Has Anyone ever Seen God?

[Bree]

this is a recent article from Jw.org i'd like to share. The Watchtower, being a bible based organisation, uses the bible to answer the question Has Anyone Ever Seen God?



The Bible’s answer
No human has literally seen God. (Exodus 33:20; John 1:18; 1 John 4:12) The Bible says that “God is a Spirit,” a form of life that is invisible to the human eye.—John 4:24; 1 Timothy 1:17.

God can be seen directly by angels, though, because they are spirit creatures. (Matthew 18:10) Moreover, some humans who die will be raised to life in heaven with a spirit body and will then be able to see God.—Philippians 3:20, 21; 1 John 3:2.

How to “see” God now
The Bible often uses the idea of seeing figuratively, to represent enlightenment. (Isaiah 6:10; Jeremiah 5:21; John 9:39-41) In this sense, a person can see God now with “the eyes of [his] heart” by having faith so as to know Him and appreciate His qualities. (Ephesians 1:18) The Bible describes steps to build this kind of faith.

• Learn about God’s qualities, such as his love and generosity as well as his wisdom and power, through his creation. (Romans 1:20) After being reminded of God’s creative works, the faithful man Job felt as though God were right before his eyes.—Job 42:5.
  
  
• Get to know God by studying the Bible. “If you search for [God], he will let himself be found by you,” the Bible assures us.—1 Chronicles 28:9; Psalm 119:2; John 17:3.
  
  
• Learn about God through the life of Jesus. Since Jesus perfectly reflected the personality of his Father, Jehovah God, he could rightly say: “Whoever has seen me has seen the Father also.”—John 14:9.
  
  
• Live in a way that pleases God, and see how he acts in your behalf. Jesus said: “Happy are the pure in heart, since they will see God.” As noted earlier, some who please God will be resurrected to heaven and will thus “see God” there.—Matthew 5:8; Psalm 11:7.
  

Did not Moses, Abraham, and others actually see God?
In accounts where it might seem that the Bible says that humans literally saw God, the context shows that God was represented by an angel or appeared by means of a vision.

Angels.
In ancient times, God sent angels as his representatives to appear to humans and to speak in his name. (Psalm 103:20) For example, God once spoke to Moses from a burning bush, and the Bible says that “Moses hid his face, because he was afraid to look at the true God.” (Exodus 3:4, 6) Moses did not literally see God, though, for the context shows that he actually saw “Jehovah’s angel.”—Exodus 3:2.

Similarly, when the Bible says that God “spoke to Moses face-to-face,” it means that God conversed with Moses intimately. (Exodus 4:10, 11; 33:11) Moses did not actually see God’s face, for the information he received from God “was transmitted through angels.” (Galatians 3:19; Acts 7:53) Still, Moses’ faith in God was so strong that the Bible described him as “seeing the One who is invisible.”—Hebrews 11:27.

In the same way that he spoke to Moses, God communicated with Abraham through angels. Granted, a casual reading of the Bible might give the impression that Abraham literally saw God. (Genesis 18:1, 33) However, the context shows that the “three men” who came to Abraham were actually angels sent by God. Abraham recognized them as God’s representatives and addressed them as if he were speaking directly to Jehovah.—Genesis 18:2, 3, 22, 32; 19:1.

Visions.
God has also appeared to humans through visions, or scenes presented to a person’s mind. For instance, when the Bible says that Moses and other Israelites “saw the God of Israel,” they really “saw a vision of the true God.” (Exodus 24:9-11) Likewise, the Bible sometimes says that prophets “saw Jehovah.” (Isaiah 6:1; Daniel 7:9; Amos 9:1) In each case, the context shows that they were given a vision of God rather than a direct view of him.—Isaiah 1:1; Daniel 7:2; Amos 1:1.

 

[Bree]

The bible is contradictory about this....one place it says that no one will ever see him and then another place it does.

