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Have your beliefs shifted from a personal God to an impersonal God/Force?

Karolina

Member
I'm specifically interested in hearing from anyone who used to at one point believe in a personal God that you related to like, well, a person, prayed to, attributed human characteristics like jealousy, anger, love, mercy, etc to God. If you now see what you once called God as more of a mysterious force (like, say, the Tao/Dao) that does not interact with you on a personal level in the form of answered prayers or expectations of worship, but nonetheless envelopes you at all times, how did you arrive here? Was it difficult to make the transition? Did you have to go through a grieving period of losing that relational intimacy you once felt you had with God? Did anything replace for you what a personified God used to do for you? What would you say are the pros and cons of both views?

I know this can go a lot of different ways, so I'm not trying to debate but only hear personal stories of spiritual evolution on this trajectory. Thanks!

(I'm thinking here of the quote from 1 Corinthians 15:28 of the Christian New Testament, "so that God may be all in all." Perhaps one may arrive at a both/and conclusion of God being transcendent and personally relatable. Possible I guess if we say God is mystery.)
 

Sand Dancer

Currently catless
Yes. I used to be Christian for a long time and with all of the nasty stuff that goes on in the world, I can't believe that anymore. It took me a while to leave Christianity, as I didn't want to stop believing in that type of god. Also, I was afraid that I would be punished in case for leaving the religion. I still wish either that I never had become a Christian, or that I still was, because it felt secure. But then I shake that thought because I am glad I believe what I do now.
 

Karolina

Member
Yes. I used to be Christian for a long time and with all of the nasty stuff that goes on in the world, I can't believe that anymore. It took me a while to leave Christianity, as I didn't want to stop believing in that type of god. Also, I was afraid that I would be punished in case for leaving the religion. I still wish either that I never had become a Christian, or that I still was, because it felt secure. But then I shake that thought because I am glad I believe what I do now.
Would love to hear what you believe now. Did you have to go through a grieving period of letting go of the personification of God? Is worship of God still a part of your spiritual practice? And if so, would you mind describing it? Does the figure of Jesus still feature in some way in your spirituality? Or not at all now? Thanks!
 

Sand Dancer

Currently catless
Would love to hear what you believe now. Did you have to go through a grieving period of letting go of the personification of God? Is worship of God still a part of your spiritual practice? And if so, would you mind describing it? Does the figure of Jesus still feature in some way in your spirituality? Or not at all now? Thanks!
I did have a grieving period. It is a secure feeling, so it's hard to let go of. I no longer believe in a personal god. It's more an impersonal force that animates everything. I am more Buddhist but I am learning about original Christianity before it became about belief and literalism. Jesus is a role model to me, so even though I don't worship him as god, he is a wonderful teacher.
 

Ella S.

Well-Known Member
I'm specifically interested in hearing from anyone who used to at one point believe in a personal God that you related to like, well, a person, prayed to, attributed human characteristics like jealousy, anger, love, mercy, etc to God. If you now see what you once called God as more of a mysterious force (like, say, the Tao/Dao) that does not interact with you on a personal level in the form of answered prayers or expectations of worship, but nonetheless envelopes you at all times, how did you arrive here?
I grew up believing Adam and Eve literally existed somewhere in the present-day Arabian peninsula 6,000 years ago, that demons were real and haunted houses, that angels were seen every now and then saving people from disasters, that God answered prayers, that there were constant miracles happening, and that angelology and demonology were genuine studies of supernatural beings with scientific rigor on par with biology. I believed that NDEs gave us glimpses into the afterlife.

I thought that anyone who didn't believe in God was an idiot, because all of the above gave us so much evidence for his existence. I believed that practically everyone in the world recognized this and were Christian. I believed in all of this evidence because I went to Catholic school on the weekdays and a Southern Baptist church every Sunday. The same people who told me how ice works, how our digestive system works, what the names of the planets were, and so on were the ones telling me that God was real and Noah's Flood actually, literally happened. I believed them because I was a kid and I trusted adults to know things and not lie to me.

As I grew up, I began to discover that a lot of the evidence for God did not check out. There probably was no Adam or Eve. Angelology and demonology are messy and nowhere near as systematic as genuine science, without any physical evidence backing their findings whatsoever. Study after study was showing that prayer doesn't work, and I myself realized that my prayers were not really being answered any more than I would expect from chance. Most of the miracles I heard rumors about were apparently hoaxes. NDEs have natural explanations.

