Good and Evil

[Nicholas]

All traditions agree that this polarity in the thoughts, words and deeds of humans exists. They also agree to live following Good, not Evil. So this thread will give examples of this basic duality that faces nearly everyone.

We see that man, who proudly believes himself to be a 'free agent' —
the master of his life and even of nature — is in his spiritually undeveloped state actually a passive
patient driven about by inner forces he does not recognise. Pulled by his greed and pushed by his
hatred, in his blindness he does not see that the brakes for stopping these frantic movements are in
his reach, within his own heart. The brakes are the roots of good themselves, which can be
cultivated to such a degree that greed, hatred and delusion are utterly destroyed.

Nyanaponika Thera

 

[joe1776]

All traditions agree that this polarity in the thoughts, words and deeds of humans exists. They also agree to live following Good, not Evil. So this thread will give examples of this basic duality that faces nearly everyone.

"We see that man, who proudly believes himself to be a 'free agent' —
the master of his life and even of nature — is in his spiritually undeveloped state actually a passive
patient driven about by inner forces he does not recognise. Pulled by his greed and pushed by his
hatred, in his blindness he does not see that the brakes for stopping these frantic movements are in
his reach, within his own heart. The brakes are the roots of good themselves, which can be
cultivated to such a degree that greed, hatred and delusion are utterly destroyed."

Nyanaponika Thera

All religions perceive good and evil because they don't understand that genuine love is always unconditional. For example, if a religion believed in a god that loved unconditionally, then their god would see the serial killer and his acts as sick not evil. "Hate the sin, love the sinner," would prevail.

 

[Quintessence]

All traditions agree that this polarity in the thoughts, words and deeds of humans exists.

They do? Where did you get this information, if I may ask? Dualism is particular to certain ways of thinking and not others - it's not difficult to find examples that demonstrate this to be false. Some traditions rather go out of their way to deconstruct dualism and point out its shortcomings/flaws in fact.

What is it that you are seeking?

 

[Nicholas]

They do? Where did you get this information, if I may ask? Dualism is particular to certain ways of thinking and not others - it's not difficult to find examples that demonstrate this to be false. Some traditions rather go out of their way to deconstruct dualism and point out its shortcomings/flaws in fact.

What is it that you are seeking?

That polarity exists in people is obvious. Whether it is needed or permanent is another question.

I am seeking more Good and less Evil.

 

[Nicholas]

The [Mahabharata] war was not fought merely to regain mundane wealth and power but was in fact a war between the just and unjust, between good and evil.
Symbolically the armies represent the positive and negative forces functioning within the human heart and mind. The battle is waged to decide whether the positive or the negative forces govern the city of life within the human being. There is a constant battle going on within each person to regain the lost kingdom of peace, happiness, and bliss.

Swami Rama in his comments on Bhagavad Gita.

 

[Quintessence]

That polarity exists in people is obvious.

It's not obvious to me. What is obvious to me (well, "obvious" would be a poor choice of words to be honest) is that people understand the world based on their cultural upbringing.

I got taught dualism, but there are also other ways of thinking about things. Black-and-white thinking like that never made much sense to me as a kid, and I learned about alternative viewpoints as I got older. Things like triplicate paradigms where instead of a duality there is a threefold understanding. Or fourfold. Or however you want to slice up reality, really. But it's all something we make up as a cultural construct - a map of the territory, so to speak. If something is "obvious" it means we've been using some particular map to navigate territory and might not even know there's other maps out there to be used.

I am seeking more Good and less Evil.

What does that mean for you? What do those words mean on your map? Whose good/evil is considered for instance? How absolute are the categories, or do things move between them depending on perspective?

 

[Nakosis]

All traditions agree that this polarity in the thoughts, words and deeds of humans exists. They also agree to live following Good, not Evil. So this thread will give examples of this basic duality that faces nearly everyone.

