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God's Will as the Sum of Total Parts?

The Sum of Awe

Brought to you by the moment that spacetime began.
Staff member
Premium Member
Randomly thinking about it today at work (and I think of the most random stuff at work for some reason), I was trying to think of a way to explain my idea of God. I have tried multiple ways, but it's really hard. Not sure if it's too complicated to explain, or if I simply suck at explaining things, or both.

The best way I've done it so far is by explaining how I see a pattern in the universe that makes it seem like it's acting as one, whole, entire body, but the unique thing about this body is that it is its own energy source. It reuses everything. It doesn't eliminate things that threaten it, it simply reconstructs them to be a productive thing. Anyways, I'd have to go into entire paragraphs of detail to explain this pattern.

"Pantheism" doesn't get the point across really, it's too broad of a word. Pantheism could break down into lots of branches if you think about it: Is everything individually God when separated or Is everything together God? Is God conscious or unconscious? Is the divinity found in nature more philosophical or is it literal? etc. etc.

And simply saying "all is God" is as broad as a metalhead saying their favorite genre is metal.

I thought of a way to explain it; and thought I'd like to share it to see if anyone thinks it clears it up well enough to get the point. God as the sum of total parts.

It hit me when I spilled a full feedcart accidentally running over a stillborn. I'm not sure why, but when I'm angry about something that happened under natural conditions I curse out "Thanks God!" sarcastically, usually thinking about Yahweh. Just in case Yahweh is the true God of man, I'm not letting him get by that easy for something he could've prevented ;)

Well, then i thought about my determinism. Every action, done by either a living or non-living thing, is a cause of the sum of all other actions.

"Well, let's put this in my worldview's perspective" I thought. "It wouldn't have happened if someone hadn't laid the dead in the middle of the damn hallway. But then again, that person wouldn't have laid it in the hallway if they didn't have something else to do preventing them from actually putting it where it belongs. THEN again, that wouldn't have happened if X didn't happen to make them have to do that something else that made them busy... etc. etc."

All events occurring and all events that have occurred are simply the sum of all other events before it.

A yard gets full of leaves because the leaves fell off the tree. The leaves fell off the tree because there was wind. There was wind because of atmospheric pressure. There was that level of atmospheric pressure because of the unequal heating of the earth's surface. There was unequal heating because of something with the sun (thanks google), etc. It all traces back to the one and only chaotic event to have ever happen, the only occurrence that didn't happen by influence of another thing... the beginning of existence (by logic, the beginning of existence could not be influenced by anything else because that would imply there was something existing that caused it, which would mean existence already existed).

And out of that I came up with a way to sum it up: God is the sum of total parts. Basically, God is every event that occurs. Or at least God's will is every event that occurs (to not limit God to a verb), and that would make God all things, but all things pretty much is every event that occurs.

does this make sense at all?
 

dust1n

Zindīq
The distinction makes sense, but I'm not still not understanding what usefulness one gets from calling the totality of all distinct parts by the name of God.
 

The Sum of Awe

Brought to you by the moment that spacetime began.
Staff member
Premium Member
The distinction makes sense, but I'm not still not understanding what usefulness one gets from calling the totality of all distinct parts by the name of God.

It's ultimately pointless, sure. But I'd say it's the most qualified entity to wear the title.
 

Gjallarhorn

N'yog-Sothep
The will of God is therefore heat death.

"You have to consider the possibility that God does not like you, never wanted you, in all probability he hates you. It's not the worst thing that could happen."
 

The Sum of Awe

Brought to you by the moment that spacetime began.
Staff member
Premium Member
The will of God is therefore heat death.

"You have to consider the possibility that God does not like you, never wanted you, in all probability he hates you. It's not the worst thing that could happen."

What do you mean by heat death? I'd say that if heat death were isolated, it would no longer be God. If god's all, that implies God is both the good and the wicked.

Nice quote from a good movie by the way :D
 

Gjallarhorn

N'yog-Sothep
What do you mean by heat death? I'd say that if heat death were isolated, it would no longer be God. If god's all, that implies God is both the good and the wicked.

Nice quote from a good movie by the way :D

Heat death is the ultimate end of the universe. All energy is moving from a state of high to low. It's not isolated; it's everywhere. That would mean God, or at least a pantheistic god, wants us collectively dead.
 

The Sum of Awe

Brought to you by the moment that spacetime began.
Staff member
Premium Member
Heat death is the ultimate end of the universe. All energy is moving from a state of high to low. It's not isolated; it's everywhere. That would mean God, or at least a pantheistic god, wants us collectively dead.