The nail in the coffin was when I began to study Biblical history and comparative mythology. That's when I realized that the Bible itself is mostly mythology, no different from what I would read in Hinduism, Buddhism, Native American religion, or even Mesopotamian, Egyptian, Hellenic, Celtic, or Germanic paganisms.
Was it difficult to make the transition?
Absolutely. I learned early on that there were some questions you're not allowed to ask at church, like "Why didn't God stop the Holocaust?" My entire journey had me questioning everyone in my family and community that I trusted and depended on. Not only that, but it ripped apart my entire worldview. If the story of God condemning homosexuality was just another myth, then what about the times that I said bigoted things to bisexual and homosexual people I personally knew? I was completely in the wrong and hurt them for no reason, thinking that I was going to save their souls from a non-existent fiery afterlife.

And if I can't trust my own parents and the authority of the church to tell me the truth, who could I trust? Can I really trust anyone? I still haven't recovered from that. They're all liars. None of them put any amount of effort into making sure that what they taught impressionable children was actually true. It's not right. I understand a bit better now that they're just stupid and don't know any better, but the damage to my trust is already done.
Did you have to go through a grieving period of losing that relational intimacy you once felt you had with God?
Ha! No? God was clearly a monster. He drowned the entire world in a global flood and threatened to send me to Hell for committing thought crimes that I had no control over. He watched silently as the children in Africa starved and the Holocaust happened. Even when I was a small child, it was clear to me that God wasn't a good guy. I didn't think he was evil, I just thought he was neglectful while we're alive and then way too strict after we died. I could never really fully understand why people kept calling him loving or good.
Did anything replace for you what a personified God used to do for you?
Sort of. God to me was someone I could pray to and speak to, who witnessed that I was trying my best even when people around me judged me, and who I could feel spiritually connected to in churches or in deep prayer. I don't believe in prayer or any other form of magic now. However, I do believe that there is someone witnessing my efforts: me. In many ways, I'm a harsher judge of myself than God ever was, so this doesn't let me off the hook, but at least I actually know what I'm judging myself on rather than trying to guess which denomination or preacher has the "correct" criteria for avoiding eternal damnation. I can still feel connected to nature, just now with the awareness that it has no agency.
What would you say are the pros and cons of both views?
It was never about that for me. I just wanted to know what was true. That's all that's important.

I miss believing in Heaven and that God and the angels were watching out for me to make sure nothing too bad ever happened to me. I miss feeling like I would receive genuine justice when I died, even if, looking back on it, that belief terrified me more than it comforted me. Above all, I miss being able to trust others and feel safe.

At least as a pantheist, my God is observable and I can understand him through study and experimentation. I don't have to wonder what I did to make him abandon me when things are going horribly wrong. I don't have to live in fear of having a wrong thought that will make me burn forever in a nightmare realm. I also have a better understanding of how the world works in general and am no longer surprised by its cruelty.
 
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Orbit

I'm a planet
I'm specifically interested in hearing from anyone who used to at one point believe in a personal God that you related to like, well, a person, prayed to, attributed human characteristics like jealousy, anger, love, mercy, etc to God. If you now see what you once called God as more of a mysterious force (like, say, the Tao/Dao) that does not interact with you on a personal level in the form of answered prayers or expectations of worship, but nonetheless envelopes you at all times, how did you arrive here? Was it difficult to make the transition? Did you have to go through a grieving period of losing that relational intimacy you once felt you had with God? Did anything replace for you what a personified God used to do for you? What would you say are the pros and cons of both views?

I know this can go a lot of different ways, so I'm not trying to debate but only hear personal stories of spiritual evolution on this trajectory. Thanks!

(I'm thinking here of the quote from 1 Corinthians 15:28 of the Christian New Testament, "so that God may be all in all." Perhaps one may arrive at a both/and conclusion of God being transcendent and personally relatable. Possible I guess if we say God is mystery.)
As a deconverted Christian, there was a grieving period. Now I'm also more of a pantheist but part of me simply doesn't care any more. I spent so much time and energy looking for the "truth" about religion now I'm just exhausted from it. It's nice to let that search go.
 

osgart

Nothing my eye, Something for sure
I believe that the manifestation of intellect and levels of intelligence manifest in the universe due to an impersonal eternal intelligent source reality. The idea of relying on a personal God is like jumping into a pool with no water in it, and jumping blindfolded without realizing the blinders are on. Some people just create these Gods in their own imagination and manifest them outward not discerning their interpretations as things that occur only in their own minds.

Maybe A. I. Is a good analogy for what I believe. It manifests intelligence but it has no personable qualities.