We see that man, who proudly believes himself to be a 'free agent' —
the master of his life and even of nature — is in his spiritually undeveloped state actually a passive
patient driven about by inner forces he does not recognise. Pulled by his greed and pushed by his
hatred, in his blindness he does not see that the brakes for stopping these frantic movements are in
his reach, within his own heart. The brakes are the roots of good themselves, which can be
cultivated to such a degree that greed, hatred and delusion are utterly destroyed.

Nyanaponika Thera

And yet, we still allow the politicians to run things.

 

[stvdv]

All traditions agree that this polarity in the thoughts, words and deeds of humans exists

Yes. And when we transcend this polarity Peace remains.

The brakes are the roots of good themselves, which can be
cultivated to such a degree that greed, hatred and delusion are utterly destroyed.

I like the "Brakes" example. I used to have quite good brakes, never reacting (but this was due to suppressed emotions). Only after gaining spiritual knowledge and understanding how the senses and mind worked, I improved, and the "Brakes" worked well.

 

[February-Saturday]

All traditions agree that this polarity in the thoughts, words and deeds of humans exists. They also agree to live following Good, not Evil. So this thread will give examples of this basic duality that faces nearly everyone.

We see that man, who proudly believes himself to be a 'free agent' —
the master of his life and even of nature — is in his spiritually undeveloped state actually a passive
patient driven about by inner forces he does not recognise. Pulled by his greed and pushed by his
hatred, in his blindness he does not see that the brakes for stopping these frantic movements are in
his reach, within his own heart. The brakes are the roots of good themselves, which can be
cultivated to such a degree that greed, hatred and delusion are utterly destroyed.

Nyanaponika Thera

I don't think Satanism really has a concrete concept of good and evil. I know that some specific currents have their own ways of defining those concepts, but at the same time there's a reason why so many sociopaths and criminals convert to Satanism. It's one of the only religions that doesn't condemn them.

Are there some distinct themes in Satanism and a few wholly distinct Satanic values like Pathei-Mathos and blasphemy? Yes, but not every Satanist adheres to those. I personally have known many Satanists that don't believe in good or evil at all, it seems to be rather common. There are even some variations of Satanism who will say in their texts that they choose to prefer evil over good, a mindset pejoratively known as "evilism" and represented mostly by individual actors like Richard Ramirez.

I will say that most of the time I am not acting with free will. Even when I do act with free will, it can be a lengthy process because I have to intentionally use only rational processes and examine my biases, which cannot be done perfectly without being omniscient. I likely define "free will" different from you, though.

I believe that genuine spiritual cultivation will lead eventually to understanding, and with that understanding comes acceptance and non-judgment. Notions of good and evil are not compatible with that. I think it's very clear that God does not punish evil or reward good, but has agape for both, if you just look around at the world. I'd like to strive for agape, too.

 

[Nicholas]

By 'traditions' I meant spiritual traditions, those which advocate for Good & Virtue supplanting Evil & Vice.

 

[February-Saturday]

By 'traditions' I meant spiritual traditions, those which advocate for Good & Virtue supplanting Evil & Vice.

And my religion is a form of Spiritual Satanism called traditional Satanism, that's rooted in Gnosticism and Western grimoiric tradition. It is a spiritual tradition and it does not advocate for good or virtue to supplant evil and vice.

 

[Nicholas]

The Blessed Lord Krishna said:

(1) Fearlessness, purity of heart, perseverance in acquiring wisdom and in practicing yoga,
charity, subjugation of the senses, performance of holy rites, study of the scriptures, selfdiscipline,
straightforwardness;
(2) Noninjury, truthfulness, freedom from wrath, renunciation, peacefulness,
nonslanderousness, compassion for all creatures, absence of greed, gentleness, modesty, lack
of restlessness;
(3) Radiance of character, forgiveness, patience, cleanness, freedom from hate, absence of
conceit—these qualities are the wealth of a divinely inclined person.

