None of that says that Yahweh doesn't use angels to communicate anymore. There's not one passage in the Bible saying such a thing.
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Heavenly beings or Satanic beings?
- Thread starter Eddi
- Start date
What if the "good work" one is required to do changes over time? In different dispensations?
And what if the competencies and equipment required to do "good work" also vary over time?
2 Timothy can only speak for what was required in the time it was written:
What if this only refers to a certain dispensation? - i.e. the early Church?
If this was the case, it would most likely not state this itself, for obvious reasons, otherwise its immediate authority would be undermined
Also, who's to say that a heavenly being wouldn't have other motives for talking to a human, motives other than making a person "competent" or "equipped" for "good work" - without being evil?
The Lord moves in mysterious ways, after all...
Eyes to See
Well-Known Member
No. But God's word never changes. What you say is not in God's word.
It is not incomplete. The Bible states that the examples written from beforehand were written for us on whom the end of the system of things has arrived:
"Now these things happened to them as examples, and they were written for a warning to us upon whom the ends of the systems of things have come."-1 Corinthians 10:11.
"For all the things that were written beforehand were written for our instruction, so that through our endurance and through the comfort from the Scriptures we might have hope."-Romans 15:4.
Jehovah told us that he would leave a word from behind, that is his word in the Bible written in the past, to guide us if we would deviate from the path leading to life:
"And your own ears will hear a word behind you saying, “This is the way. Walk in it,” in case you should go to the right or in case you should go to the left."-Isaiah 30:21.
Doctrine and Covenants 129
4 When a messenger comes saying he has a message from God, offer him your hand and request him to shake hands with you.
5 If he be an angel he will do so, and you will feel his hand.
7 Ask him to shake hands with you, but he will not move, because it is contrary to the aorder of heaven for a just man to bdeceive; but he will still deliver his message.
8 If it be the adevil as an angel of light, when you ask him to shake hands he will offer you his hand, and you will not bfeel anything; you may therefore detect him.
As for God and the devil, if it inspires you to do good.
Sorry; this is a statement of my religion and is not intended to be proselytizing.
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Then why did he add The New Testament to the Old Testament?
His word obviously did change, when he added to scripture with the New Testament
that's OK, it was interesting
74x12
Well-Known Member
You have to learn to tell the difference in time. That's part of maturing in Christ. As you are new to being a Christian I would suggest you focus on the "milk of the Word" for now. That is get a solid foundation in the Bible and that way you'll be ready for "solid food". According to Heb. 5:14 solid food is for those who have learned how to tell good from evil. I emphasize learned because that's how it works. It does take time. As a new Christian we should take Ephesians 4:14 seriously that tells us not to be constantly changing our minds about what we believe. We should stick with the basics revealed in the Word of God and not constantly be changing our beliefs and doctrines. That's how people are often tossed back and forth by every wind of doctrine and so they're unstable.
Hebrews 5:14 Easy-to-Read Version (ERV)
14 But solid food is for people who have grown up. From their experience they have learned to see the difference between good and evil.
Ephesians 4:14 Easy-to-Read Version (ERV)
14 Then we will no longer be like babies. We will not be people who are always changing like a ship that the waves carry one way and then another. We will not be influenced by every new teaching we hear from people who are trying to deceive us—those who make clever plans and use every kind of trick to fool others into following the wrong way.
Through prayer you achieve the victory. There have been times when I was fully tricked by things but then I pray and I see through it. So pray for discernment, direction and a clear path for you to take. Pray for deception to be revealed for what it is. You can even pray scriptures like Psalm 72:14
Psalm 72:14
He shall redeem their soul from deceit and violence: and precious shall their blood be in his sight.
So God will save you from deceit if you trust in Him.
Finally remember these verses when dealing with spirits:
- Galatians 1:8 But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed.
- James 3:17 But the wisdom that is from above is first pure, then peaceable, gentle, and easy to be intreated, full of mercy and good fruits, without partiality, and without hypocrisy.