I'm also sure that qualities of being are no accident as other conscious entities may exist, and inevitably do. Why qualities of being exist I believe is a result of other types of beings existing at the source. Life and intellect go hand in hand and have always existed in other places.

Life wants to emerge everywhere it can I think. At some point in reality I find that life is a brute fact.

So at best there are eternally conscious beings with no God powers.
 

Aupmanyav

Be your own guru
Was it difficult to make the transition? Did you have to go through a grieving period of losing that relational intimacy you once felt you had with God? Did anything replace for you what a personified God used to do for you? What would you say are the pros and cons of both views?

I know this can go a lot of different ways, so I'm not trying to debate but only hear personal stories of spiritual evolution on this trajectory. Thanks!

(I'm thinking here of the quote from 1 Corinthians 15:28 of the Christian New Testament, "so that God may be all in all." Perhaps one may arrive at a both/and conclusion of God being transcendent and personally relatable. Possible I guess if we say God is mystery.)
Many people here are like that. At one time I too was a believer (Hindus are generally polytheists, many Gods and God desses, not just one God). When I questioned my beliefs, I found no reason or evidence of existence of deities.
It was not a difficult decision. I think it just took about 5 minutes. I have no regrets about it.
What replaced my belief in deities is science and 'physical energy', since that is what the universe started with and no evidence of anything else existing.
Pros are many. It was like clouds being blown away leaving a beautiful blue sky. Cons are that it requires courage to accept the truth and many people do not have that kind of courage.
"God may be all in all" is clinging to the idea of existence of God. It is a subterfuge. But still a falsehood, IMHO.
 

freelight

Soul Pioneer
Premium Member
I'm specifically interested in hearing from anyone who used to at one point believe in a personal God that you related to like, well, a person, prayed to, attributed human characteristics like jealousy, anger, love, mercy, etc to God. If you now see what you once called God as more of a mysterious force (like, say, the Tao/Dao) that does not interact with you on a personal level in the form of answered prayers or expectations of worship, but nonetheless envelopes you at all times, how did you arrive here? Was it difficult to make the transition? Did you have to go through a grieving period of losing that relational intimacy you once felt you had with God? Did anything replace for you what a personified God used to do for you? What would you say are the pros and cons of both views?

I know this can go a lot of different ways, so I'm not trying to debate but only hear personal stories of spiritual evolution on this trajectory. Thanks!

(I'm thinking here of the quote from 1 Corinthians 15:28 of the Christian New Testament, "so that God may be all in all." Perhaps one may arrive at a both/and conclusion of God being transcendent and personally relatable. Possible I guess if we say God is mystery.)

My current view of 'God' includes the totality of existence, so naturally includes personal and non-personal aspects of being, 'God' being 'one' and 'all',....that absolute, omnipresent, universal, boundless, infinite source of all that is or ever will be,.....so this is more similar to monistic theism, within a panentheistic worldview, allowing for a fundamental of non-dualism, plus the apparent features of duality and multiplicity we experience in the material world;.....Creator and Creation are in an innermerging flux of co-creation. Wherever relativity exists, there is the play of relations and movements in consciousness - this allows for the recognition of both unity and diversity....essence and forms.

So, I can worship Deity in all his/her personal qualities and attributes as a divine Personality and the Source of all personality, as well as the origin of all that is non or trans-personal, since 'God' includes and concludes all,....there is no outside of that Infinite ONE that is ALL.

In spirit, I hold vision of the All-Father and Mother of all, which includes the full opulence of divine Personality, as well as all else in association with consciousness.....so one can worship and relate to 'God/Goddess' in many different personalities and forms. Omnipresence here and now includes all, is all. Nothing is lost in the worship of Deity when universality and omnipresence are attributed to the infinity of Spirit, as all personal and nonpersonal reality is included in its actuality and potentiality. I see no loss or gain in 'God' (regardless of form), but the eternal play of all creative potentials and possibilities.


brahma-age-of-universe.jpg


------------------o
 

dybmh

ויהי מבדיל בין מים למים
My current view of 'God' includes the totality of existence, so naturally includes personal and non-personal aspects of being,

100% I agree. My approach is to attach to the personal aspects emotionally, and attach to the non-personal intellectually.
 

RestlessSoul

Well-Known Member
I’ve probably moved in the opposite direction. I always had a vague notion of a spirit of the universe, an underlying creative force or energy, and I still have that. But also find myself believing more and more in a God that’s personal, and concerned with us humans. The reason for this change in my perception is that, when I have really needed and wanted the support of a loving God, when I’ve stretched out my hand in the darkness, I’ve felt it held.
 
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