Bhagavad Gita, ch. 16

 

[Nicholas]

Now Krishna mentions the demonic traits:

(7) The demonic know not the right path of action or when to refrain from action. They lack
purity and truth and proper conduct.
(8) They say: “The world has no moral foundation, no abiding truth, no God or Ruler;
produced not by a systematic causal order, its sole purpose is lustful desire—what else?”
(9) With their feeble intellects, such ruined men cling to their erroneous beliefs and commit
many atrocities. They are enemies of the world, bent on its destruction.
(10) Abandoned to insatiable longings, full of dissimulation, self-conceit, and insolence,
possessing evil ideas through delusion, all their actions are impurely motivated.
(11) Believing that fulfillment of bodily desires is man’s highest aim, confident that this
world is “all,” such persons are engrossed till the moment of death in earthly cares and
concerns.
(12) Bound by hundreds of fetters of selfish hopes and expectations, enslaved by wrath and
passion, they strive to provide for physical enjoyments by amassing wealth dishonestly.
(13) “This I have acquired today; now another desire I shall satisfy. This is my present
wealth; however, more shall also be mine.
(14) “I have killed this enemy; and the others also I will slay. I am the ruler among men; I
enjoy all possessions; I am successful, strong, and happy.
(15) “I am rich and well-born; can any other be compared with me? Ostentatiously I will
give alms and make formal sacrifices; I will rejoice.” Thus they speak, led astray by lack of
wisdom.
(16) Harboring bewildering thoughts, caught in the net of delusion, craving only sensual
delights, they sink into a foul hell.
(17) Vain, stubborn, intoxicated by pride in wealth, they perform the sacrifices hypocritically
and without following the scriptural injunctions.
(18) Egotistical, forceful, haughty, lascivious, and prone to rage, these malicious men despise
Me who dwells within them and within all other men.

Also from chapter 16 of the Bhagavad Gita

 

[Nicholas]

All humans are capable of living a happy, good, virtuous life now, with our suffering caused vices being repressed and in several lifetimes being replaced by the Good.

 

[Nicholas]

If, however, fear or uncertainty should arise, we
know the refuge where it can be allayed: our good
deeds. By taking this refuge, confidence and
courage will grow within us — confidence in the
protecting power of our good deeds done in the
past; courage to perform more good deeds right now,
despite the discouraging hardships of our present life.
For we know that noble and selfless deeds provide the
best defence against the hard blows of destiny, that it is
never too late but always the right time for good actions.

Nyanaponika

 

[Nicholas]

There are, O monks, three roots of the unwholesome: greed, hatred and delusion.
Greed, hatred and delusion of every kind are unwholesome. Whatever kamma a greedy,
hating and deluded person heaps up, by deeds, words or thoughts, that, too, is unwholesome.
Whatever suffering such a person, overpowered by greed, hatred and delusion, his
thoughts controlled by them, inflicts under false pretexts upon another—by killing,
imprisonment, confiscation of property, false accusations or expulsion, being prompted in
this by the thought, “I have power and I want power”—all this is unwholesome too. In this
manner, there arise in him many evil unwholesome states of mind, born of and originating
from greed, hatred and delusion, caused and conditioned by greed, hatred and delusion.

Buddha in Anguttara Nikaya 3:69

 

[Nicholas]

Only once in all his works did Marx ever write about torture. During his own lifetime, many of his followers were tortured by Russian Czarist authorities. Since Marx is usually described as a humanist, one would expect him to write with horror about such an abominable practice. But his only comment was,

"Torture alone has given rise to the most ingenious mechanical inventions and employed many honorable craftsmen in the production of the instruments."

Torture is productive, it leads to ingenious inventions -- this is all Marx had to say about the subject. No wonder Marxist governments have surpassed all others in torturing their opponents! This alone displays the Satanic nature of Marxism.

Marx and Satan by Richard Wurmbrand

 

[Nicholas]

In nothing do men approach so nearly to the gods as in doing good to men.
Cicero.

 

[Nicholas]

To be doing good is man's most glorious task.
Sophocles.

 

[Nicholas]

By desiring what is perfectly good, even when we do not quite know what it is, and cannot do what we would, we are part of the divine power against evil, widening the skirts of light and making the struggle with darkness narrower.
"George Eliot", Mary A. Evans (d. 1880)