- 1 John 4:3 And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that spirit of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world.
- Ephesians 6:17 And take the helmet of salvation, and the sword of the Spirit, which is the word of God:
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Treasure Hunter
Well-Known Member
Here is the pattern:
We become a wolf, expand our agency and invite death into our house in order to conquer death. Then, retaining our wolf-ness, we become a sheep so that we can hear the voice of the Shepherd who will differentiate the heavenly from the satanic. A good sheep will follow the Shepherd anywhere, even to the slaughterhouse.
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Hermit Philosopher
Selflessly here for you
Dear Eddi
Your question worries me and, not that actually know anything about anything “satanic” but; I myself, always assess what I ”encounter” in the following way:
If it inspires me to approach what I come across in life in ways that contribute to deeper spiritual understanding, make me a more humble person and help me in helping others find more harmonious outlooks on their own circumstances, I tend to conclude that it’s okay.
If it does the opposite, I abandon it as it cannot lead really to any good.
Humbly
Hermit
MNoBody
Well-Known Member
according to the text that comes from, one knows them by their "Love", which each is expected to be able to discern, else they need to go back to basic training since they cannot tell a friend from a foe...are they drunk and on duty? or what?...just simple?
Neuropteron
Active Member
Hi,
"...test the inspired expressions...by this [you will know if it's from God] :Every inspired expression that confesses (agrees) Jesus Christ as having come in the flesh originates with God" ...otherwise it does not originate with God...this is the antichrist's inspired expressions."
The Hebrew scriptures were written in the time of ancient Israel and were for the benefit of those bound by the old covenant. But Israel did not keep God's commands and therefore became ineligible for the fulfillment of the prophesies in connection with Messiah's Kingdom....that of becoming "a kingdom of priests and a holy nation".
After their deliverance from Egypt, God told Moses to tell the Israelites....
"‘You have seen for yourselves what I did to the Egyptians, in order to carry you on wings of eagles and bring you to myself. 5 Now if you will strictly obey my voice and keep my covenant, you will certainly become my special property out of all peoples, for the whole earth belongs to me. 6 You will become to me a kingdom of priests and a holy nation.’ These are the words that you are to say to the Israelites.” (Exodus 19:4-6)
Only if they strictly obeyed their God would they see the fulfillment of those promises.....they failed to do so.
Actually God's word did not change at all because the Christian Greek scriptures or NT (written after the arrival of the Messiah) were an addition to the Hebrew (OT) texts to make up the "complete" word of God. Jesus himself used the Hebrew scriptures in his preaching. Just as the Hebrew scriptures were a written record of God's dealings with Israel, the Greek scriptures were a record of Jesus' preaching to the Jews initially, and after his death, the apostles took the 'good news' also to the Gentiles.
The Christians were under the "new covenant", (foretold in Jeremiah 31:31-32) introduced on the night before Jesus' death. All true Christians are now either parties or beneficiaries of the new covenant. The old covenant is no longer in force.
OK, so there was a point in which God's word wasn't complete, yet at the time everyone thought it was complete:
How then do we know that the NT completed God's word forever? Just as a pre-Christian Jew considered God's revelation to be complete in the OT and was mistaken, how then can we be sure that God's process of revelation isn't still on-going?
It's happened once, why not again?
How can you be sure that God's revelation is over? It has seemed over before!
My understanding is that the concept of heavenly and satanic is synonymous with a saintly person or one who commits evil actions. That’s on a human level.
On a divine level the true Heavenly Beings I believe are the Divine Educators such as Christ, Buddha, Muhammad, Krishna and Baha’u’llah Who sacrificed Their lives to bring love and unity to people.
Neuropteron
Active Member
Everyone who is sincere can use Bible truth to determine whom and what is from God and whom and what is from Satan. Thus Jesus said: "Sanctify them by means of the truth; your word is truth." (John 17:17)
The apostle paul noted some ways to differentiate between Godly and un-Godly beings and messages.