If that's where the series of events ends us up at, yeah. Everything ends, but that temporary moment of its being is also to be considered.
 

The Sum of Awe

Brought to you by the moment that spacetime began.
Staff member
Premium Member
I wasn't aware anything was competing for it.

Nothing is, true :D I suppose the actual title "God" itself is not well-defined and is as loose as Madonna.

For me, at least, it feels more comfortable to view everything around me as sacred. And because of the pattern I see in the universe as described in the first post, I'm convinced that calling it God isn't useless, and I can't find any title more fitting for it.
 

Madhuri

RF Goddess
Staff member
Premium Member
And out of that I came up with a way to sum it up: God is the sum of total parts. Basically, God is every event that occurs. Or at least God's will is every event that occurs (to not limit God to a verb), and that would make God all things, but all things pretty much is every event that occurs.

does this make sense at all?

This sounds very Hindu.
 

Willamena

Just me
Premium Member
It reuses everything. It doesn't eliminate things that threaten it, it simply reconstructs them to be a productive thing.
This is the bit that resonates with me the most.
icon14.gif


Is everything individually God when separated or Is everything together God? Is God conscious or unconscious? Is the divinity found in nature more philosophical or is it literal? etc. etc.
Both. :) Necessarily non-eliminative.

It hit me when I spilled a full feedcart accidentally running over a stillborn.
Not meaning to disrespect the dead, but I love the image and the irony.

Well, then i thought about my determinism. Every action, done by either a living or non-living thing, is a cause of the sum of all other actions.

"Well, let's put this in my worldview's perspective" I thought. "It wouldn't have happened if someone hadn't laid the dead in the middle of the damn hallway. But then again, that person wouldn't have laid it in the hallway if they didn't have something else to do preventing them from actually putting it where it belongs. THEN again, that wouldn't have happened if X didn't happen to make them have to do that something else that made them busy... etc. etc."

All events occurring and all events that have occurred are simply the sum of all other events before it.

A yard gets full of leaves because the leaves fell off the tree. The leaves fell off the tree because there was wind. There was wind because of atmospheric pressure. There was that level of atmospheric pressure because of the unequal heating of the earth's surface. There was unequal heating because of something with the sun (thanks google), etc. It all traces back to the one and only chaotic event to have ever happen, the only occurrence that didn't happen by influence of another thing... the beginning of existence (by logic, the beginning of existence could not be influenced by anything else because that would imply there was something existing that caused it, which would mean existence already existed).
By comparison, my philosophy differs in that each "because of" is a beginning and end, in itself, to existence. Each existence is no more or less significant that any other, even the imagined "first."

A unique event complete unto itself (its own energy source).

And out of that I came up with a way to sum it up: God is the sum of total parts. Basically, God is every event that occurs. Or at least God's will is every event that occurs (to not limit God to a verb), and that would make God all things, but all things pretty much is every event that occurs.

does this make sense at all?
God is the sum of its total parts, each event that occurs.
 

dust1n

Zindīq
For me, at least, it feels more comfortable to view everything around me as sacred. And because of the pattern I see in the universe as described in the first post, I'm convinced that calling it God isn't useless, and I can't find any title more fitting for it.

I don't doubt the comfort behind viewing things as sacred, but I'd have to know what this pattern is about in order to comment on it.
 

The Sum of Awe

Brought to you by the moment that spacetime began.
Staff member
Premium Member
I don't doubt the comfort behind viewing things as sacred, but I'd have to know what this pattern is about in order to comment on it.

The pattern is probably not convincing to everyone, just a personal interpretation.

Everything in the universe changes and influences each other. It appears to function by removing unwanted things automatically, done in a way that seems so natural. Stellar evolution as one example. I'll probably go more into detail tomorrow if you're interested, but right now I'm really tired and lazy
 

dust1n

Zindīq
The pattern is probably not convincing to everyone, just a personal interpretation.

Everything in the universe changes and influences each other. It appears to function by removing unwanted things automatically, done in a way that seems so natural. Stellar evolution as one example. I'll probably go more into detail tomorrow if you're interested, but right now I'm really tired and lazy

The floor is open.
 

The Sum of Awe

Brought to you by the moment that spacetime began.
Staff member
Premium Member
The floor is open.

All things make up the Whole (the universe), constantly changing and evolving. All events happen because that's what writes the universal code, which can be taken to mean its personality. It eliminates the useless, and recreates it into a temporary protector that will one day become useless again.

