by science. I believe you have no valid facts.

I believe I can't do that until you say what facts you think you have.

I believe you have made an assumption with no basis in facts.

I believe I do not go by assumption but rely on facts. There are many people on RF who believe in science but none of them has come up with anything valid. If there actually was something one would think it would be better known. Like rusra02 I just don't believe there is anything.

 

[Cephus]

You are going to hell because that is what God says happens to people like you.

Should Christians bear no responsibility for the awful things they say in the name of their vengeful God?

The idea that someone claims God said something is absurd. Prove it. Prove your imaginary friend exists in the first place. Having blind faith is not proof. I'm not interested in what someone says, I'm interested in what they can prove.