In his letter to the Galatians Paul noted:
"...even if we [the apostles] or an angel out of heaven were to declare to you as good news something beyond what we declared to you as good news, let him be accursed." (Galatians 1:7-9)
In his second letter to the Thessalonian congregation Paul identified "the lawless one's presence is according to every powerful work and lying signs and portents and with every unrighteous deception for those who are perishing, as a retribution because they did not accept the love of the truth that they might be saved." (2 Thessalonians 2:9, 10)
Another characteristic of Satan is that of adopting an outward appearance of holiness. The apostle Paul described counterfeit christians as "false apostles, deceitful workers, transforming themselves into apostles of Christ. And no wonder, for Satan himself keps transforming himself into an angel of light." (2 Corinthians 11:13-14)
The satanic agent or message is easily identified by making a comparison with the message with what is clearly written in God's Holy inspired Word. Thus the Berean congregation were commended as'noble-minded' because "they received the word with the greatest eagerness of mind, carefully examining the scriptures dauly as to whether these things were so." (Acts 17:11)
Following the apostles' death, history reveals the foretold uprising of a popular counterfeit 'christian' church with it's mysterious rites and unscriptural oppressive doctrines because they gradually adopted doctrines that were "beyond what is written" in God's word. (1 Corinthians 4:6-8)
In contrast, a messenger of God uses his personal name (Psalm 83:18) but does not adopt the name falsely as was popular in the days of Enoch (Genesis 4:26)
While sometimes using God's name satanic agents fear Jehovah because He is the supreme creator unparralled in strenght. Thus "the Name of Jehovah a Strong Tower; the righteous runneth into it, and is safe." (Prov. 18:10 AS)
When Jesus was tempted by Satan with distorted scriptures "Jesus said to him: "Go away, Satan! For it is written, "It is Jehovah your God you must worship, and it is to him alone you must render sacred service." Then the Devil left him." (Matthew 4:10, 11)
Thus God's own son did not venture beyond accurate application of scripture to distinguish truth.
The apostle paul noted some ways to differentiate between Godly and un-Godly beings and messages.
In his letter to the Galatians Paul noted:
"...even if we [the apostles] or an angel out of heaven were to declare to you as good news something beyond what we declared to you as good news, let him be accursed." (Galatians 1:7-9)
In his second letter to the Thessalonian congregation Paul identified "the lawless one's presence is according to every powerful work and lying signs and portents and with every unrighteous deception for those who are perishing, as a retribution because they did not accept the love of the truth that they might be saved." (2 Thessalonians 2:9, 10)
Another characteristic of Satan is that of adopting an outward appearance of holiness. The apostle Paul described counterfeit christians as "false apostles, deceitful workers, transforming themselves into apostles of Christ. And no wonder, for Satan himself keps transforming himself into an angel of light." (2 Corinthians 11:13-14)
The satanic agent or message is easily identified by making a comparison with the message with what is clearly written in God's Holy inspired Word. Thus the Berean congregation were commended as'noble-minded' because "they received the word with the greatest eagerness of mind, carefully examining the scriptures dauly as to whether these things were so." (Acts 17:11)
Following the apostles' death, history reveals the foretold uprising of a popular counterfeit 'christian' church with it's mysterious rites and unscriptural oppressive doctrines because they gradually adopted doctrines that were "beyond what is written" in God's word. (1 Corinthians 4:6-8)
In contrast, a messenger of God uses his personal name (Psalm 83:18) but does not adopt the name falsely as was popular in the days of Enoch (Genesis 4:26)
While sometimes using God's name satanic agents fear Jehovah because He is the supreme creator unparralled in strenght. Thus "the Name of Jehovah a Strong Tower; the righteous runneth into it, and is safe." (Prov. 18:10 AS)
When Jesus was tempted by Satan with distorted scriptures "Jesus said to him: "Go away, Satan! For it is written, "It is Jehovah your God you must worship, and it is to him alone you must render sacred service." Then the Devil left him." (Matthew 4:10, 11)
Thus God's own son did not venture beyond accurate application of scripture to distinguish truth.