In Islam, to bring Allah down to human level is degrading.

no, the bible is not contradictory about this subject. It is very clear that God has NEVER been seen in person. Its impossible to see him. Actually the bible says John 1:18 "no man has seen God at any time" and at Exodus 33:20 But he added: “You cannot see my face, for no man can see me and live.”


It is impossible for a man to see God. The bible says this from right at the beginning with Moses right to the end with Jesus.
If they bible says someone 'saw' God, it is only through an angel that they see him for man is not on Gods level as you seem to agree.

 

[MyM]

no, the bible is not contradictory about this subject. It is very clear that God has NEVER been seen in person. Its impossible to see him. Actually the bible says John 1:18 "no man has seen God at any time" and at Exodus 33:20 But he added: “You cannot see my face, for no man can see me and live.”


It is impossible for a man to see God. The bible says this from right at the beginning with Moses right to the end with Jesus.
If they bible says someone 'saw' God, it is only through an angel that they see him for man is not on Gods level as you seem to agree.

You quoted the verses yourself lol Moses saw God face to face (Exodus 33:11) and then in John 1:18 no man has seen God at any time....

It is a pure plain contradiction no matter how you try to explain it. You cannot deny it-no one can.

In Islam, no man will see their Creator until the Day of Judgement.

 

[Bree]

You quoted the verses yourself lol Moses saw God face to face (Exodus 33:11) and then in John 1:18 no man has seen God at any time....

It is a pure plain contradiction no matter how you try to explain it. You cannot deny it-no one can.

In Islam, no man will see their Creator until the Day of Judgement.

you need to read the entire passage

Ex 33:18
Then he (Moses) said: “Please show me your glory.” 19 But he (God) said: “I will make all my goodness pass before your face, and I will declare before you the name of Jehovah;+ and I will favor the one whom I favor, and I will show mercy to the one to whom I show mercy.”+ 20 But he added: “You cannot see my face, for no man can see me and live.”

21 Jehovah said further: “Here is a place near me. Station yourself on the rock. 22 When my glory is passing by, I will place you in a crevice of the rock, and I will shield you with my hand until I have passed by. 23 After that I will take my hand away, and you will see my back. But my face may not be seen.”+


God himself said 'you cannot see me' so who was moses speaking to? He was speaking to God through an angel. No one believes that Moses saw God himself. Moses wrote this account in Exodus so even Moses didnt believe he saw God personally.

 

[muhammad_isa]

In Islam, no man will see their Creator until the Day of Judgement.

I don't think that we need to argue about seeing G-d.

The most important thing is whether we can 'see' sense.

 

[MyM]

you need to read the entire passage

Ex 33:18
Then he (Moses) said: “Please show me your glory.” 19 But he (God) said: “I will make all my goodness pass before your face, and I will declare before you the name of Jehovah;+ and I will favor the one whom I favor, and I will show mercy to the one to whom I show mercy.”+ 20 But he added: “You cannot see my face, for no man can see me and live.”

21 Jehovah said further: “Here is a place near me. Station yourself on the rock. 22 When my glory is passing by, I will place you in a crevice of the rock, and I will shield you with my hand until I have passed by. 23 After that I will take my hand away, and you will see my back. But my face may not be seen.”+


God himself said 'you cannot see me' so who was moses speaking to? He was speaking to God through an angel. No one believes that Moses saw God himself. Moses wrote this account in Exodus so even Moses didnt believe he saw God personally.

That is a question for your Christian theologians Ask them that.

 

[Bree]

That is a question for your Christian theologians Ask them that.

ask them what question?

 

[MyM]

ask them what question?

Maybe you can read Genesus 32:30 as well

Why they contradict each other. No one has the ability to see God. This is known.

 

[MyM]

And then you will see God? How and where will you see God?

On the day of reckoning. Allah will be judging all of mankind and jinn and everyone on that day will get their right over each other.