If the universe is completely composed of material, and if it always reuses that material constantly, then you are made up of the same atoms that gave you life, keeps you alive, and puts you to an end. That's over-said, I admit, because right now you might be picturing atoms flying off of me, recreate itself into a gun, and shoot me, but that's too literal and not what I'm saying.

All things are made of atoms, and all things influence each other, so the atoms that gave you life may once again return to you literally, but not all of them. If they don't return, they still cause a chain reaction on other atoms that, after a complicated series of events, will affect you.

Extinction as a process of eliminating threats or unwanted things and the matter they are composed of form into something new and useful for the universe.

It grows. Not only expanding the size, but also constantly updating things that currently exist.

The fact that there is life means that the universe has life. It composes of both living things and nonliving things, but the living things give it a spark of life.

Stellar evolution, biological evolution, the creation of solar systems, the creation of moons, it's all done because that is what makes it a working, functioning body. Not saying that if it were a little bit different the universe would die, but relate it to our human bodies: it wouldn't cause us to die if our cells worked a bit differently.
 

The Sum of Awe

Brought to you by the moment that spacetime began.
Staff member
Premium Member
The OP describes a form of pantheism.


It's valid, if you believe it, it isn't inherently paradoxical.

Yep, I often address myself as a pantheist when asked to keep it short and less annoyingly, but whenever I do that I feel like it doesn't really explain it enough.
 

Desert Snake

Veteran Member
Yep, I often address myself as a pantheist when asked to keep it short and less annoyingly, but whenever I do that I feel like it doesn't really explain it enough.



Hmm I think it's because people often really minimize the 'theism' part, but it seems like /the OP/ is including it. I think your version is more 'sensible' for the term, personally. Otherwise , why even use the term.
 

dust1n

Zindīq
All things make up the Whole (the universe), constantly changing and evolving. All events happen because that's what writes the universal code, which can be taken to mean its personality. It eliminates the useless, and recreates it into a temporary protector that will one day become useless again.

I'm really not sure what any of those three sentences were meant to entail.

How does the universe evolve? By eliminating the useless? What is the useless? What is a temporary protector? How does this recreation occur? How does one obverse it?

If the universe is completely composed of material, and if it always reuses that material constantly, then you are made up of the same atoms that gave you life, keeps you alive, and puts you to an end. That's over-said, I admit, because right now you might be picturing atoms flying off of me, recreate itself into a gun, and shoot me, but that's too literal and not what I'm saying.

What do you mean by the universe using the material? I take use to be "1. take, hold, or deploy (something) as a means of accomplishing a purpose or achieving a result; employ."
What result does the universe seek? This? Is the useful just the entities that exist in a given moment, and then the useless the things that don't exist.?

All things are made of atoms,

Well, not quite true, but I get what you are saying.

and all things influence each other, so the atoms that gave you life may once again return to you literally, but not all of them. If they don't return, they still cause a chain reaction on other atoms that, after a complicated series of events, will affect you.

Sure. I'm following.


Extinction as a process of eliminating threats or unwanted things and the matter they are composed of form into something new and useful for the universe.

It grows. Not only expanding the size, but also constantly updating things that currently exist.

But at this point you are just calling things that exist "useful" and things that don't exist as "threats or unwanted things."

Basically, it's an anthropomorphically strange thing you are doing here, because you are endowing the totality of the universe with intentions and goals, something that desires and feels threat, but there is no reason to believe that any of this is the case.

The fact that there is life means that the universe has life. It composes of both living things and nonliving things, but the living things give it a spark of life.

Why would I believe life is a meaningful distinction between not life on a truly universal scale? Especially if we have established that living things are not useful under your system.

Stellar evolution, biological evolution, the creation of solar systems, the creation of moons, it's all done because that is what makes it a working, functioning body. Not saying that if it were a little bit different the universe would die, but relate it to our human bodies: it wouldn't cause us to die if our cells worked a bit differently.

I don't know what you mean by a little bit difference in the universe.

Personally, I still don't see the need for the title of God on the universe which will inevitably deem all living beings useless, and I do mean all living beings in the universe, because it will physically be impossible for such things to exist around 10^25 years from now. Humans will not likely make it past like 150,000 years, and I expect the ride down to be as sharp as it was on the way up.
 

The Sum of Awe

Brought to you by the moment that spacetime began.
Staff member
Premium Member
Hmm I think it's because people often really minimize the 'theism' part, but it seems like /the OP/ is including it. I think your version is more 'sensible' for the term, personally. Otherwise , why even use the term.

It matters not whether the term is better suited for what I just described, it doesn't help explain in detail and probably no term ever will, and so I seek a way to simplify the explanation.
 
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