Going by the words of the apostle Paul in 1 Corinthians 13, (which is a short chapter but with large content) we see that the apostles were expecting additional knowledge and prophesy from God, so that the partial knowledge they had would be complete...
He said....V 8-13....
"But if there are gifts of prophecy, they will be done away with; if there are tongues, they will cease; if there is knowledge, it will be done away with. 9 For we have partial knowledge and we prophesy partially, 10 but when what is complete comes, what is partial will be done away with. 11 When I was a child, I used to speak as a child, to think as a child, to reason as a child; but now that I have become a man, I have done away with the traits of a child. 12 For now we see in hazy outline by means of a metal mirror, but then it will be face-to-face. At present I know partially, but then I will know accurately, just as I am accurately known. 13 Now, however, these three remain: faith, hope, love; but the greatest of these is love."
So all the miraculous gifts of the spirit would give way to the more mature aspects of Christ's teachings, now founded more completely on "faith, hope and love" which are contained in the Christian scriptures.
Since the Revelation (the last prophesy in the Bible) takes us a thousand years into the future, what need is there for more at this juncture? We have all we need in the complete word of God.
Spiderman
Veteran Member
Beings that in Scripture God breaks his own rules and sins, then punishes people for doing lesser things like kill a man for picking up firewood on Sabbath, or God killing children, babies, and pregnant women like he does in the book of Genesis and elsewhere, or God boasting of how jealous he is when jealousy is one of the seven deadly sins, or God's racism, wrath, hatred, and cruelty, all in the Bible, I don't think there is anyway to discern a good spirit from a bad one.
I no longer know right from wrong because I am convinced that the world is as evil as God wants it to be and serial killers, disasters, and war are all to entertain God and test humankind.
I have met atheists and homosexuals who are a lot nicer than Yahweh.
Maybe there are demons who are also nicer than Yahweh. Maybe the Devil himself is nicer than Yahweh.
I'm not a Devil worshiper but am under the impression the devils do what God wants them to do.
I am a contender with God. The name Israel means "Contender with God". I find nothing more noble than to fight God. Jacob fought all night with God and won.
Moses stopped God from destroying Israel and saved a nation by fighting God.
If Moses just bent the knee to God's desires, over 95% of Jews would have been wiped off the planet.
Sometimes bending the knee and worshipping God is the cowards way and doesn't benefit humanity as much as contending with him.
I no longer know right from wrong because I am convinced that the world is as evil as God wants it to be and serial killers, disasters, and war are all to entertain God and test humankind.
I have met atheists and homosexuals who are a lot nicer than Yahweh.
Maybe there are demons who are also nicer than Yahweh. Maybe the Devil himself is nicer than Yahweh.
I'm not a Devil worshiper but am under the impression the devils do what God wants them to do.
I am a contender with God. The name Israel means "Contender with God". I find nothing more noble than to fight God. Jacob fought all night with God and won.
Moses stopped God from destroying Israel and saved a nation by fighting God.
If Moses just bent the knee to God's desires, over 95% of Jews would have been wiped off the planet.
Sometimes bending the knee and worshipping God is the cowards way and doesn't benefit humanity as much as contending with him.
I think Satan has been severley misunderstood
By the majority of people
And I'm not a Satan-worshipper either
I just don't think God is telling us the whole story
At least not right now
I believe he progressively reveals it, and that he's not yet done
And that at times it looks as though it's all been said, when it hasn't
Those are my beliefs.
The easiest way is just see if it lines up with the word of God.
The harder thing is to distinguish when a problem is natural or spiritual