"Some faces that Day will be naadirah (shining and radiant), looking at their Lord." [al-Qiyaamah 75:22-23]

Abu Hurayrah (may Allah be pleased with him) reported that the people said, "O Messenger of Allah, will we see our Lord on the Day of Resurrection?" He said, "Do you have any doubts about seeing the full moon on a cloudless night?" They said, "No." He said, "Do you have any doubts about seeing the sun on a cloudless day?" They said, "No." He said, "Then you will see your Lord in the same way." (Reported by al-Bukhaari, 764).

There are other evidences but through Quran and Sunnah it says the believers will see Allah swt.

 

[Bree]

Can you please explain this to the atheists? They believe that if God existed we would be able to SEE GOD, but this is patently absurd and illogical since God is Spirit, and nobody can see a Spirit. Besides, since God is not a person, how could we ever see God in person?

My religion also teaches that we can never see God and we will not even see God in heaven! We will still have to know God through an intermediary such as Jesus.

i dont think its possible to explain to an athiest because to them, its proof of a lack of existence of God.

But athiests tend to believe in science so ask them if they believe in other things we can't see such as subatomic particles and they say Yes! Why? Because those things can be 'measured'

Well how do we measure God? And i reply, just as one body in the universe has an effect on other bodies in the universe, so God has an effect on millions of humans and move them to act in certain ways. Even the athiests themselves are moved to act in certain ways by God...the ways their conscience moves them to behave is evidence for Gods existence.

Im married to an athiest so i have heard every argument and every possibility that explains away the existence of God.

 

[muhammad_isa]

Abu Hurayrah (may Allah be pleased with him) reported that the people said, "O Messenger of Allah, will we see our Lord on the Day of Resurrection?" He said, "Do you have any doubts about seeing the full moon on a cloudless night?" They said, "No." He said, "Do you have any doubts about seeing the sun on a cloudless day?" They said, "No." He said, "Then you will see your Lord in the same way." (Reported by al-Bukhaari, 764).

Yes, I see.
..as I see that the moon shines, that is.

 

[Bree]

Maybe you can read Genesus 32:30 as well

Why they contradict each other. No one has the ability to see God. This is known.

you have to use a little reasoning my friend.

If God stated to Moses that 'no man may see me and live' then who was it that Jacob wrestled with?

it certainly was not God himself.

The Christian scriptures says that he wrestled with an angle. I find that when muslims read the bible, they take it all so literally word for word. This could be because when you read english, you are translating it back into your language. I would probably do the same if trying to translate arabic back into english.

But the scriptures need to be taken in context with other scriptures.

 

[MyM]

you have to use a little reasoning my friend.

If God stated to Moses that 'no man may see me and live' then who was it that Jacob wrestled with?

it certainly was not God himself.

The Christian scriptures says that he wrestled with an angle. I find that when muslims read the bible, they take it all so literally word for word. This could be because when you read english, you are translating it back into your language. I would probably do the same if trying to translate arabic back into english.

But the scriptures need to be taken in context with other scriptures.

I was a born again Christian...sorry that excuse doesn't work. I was born and bred into a first baptist family ...yeaaaaaaars of Bible knowledge and saved and baptized and yet, here I am today a Muslim

You cannot take one contradiction and then find another like it and then try to combine the two into a reasoning that is not there. You will not even be able to find the correct translations from Greek to English....many many mistakes. Christian theologians even know this how come you don't?

 

[muhammad_isa]

..the scriptures need to be taken in context with other scriptures.

I agree with that.
However, I don't agree with 'eternal fire' being equivalent to 'death of the spirit'.
This dogma is based on bad theology, that is contrary to what Jesus taught in the Gospels.

Why did G-d allow the people of Hiroshima to suffer from exposure to an atomic bomb, but can't possibly allow anything bad to happen in an afterlife?
Does G-d suddenly change His mind about suffering?

It makes a lot more sense to me, that the spirit breathed into us is immortal, as it is from G-d.
G-d is immortal, eternal, infinite in nature.

 

[Bree]

Yes, I have heard that argument from atheists. God should be measurable if God exists.

I cannot imagine a JW being married to an atheist and the discussions that would ensue.
I am married to a Baha'i so we agree on most things that are related to God, although we don't usually agree on anything else, except that we both love the cats!

after 16 years of marriage i can say we've pretty much exhausted all avenues to come to an agreement. But we agree on most other things and get along like a house on fire ... we also have 2 cats

 

[Bree]

I agree with that.
However, I don't agree with 'eternal fire' being equivalent to 'death of the spirit'.
This dogma is based on bad theology, that is contrary to what Jesus taught in the Gospels.

some of these dogmas do not have a basis in scripture and this is most certainly one of them.

the hellfire teaching is what happens when people take verses and apply a literal meaning to them. Taking all scriptures literally will basically see dragons flying around in the sky and mountains standing up and walking away. The accounts in the bible often use 'figurative' speach and its important to differentiate between what is literal and what is figurative.

hellfire is most certainly figurative. Hell means a hole in the ground where you bury the dead. Fire represents destruction. So hell-fire is simply a term that means when you are dead and buried your body is destroyed. It has nothing to do with an afterlife and burning in fire as a form of punishment. That is something added by the church to induce fear and obedience during the 'dark ages'.

Why did G-d allow the people of Hiroshima to suffer from exposure to an atomic bomb, but can't possibly allow anything bad to happen in an afterlife?
Does G-d suddenly change His mind about suffering?

It makes a lot more sense to me, that the spirit breathed into us is immortal, as it is from G-d.
G-d is immortal, eternal, infinite in nature.

the bible says that the punishement for wrongdoing (sin) is 'death' ... life is a priveledge and when you committ wrongdoing you dont deserve to keep livinig. So God takes away life as a punishment.

Death is the end of life so its not logical to believe that after death, God would make you suffer more. He is not vindictive and evil like that. Death is the punishment. Life is the gift.

 

[Bree]

I was a born again Christian...sorry that excuse doesn't work. I was born and bred into a first baptist family ...yeaaaaaaars of Bible knowledge and saved and baptized and yet, here I am today a Muslim

You cannot take one contradiction and then find another like it and then try to combine the two into a reasoning that is not there. You will not even be able to find the correct translations from Greek to English....many many mistakes. Christian theologians even know this how come you don't?

where we learn from is the key. when you learn the bible from the right channel, you learn the truth.

I dont believe all christians are learning the truth of Gods word. Most denominations of christians follow pagan teachings and beliefs. They still teach hellfire for example...that is 100% not biblical.

 

[Bree]

Don't get me wrong.... My husband and I do not always agree on God, except that God exists, and we agree on what our religion teaches, but we see God differently.

We have eight cats but we don't usually agree on what to do with them. They are all Persians and they need a lot of grooming but it is hard to get his help when I need it and it is a two-person job.

thats interesting but understandable. Men and women, who think differently, do see God in different ways. I imagine that a man would see God from his masculine point of view (the leader/governer/rulermaker) and a woman from the more feminine and nurturing type of view where he cares/loves/crys etc .

Men and women were created to reflect the different aspects of God....we just need to appreciate all the aspects of God and try to see that in each other and then we will appreciate one another more.

Oh MY 8 high maintenance cats! We only have 2 and they drive me nuts sometimes

 

[muhammad_isa]

Death is the end of life so its not logical to believe that after death, God would make you suffer more..

Death is not the end of life.
Only the body dies, and the spirit returns to G-d to whom it belongs.
G-d does not directly cause people to suffer, in this life or the next.

He is not vindictive and evil like that..

..so why does He allow people to suffer now, if G-d doesn't agree with suffering?
If I had a choice between "carrying on living" or being "blotted out", then I would choose "blotted out".

..but that is not reality. One cannot escape from divine justice.
Suffering is as real as bliss.
Life is not one big fairy story. It is a lot more serious than that.

 

[Eyes to See]

Maybe you can read Genesus 32:30 as well

Why they contradict each other. No one has the ability to see God. This is known.

Reading through this thread and all your rants I realized something right away. They were all answered in the OP. It's like you didn't even read it.